Thanks, Coast Guard
We tend to “rib” the Coast Guard as “not really the military”. But the guys and gals there do have a dangerous, stressful mission. And when under DoD control during wartime, they often take casualties too.
During World War II, that happened quite a bit. One such instance occurred in Greenland during late 1942.
A US Army Air Corps B-17 was forced to land on the Greenland ice cap. There were survivors.
A Coast Guard crew of two – LT John Pritchard and RM1 Class Benjamin Bottoms – attempted to rescue the downed crew on consecutive days, flying a J2F-4 Grumman “Duck”. Appropriately, they were assigned to the cutter USS Northland at the time.
Rescue operations on 28 November 1942 went well, and rescued several of the downed B-17’s crew. However, the following day was different. The J2F-4 piloted by LT Pritchard crashed that day. Lost were LT Pritchard, RM1 Bottoms, and Army CPL Loren Howarth (one of the airmen from the downed B-17 that they were evacuating).
The location of the J2F-4 crash site was lost. Attempts were made to find it in 1975 in order to recover remains, but were unsuccessful.
However, further attempts last year located the site. This July, the USCG sent a team to attempt to recover the remains of LT Pritchard, RM1 Bottoms, and CPL Howarth. They have a weather “window” until early September in which to conduct recovery operations.
This article from the Navy Times gives more details. I’ll keep my eyes open and post an update if/as one becomes available.
And thanks, Coast Guard. For what you did then – and for what you’re doing today.
Category: Politics
While I was stationed in Hawaii in 2008 (OEF Theater support out of PACOM HQs at Camp Smith), USCG lost a helicopter crew when the helo crashed off the coast of Oahu while it was conducting SAR training. It struck us hard too because USCG families lived in the same military housing area as we did at Alamanu Military Reservation. They are indeed our military brothers and sisters, and their jobs are indeed just as dangerous as ours…
Hondo, just finished reading “Frozen in Time” buy Michael Zuckoff. It is all about the rescuing of the B-17 crew and the search for “The Duck”, which they found. I was disappointed that the book ended at when they found the Duck and had to leave but glad you posted this. I know now they are going to retrieve these heroes. The book is worth the read if anyone is interested. I really never thought about what a frozen hell Greenland is. Thanks!
And just so we remember… Signalman First Class Douglas A. Munro,USCG, Medal of Honor
http://www.mca-marines.org/leatherneck/munro-only-coast-guard-medal-honor-winner
I remember reading that during WWII, the Coast Guard actually had (proportionally to its size) the highest casualty rate of any of the services. Their main missions involved escorting convoys in the North Atlantic and operating landing craft during amphibious assaults, both of which were extraordinarily dangerous.
Chasing down and boarding drug boats is no joke either.
Gary, Hayabusa: no slam at out USCG brethren intended. They (and the rest of LE) have a job every bit as dangerous at times as does the military. Plus, the USSG’s rescue mission is also high-APF much of the time.
The USCG is an interesting “animal”, in that they straddle that “grey area” between LE and the military. During peacetime, they’re part of DHS and have both LE and public safety missions. However, when put under DoD control, they end up performing a truly military mission.
In short: in peacetime, one can argue they’re nonmilitary. When operating under DoD, they’re a uniformed military service like the “big 4” (USA/USN/USMC/USAF).
I don’t think of the modern Coast Guard as a military force. Just don’t. So sue me. Their contributions with respect to drug interdiction and sea rescue desrerve our admiration and appreciation more akin to that owed police and firefighters.
I was in both the Army and the USCG and I can testify that the Coasties are indeed a military force. The most amazing thing is that pre 9-11 they maintained a worldwide presence with a force that was smaller than the New York City Police Force (35K vs. 36K). SAR, LORAN chains world wide, Port Security, Marine Fisheries Enforcement, Marine Safety, Environmental Protection, Boating Safety, Drug Interdiction, Ice breaking, and Aids to Navigation maintenance to name a few. We have officers and chicken shit and we can’t quit the job when the shit hits the fantail. In peacetime we paint our boats and ships white with a big orange strip, in wartime we convert to haze gray. Or vessels armed and we have been known to fire them on occasion. In both peace and war we are subject to the UCMJ. Is that military enough for you?
