Weekend Open Thread-Purging the U.S. Capitol of Religious References?

| June 14, 2019

US Capitol. (visitthecapitol.gov)

You’re familiar with the movement to remove Confederate Soldier statues and other related references. Before that, and still ongoing, is the movement to remove religious references from government and public spaces.

Perhaps it’s a good thing that many of them aren’t familiar with history.

Let’s take the U.S. Capitol for example. The word “Capitol” comes from the Latin words “Capitolium” and “capitolinus”. This described the most important temple of the Roman Empire, the Temple of Jupiter Optimus Maximus. On some occasions, the name extended to include the hill it was on.

Many folks would dismiss the connection between the U.S. Capitol and the Temple of Jupiter. An understanding of history actually makes a strong argument for the connection.

The Ancient Romans occasionally used Jupiter’s temple as a place to make law. Most of the times, they used a “Curia”.  A curia had rooms for both making law and for worship and religious ceremony.

The first connection, Jupiter.

The Old Testament doesn’t provide a detailed description of God. In fact, God goes out of his way to be obscure and anonymous, even when interacting with humans. Yet, people have an image of him sporting white hair and a beard.

This was a carryover from the time the Romans accepted Christianity. This image is an echo of Jupiter/Zeus. God sitting on a throne? Echo of Jupiter/Zeus sitting on a throne.

The first syllable of “Jupiter” is an echo of an ancient word for “God”. The last two syllables is an echo of an ancient word for “father”. However, used in the format used by the ancients, we don’t get “God Father” but “Father God”. With “Optimus Maximus” added to the name, we have “Father God, best and greatest”. As the “sky god,” that made him “heavenly father”… Ergo, “Heavenly father, best and greatest”.

Thus, the ancient practice of identifying and “merging” similar gods was easy for the Romans to do when Christianity became their official religion.

The second connection, building design.

The US Capitol not only has chambers for making law but a room for prayer. They also have a chaplain. Very similar in design to the “Curia”, the place that Roman senators created law. The Capitol’s entrances are echoes of the entrances of Jupiter’s temple. The Dome is also a religious/Christian symbol.

The references to Jupiter, here, are actually references to the Christian God. Our founders were history buffs and saw the connections. Those involved with the design of the Capitol were also familiar with this history.

The third connection, the philosophy of the founders.

When reading the arguments of the founders, one would find references to “the laws of God” and to “the laws of nature”. Both of these were linked and were used to justify the argument that our rights came from above, and can’t simply be taken without due process.

Once those on the left discover this, would they advocate changing the Capitol’s design?

Disclaimer: the above is an argument from a historical perspective. Not an attempt to convert anybody.

 

 

Category: Open thread, Politics

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The Stranger

FIRST

The Stranger

Woo Hoo!
My First First!
Take that, Space Coyote!

PRIMERO!

*Dances around like a drunk Engineer*

AnotherPat

The King of Battle is gonna come get you, Pappy…*Smile*

Congrats!

Cassions Keep Rollin Along

The Stranger

Hey, I did like a good Engineer and went old school, tunneled under the fortifications, and then popped out, like “Bam!” You can’t hit what you can’t see!

The Stranger

And, I posted this on the Flag Day/Birthday thread, but here we go again, in honor of the Redlegs (Splash Over, Splash Out!):

Over hill, over dale
As we hit the dusty trail,
And those caissons go rolling along.
In and out, hear them shout,
Counter march and right about,
And those caissons go rolling along.

Refrain:
Then it’s hi! hi! hee!
In the field artillery,
Shout out your numbers loud and strong,
For where e’er you go,
You will always know
That those caissons go rolling along.

In the storm, in the night,
Action left or action right
See those caissons go rolling along
Limber front, limber rear,
Prepare to mount your cannoneer
And those caissons go rolling along.

Refrain

Was it high, was it low,
Where the hell did that one go?
As those caissons go rolling along
Was it left, was it right,
Now we won’t get home tonight
And those caissons go rolling along.

Refrain

AnotherPat

SECOND.

GO ARMY. BEAT NAVY.

HAPPY 244TH BIRTHDAY, US ARMY!

Hondo

Welcome back, AP. Doing better, I presume?

AnotherPat

Thank You for asking, Hondo…😊

Just going thru some medical issues right now that hopefully will be fixed next week…(it has not been fun)..

At least the liquid diet I was on in a Military Hospital was not bad. 😉 Hope it will be the same next week!

Thank You again for asking…and for serving our Country as a US Army Soldier on our 244th Birthday.

😎

Thunderstixx

Take care AP. God be with you.

AnotherPat

Thank you, Thunderstixx…God’s Blessing to you as well!

One of these days, will visit Alaska again (lived at Fort Wainwright as an Army Brat, did a couple of TDYs at Fort Greely, Wainwright and Richardson….if only folks knew about the challenges with “The State Bird”…*smile*)

Thank you for always sharing with us your adventures as a Ski Instructor… Snow Ski instructor that is…!

Happy 244th Birthday!

🙂

AnotherPat

God Bless You as Well,Thunderstixx!

Thank You so much!

And Thank You for sharing your Ski Instructor stories with us What a cool job to have as a Soldier!

It has been a while since I’ve been to Greely, Wainwright and Richardson, but I do know this:

I don’t miss the State Bird…😉

Enjoy your weekend!