Roger in Republic: by the book, the USCG is technically a “military service”. However, that IMO comes with a huge asterisk.
I put the USCG in the same category as NOAA and USPHSCC. They’re technically also US uniformed services – but until “chopped” to DoD, like USCG elements and personnel they also do not in general perform a military mission.
When not operating under DoD, USCG is part of DHS. For DHS, they perform a regulatory and/or maritime safety/LE mission. (There are exceptions, but the best I can tell they’re pretty damn rare.) When USCG personnel or units are “chopped” to support DoD, they come under DoD’s control and their assigned missions are in general military missions or support for same.
I believe the NOAA and USPHSCC are similar in that they have dual roles – I know that is true concerning the USPHSCC, and believe NOAA can be “chopped” to DoD during wartime as well.
YMMV.
NOAA and USPHSCC are not dual role in the same manner as the US Coast Guard is. Neither is established in any capacity as an Armed Forces of the United States. The term ‘‘Armed Forces’’ means the United States Army, Navy, Marine Corps, Air Force, and Coast Guard, including the reserve components thereof. Neither agency or government organization has an enlisted military or Noncommissioned Officer military fighting capability or rank structure. Military rank is limited to those holding a military commission appointment. From TITLE 38—UNITED STATES CODE VETERANS’ BENEFITS: § 101. Definitions (2) The term ‘‘veteran’’ means a person who served in the active military, naval, or air service, and who was discharged or released therefrom under conditions other than dishonorable. (10) The term ‘‘Armed Forces’’ means the United States Army, Navy, Marine Corps, Air Force, and Coast Guard, including the reserve components thereof. (21) The term ‘‘active duty’’ means— … (B) full-time duty (other than for training purposes) as a commissioned officer of the Regular or Reserve Corps of the Public Health Service (i) on or after July 29, 1945, or (ii) before that date under circumstances affording entitlement to ‘‘full military benefits’’ or (iii) at any time, for the purposes of chapter 13 of this title;… C) full-time duty as a commissioned officer of the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration or its predecessor organization the Coast and Geodetic Survey (i) on or after July 29, 1945, or (ii) before that date (I) while on transfer to one of the Armed Forces, or (II) while, in time of war or national emergency declared by the President, assigned to duty on a project for one of the Armed Forces in an area determined by the Secretary of Defense to be of immediate military hazard, or … (22) The term ‘‘active duty for training’’ means— .. (B) full-time duty for training purposes performed as a commissioned officer of the Reserve Corps of the Public Health Service (i) on or after July 29, 1945, or (ii) before that date under circumstances affording entitlement to ‘‘full military benefits’’, or (iii) at any time,… Read more »
I always tease my USCG counterparts, but I have the highest respect for those who would voluntarily roll out in the worst of weather to save some idiot who thought it would be cool to sail his boat into a storm or something else. IIRC, they have also deployed to the Gulf since Desert Shield, conducting some 60% of all US led MIO boardings with their LEDETs.
But they’re still puddle pirates 😉
Hondo, you must not be in the Coast Guard. We are part of the Military, we have been part of every war since 1812. We are not currently under the DOD for this latest Action. We do have a few men that are Seals, but we still have to preform our other duties, like Port Security, Marine Fisheries Enforcement, Marine Safety, Environmental Protection, Boating Safety, Drug Interdiction, Ice breaking, and Aids to Navigation maintenance.
@Hondo and 2/17; I respectfully direct your attention to the following United States Code: 14USC1 states, “The Coast guard as established January 28, 1915, shall be a MILITARY SERVICE and a branch of the ARMED FORCES of the United States at all times. The Coast Guard shall be a service in the Department of Homeland Security, except when operating as a service in the Navy.” Additionally, 14USC89(c) (Law Enforcement) establishes “special powers” insofar as it states, “The provisions of this section are IN ADDITION to any power conferred by law upon such officers, and NOT in limitation of any powers conferred by law upon such officers, or any other officers of the United States.” So, you don’t think the Coast Guard is a military service? Really? Seriously? I served with Coasties who spent time in both blue- and brown-water aspects in Vietnam. I personally was involved in Panama, Grenada, Desert Storm I and II, and pretty much every other little “brush fire” for the 29+ years I spent in Service. Just to make you feel that much LESS confident in your respective dumb-@$$ positions… in Addition to MOH winner SM1 Douglas A. Munro, I invite you to “google” DC3 Nate Brukenthal. He certainly give his “all”… Oh, and how about the ONLY non-Marine to ever command a Marine Corps unit… CDR Joe Rodriques (yup, go ahead an look him up as well). Then take your slack-@## attitudes down to the nearest Coast Guard Sta and APOLOGIZE to the on duty crew for insulting them and their Service… ITC (That’s an E-7 to you morons), USCG, Retired
Since I live near a freshwater inland sea (beeg Lake Michigan) that has tides, frequent pounding surf and has been known, along with Lake Superior, to sink shipping at a whim (think the Edmund Fitzgerald), I heartily disagree that the Coasties are nothing but puddle jumpers. They are part of the Navy Department.
They have a training regimen that requires jumping into freeeeeeezing cold water to rescue idiots who decide to take walks on the shoreline when Lake Michigan is at its worst.
They keep watch on the coastal boundaries, and not just so that Jesse Ventura can get into one of his paranoid conspiracy episodes.
Besides, I’d like to see any of you go out in a helicopter off the coast of Alaska when the snow is flying as thick as goose down just to rescue an old man who decided to go fishing and got stuck on an island because his rowboat stuck a leak.
I wouldn’t do that. Puddle pirates. 😛 PFfffffftttt!
Well I have award of the US Coast Guard Unit Commendation Medal with operational device and never served a day wearing anything but the Air Force Uniform.
This is my participation in the greatest maritime rescue in modern times. http://alaska.net/~jcassidy/prinsendam.htm
The mission is listed number two of the top ten rescues the Coast Guard has accomplished since it was established 4 August 1790 http://www.uscg.mil/lantarea/docs/USCG%20Top%2010%20Rescues.doc
It is also the rescue generating the first “official” recommendation the US Coast Guard establish a helicopter rescue swimmer program.
Except they’re not part of the Department of the Navy… except in times of war when directed by the President of the United States… other than that, kudos to you Ex-PH2.
@8, I had heard the same about US Army Infantryman, that there are more NYPD than Infantryman. I don’t know if that is true and I’m too lazy to Google it today.
@12, deep breaths and calm down. Nobody is talking bad about the Coast Guard.
CGSparky, as I was told in bootcamp, many, many centuries ago, the Navy Department has (or had) three branches: the Dept. of the Navy (US Navy), the USMarine Corps, and the US Coast Guard.
@14, isn’t that how they can act as LE without violating Posse Comitatis.
@Ex-PH2… you were lied to. The Coast Guard has never been in the Department of the Navy. During war, and only when directed by the President, they would OPERATE under the navy, but Treasury, Transportation, and Homeland Security have always “owned” them.
@15, deep breathing only makes you lightheaded when you’ve had to do it for nearly 30 years. Frustrates me (and nearly every other Coastie, past or present, at chowderheads who think they “know” it all. 7 UNIFORMED services (to address the USPHS and NOAA comments above), of which 5 are MILITARY, of which only 1 is NOT DoD. And, yes, that is why the Coast Guard does NOT fall under Posse Comitatus. BTW, USPHS is doctors, and who would have NOAA in a war zone… they are only made up of uniformed Officers and civilian contract crewmen… wow!
CGSparkey: chill, Chief. No one’s denigrating the Coast Guard.
You’re certainly entitled to your opinion. As I am to mine, actually. You’re talking “by the book”. I’m talking as a matter of day-to-day practice.
You might also want to re-read my comments above – specifically, comment 9. I’ll quote part of it for you.
“. . . by the book, the USCG is technically a “military service”.”
The “book” in this case is Federal law. Yes, the USCG qualifies as military – technically. In actual practice, virtually all of the USCG’s operations today are LE, public safety, or regulatory enforcement.
I have a great deal of respect for what the USCG does on a day-to-day basis. But I have the same degree of respect for most LE, public safety, and other 1st responders.
By the way, Chief: the NOAA’s predecessor organization was given commissions as a Federal uniformed service precisely so that they would not be considered spies when deployed to a war zone and captured while performing their duties. And if I recall correctly, the USPHS can be directed to fill military vacancies during wartime.
Hondo, so what you are saying is that the Law and your opinion differ. Okay, I’ll accept that you are incorrect. oh, by the way, this is straight from the NOAA website: “… both officer and civilian, do not work hand-in-hand with the military, nor do they deploy to war zones or carry weapons.” As for the USPHS, they are a medical corps, NOT a military service. Dude, you reached too far for that! So I guess that pretty much clears that up. Now, back to the Coast Guard. Combining all the DoD military services, less than 12% are actually deployed to an acive combat zone PERFORMING MILITARY MISSIONS. The rest are on stand down, or training, etc. This compares to the More than 10% of Coast Guard personnel currently deployed or PERFORMING MILITARY MISSIONS. So, I guess that, by your definition, The Army, Navy, Marine Corps, and Air force are not military services… they are TRAINING services! (Don’t tell the Marines that!) So, mister “training service” guy, please pick up your toys and go home. You are operationally unable to admit you are incorrect, refuse to acknowledge that, and then talk out of both sides of your mouth about respect. Sir, I have NO respect for persons of your ilk. Good day.
Sparky, did they issue that chip on your shoulder or did you build it up all on your own? You are proud of your service and your Service – don’t tarnish that by being an ass.
@20 CGSparky… dude, why the hell do you have such thin skin? You Coasties have been given high praise and kudos from the original article to all the comments! Pound it up your fantail and get over yourself.
A NOAA employee can tell his boss “I’m not going to cross that bar in twenty five foot breakers in a 44 foot boat. You can go screw yourself if you think I am”. The worst that can happen to him is the loss of his job. If a Coasty tried that he would end up in the brig, busted, with a DD to show for his service. I don’t care what the law says, you can’t get any more military than that. Do NOAA people earn VA benefits? No. Do Public health officers get DD-214’s? I don’t think so.
If the Coast Guard was just another government agency, as you propose, we would have a union, like the TSA or the IRS. Think about that.
True most our missions are humanitarian in nature, but we carry them out in a military manner. The official designation of the Coast Guard is, “A small band of dedicated professionals, whom the Navy rallies round in time of war”
PS I can swim. I have been in water that was over my head. I have been upside down strapped to a 44 ft MLB in the surf, on a SAR mission. I am proud of my seven years of Coast Guard service, just as I am of my four years in the regular Army.
So the next time your boat engine quits, it’s blowing forty knots from the SSE, you’re taking on water and sinking fast. call a COP!
PFM: I guess everybody has issues about which they have little sense of humor or tolerance for differing opinion. In some people occasionally that leads to the equivalent of a verbal temper tantrum on meeting someone who expresses a different opinion.
As to whether or not you “respect” me or not, CGSparky – frankly, that’s a matter of concern for you and your ulcer. There’s a reasonably short list of people on this earth about whose respect I care. You’re not on it.
In any case, your service with the Coast Guard was honorable, and I commend you for it. Perhaps one day you’ll get over being as damn bitter as you seem above.
Coasties have their own job to do. Honorable, commendable and necessary. Don’t try comparing dicks with the Army,Navy, Air Force or Marines. You’ll come up short on that one.
Mostly you are Customs and Immigration on water, with search and rescue, boating safety, Weather reports and Drug interdiction thrown in.
If the shit hits the fan you’ll be there to lend a hand. Its not about just being out “deployed” its where you deploy and how dangerous it is. Since WW2 only 8 Coasties have been killed in action. Not taking away from their sacrifice but they aren’t put in harm’s way like the DOD services.
In reference to the “military” aspect of the USCG, there is one thing that, to me, defines a military service more than anything else….the jurisdiction of the Manual for Courts Martial. The USCG is specifically defined in the MCM2012 as an “armed service” and, as such, subject to the UCMJ while on active duty. Any crime committed onboard a military installation and not involving anyone other than someone subject to the UCMJ is investigated by the USCG; if the crime is committed off base or involved other non-USCG personnel, the FBI gets to make a determination as to whether they will process. This is pretty much the same with the other services, if I understand the process correctly.
Chief, you’ve got to lighten up. We all tease each other all the time about this or that. None of us are making any attempt to denigrate the honorable service the USCG provides this nation in time of peace or war.
I was in a PSU which is a reserve only unit that is pretty much always under the Navy when we deploy. In 2004, we were in Shuaiba port Kuwait operating under a Navy Harbor Defense Command. We did water side and land side force protection for ships offloading at the port. We also had a detachment on the Iraqi oil platforms near Um Quasar until that security was taken over by locals. Shortly after we turned over security on the platforms, one of our guys was killed when trying to board a small boat that was approaching the platforms at night. The boat detonated explosives on board and killed him and 2 (I think) Navy guys. The team on the platform (locals) engaged the other boats which detonated before they got close enough to do much damage. We think they just committed suicide instead of trying to fight through the fire to get to the platforms.
CGSparky: you might want to consult Federal law regarding the status of the NOAA and PHSCC. It’s a bit more authoritative and complete than their respective websites.
Regarding the NOAA, though they are not normally a part of the military during peacetime, Federal law explicitly allows the POTUS to direct some/all of the NOAA’s ships/personnel/facilities be transferred to one of the military departments when doing so would be in the nation’s best interests (see 33 USC 3061). Similarly, 42 USC 217 provides the authority for the POTUS to declare the PHSCC a military service under like circumstances.
That was precisely the point of my statement in comment 9 regarding the NOAA and PHSCC. Both are uniformed, non-military Federal services in peacetime. Both can, by Presidential Order, be brought into the military literally overnight.
Further: while neither NOAA nor PHSCC personnel receive a DD214, they do receive an analogous discharge document (NOAA Form 56-16 or PHS Form 1867) on leaving their service. The VA also considers honorably discharged former members of both NOAA and PHSCC to be veterans for the purposes of VA benefits provided they otherwise meet statutory service criteria.
Roger in Republic: Once the POTUS has declared NOAA and/or PHSCC (in whole or in part) military and placed them under a MILDEP, affected individuals in each service (NOAA, PHSCC) fall under the jurisdiction of the UCMJ under 10 USC 802a.(8). Thus, a NOAA employee can indeed tell his supervisor to go pound sand without going to jail – but only prior to Presidential declaration of that service (or part thereof) as military and its assignment to a MILDEP. Afterwards, that individual would be subject to the UCMJ for doing the same.
My name is Luis Mary i live in California, and i got married four months ago.My husband and i have been living a very happy and lovely life.so as time went on, i began to notice this strange attitude that he was possessing.He was now going out with other girls, to the extent that he was no longer picking up my calls, and he was not even sleeping at home anymore. I became confused and didn’t know what to do anymore.So i became worried and stranded, that brought so many thoughts into my mind, because i have never experienced a thing like this before in my life.So i decided to visit a spell caster, to see if he can help me out.So immediately i went to the internet, where i saw an amazing testimony of a spell caster who brought someone’s ex lover back, “great cocoma” so i contacted him immediately and i explained to him all my problems and he told me that it will be very easy for him to solve, compare to the ones that he has done.and he also gave me some proof to be really sure of his work, and he assured me that my husband will come back to me immediately he is through with the spell casting.and also he told me to put all my trust in him, and i really obeyed him.So it was 8:00 am on the next morning, when i was about going to work, when i received my husband’s call, and he told me that he was coming back home,when he came back he started apologized to me, and told me that he is very sorry for the pain that he has cost me.He really came back home, and that was how we continued our marriage with lots of love and happiness, and our love was now stronger than how it were before.And he also told me that once my heart desire has been granted unto me that i should go and testify of his work right here on the internet. Right now i am the happiest woman on… Read more »
@29 Don’t tell me Nikki Lozada rode a dolphin in and cast a spell of Rainbows and Jellybeans and fixed it all. You became a Kung fu master at the same time.
Uh, Luis Mary, you want to go to http://www.witchvox.com/
This is a milblog, not a witches’ blog. Run along, or I’ll set Bast-et on your trail.
Great! Next time we have an issue which needs to be solved out we have a contact. Always good to make new friends.
Bless his heart.
@33, 34, & 35, y’all need to quit guzzling bong water and GET A LIFE!!
Proud Infidel’s comment above refers to spam that has been removed.
For all you skeptics out there the Coast Guard is full militery. Google Operaton Market time, Vietnam the mission to stop the flow of men and materials from North Vietnam to South Vietnam and read about the twenty-six 82 foot patrol boats attached to Squadron 1 patrolling rivers and inner coastline, thirty High Endurance Cutters patrolling inner and outer coastline and providing Navel gunfire attached to Squadron 3 and four 180 foot bouy tenders that set and maintained aids to navigation as well as patrols and gunfire. In addition to the Cutters the Coast Guard provided port security and Explosive load detachments in Vietnam and also provided helicopter rescue pilots and provided LORAN navigation for the fighting forces. Coastie’s served from 1965 – 1975 supporting the war and were involved in to many missions to describe here. Over 8,000 Coast Guardsmen served in Vietnam during the war. Do some research and be amazed at what these Coasties did. 7 paid the ultimate sacrifice, 1 MIA (remains recovered 30 years later) and 53 wounded. 2 books were written and one DVD was produced and are availed at Amazon.com. I know all this to be true as I am one of those Coasties having served in Squadron 3 aboard the Cutter Chase WHEC 718, 1969 – 1970.
For all you skeptics out there the Coast Guard is full militery. Google Market time, Vietnam the mission to stop the flow of men and materials from North Vietnam to South Vietnam and read about the twenty-six 82 foot boats attached to Squadron 1 patrolling rivers and inner coastline, thirty High Endurance Cutters patrolling inner and outer coastline and providing Navel gunfire attached to Squadron 3 and four 180 foot bouy tenders that set and maintained aids to navigation as well as patrols and gunfire. In addition to the Cutters the Coast Guard provided port security and Explosive load detachments in Vietnam and also provided helicopter rescue pilots and provided LORAN navigation for the fighting forces. Coastie’s served from 1965 – 1975 supporting the war and were involved in to many missions to describe here. Over 8,000 Coast Guardsmen served in Vietnam during the war. Do some research and be amazed at what these Coasties did. 7 paid the ultimate sacrifice, 1 MIA (remains recovered 30 years later) and 53 wounded. 2 books were written and one DVD was produced and are availed at Amazon.com. I know all this to be true as I am one of those Coasties having served in Squadron 3 aboard the Cutter Chase WHEC 718, 1969 – 1970.
There was at least two Coast Guard helicopter pilots detailed to Air Force to fly CSAR in Vietnam/Laos on Air Force helicopters.
Also: In 2003, Boutwell participated in the Iraqi conflict. Boutwell valiantly defended the oil terminals off the coast of Iraq and Iran. reference: http://www.uscg.mil/pacarea/cgcboutwell/history.asp