The Stranger

*Looks at microphone*
*Tap Tap Tap*
Is this thing on?

AnotherPat

All of us Army folks are out celebrating….

*Smile*

26Limabeans

And waving flags.
Congrats to The Stranger.

The Stranger

Yeah, rub it in. I gotta work and write a 5 page paper.

The Stranger

Almost done with the paper. I’ll finish it tomorrow and do next week’s paper tomorrow and Sunday! I’ll hoist a couple of cold Yuengling lagers 🍺 and toast the United States Army!

This We’ll Defend

Jeff LPH 3, 63-66

EIGHTH

Claw

And in other news we’ll never hear the end of:

I made the wrong call this past January because Big Army chose the Cannon-Cocker over the Grunt and DAT to be the next SMA.

(At least it wasn’t e-9 Carrot Top/s)

Now we’ll just have to wait and see if my call about the SEAC job turns out right.

AnotherPat

Claw…

You said the Bad word…”SEAC”….

Funny how we in the Army managed to survive without having a SEAC…IMHO, a worhtless position..

And I doubt Killer’s Enable will correct his NDSM…what a joke…how long have his crickets been chirping since that post on Killer?

*smile*

BTW…On the Army’s 244th Birthday, THANK YOU for remembering those MFO Soldiers who lost their lives in the Gander Incident. I served 14 months in the Sinai with the MFO (after 1985) and have never forgotten those 101st Soldiers (that is one of the reasons I have a problem with folks wearing UNAUTHORIZED BullWinkle Badges).

Sorry you lost your running Buddy.

Thanks for being the Supply Daddy.

Claw

As of today, it has now been 1,244 days that the crickets have been chirping since the final 1stSEAC Sock Puppet Report.

Thank You/You’re Welcome for the acknowledgement about Andy/Supply Daddy.

Speaking of Supply related stuff, one of these days when a post is made to TAH about Big Government overspending, I’ll do a little write-up/comment about the $660.00 Red Devil Putty Knife (part of a Bradley Fighting Vehicle’s BII) or the $5000.00 Mud Flaps for the M1 Abrams./smile

AnotherPat

Claw…you are welcome…

LOL on 1,244 days!

And yes, looking forward in reading you sharing with us about that Putty Knife and those Mud Flaps…

*smile*

AnotherPat

BTW, for all those who are not familiar with the term “Bullwinkle Badge”:

The Bullwinkle Badge is a nickname for the Air Assault Badge.

Only those who successfully complete US Army Air Assault School can rightfully WEAR it.

“The wearing of the Air Assault Badge on Army uniforms is governed by DA PAM 670-1, “Guide to the Wear and Appearance of Army Uniforms and Insignia.” Under this DA PAM, the Air Assault Badge is defined as a Group 4 precedence special skill badge which governs its wear in relation to other combat and special skill badges and tabs. The basic eligibility criteria for the badge consist of satisfactory completion of an air assault training course in accordance with the United States Army Training and Doctrine Command’s standardized Air Assault Core Program of Instruction or completion of a standard Air Assault Course while assigned or attached to the 101st Airborne Division (Air Assault) since 1 April 1974.”

Those who dare wear the Badge or have it in a shadow box without attending the course are dishonering those 101st Soldiers who lost their lives in 1985 in the Gander incident as well as insulting those who went thru the Course.

rgr769

What, no Bullwinkle for those of us that Air Assault by OJT in the Viet of the Nam? Cuz we had to master that process, as it was the primary means of getting into and out the bush, even for leg infantry divisions like the 4th and the Americal. Rule One of Air Assault: You and your troopers better quickly learn how to organize your men into chalks (appropriately sized helicopter loads based on how many the helo crews say they can carry on that sorty). Heard a story once about some Koreans who screwed that up and left two men all by their lonesome in bad guy country after the last lift departed the LZ.

rgr769

Oops. Forgot “learned” Air Assault by OJT.

AnotherPat

rgr769: Have read articles as well as Army Board of Correction documents where Vietnam Veterans of the 101st Airborne Division and 1st Cavalry Division sought retroactive award of the Air Assault Badge for their training and pioneering experience in combat, but the Army has yet to grant their request. There used to be a Commenter on TAH who was assigned to the HHC, 501st Signal as well as the HHC & Band, 101st Support Group, both units falling under the 101st in Vietnam as a 31L20, Field Radio Relay Equipment Repairman. He thought he was entitled to wear the Air Assault Badge since he claimed he took SERTS while assigned with those 101st Support Groups/501st Signal. In 1984, he wrote to the Commandant of the Air Assault School at Campbell, thinking he was entitled to the Bullwinkle Badge based on an article he read either in the Army Times or The Army magazine. He claims the School sent him a Certificate making him an “Honorary Air Assault Soldier”. He said they mailed him the Badge. He has worn that Badge on Civilian clothes, Scottish Tartan attire, a Santa Claus suit, a Cowboy outfit as well as wearing the Blue Infantry Cord and Green Leadership tabs. He also has the Badge and cord in his shadowbox. I questioned him about the Bullwinkle Badge. He admitted he never went to Air Assault School. I think you know who I am talking about. It has just been disturbing to me that he commented… Read more »

The Stranger

Those of us who have been around know who you are talking about. Since you had the courtesy to not call him out by name, I won’t either. He seemed ok most of the time but then he’d say something that would make me want to reach through the screen and choke him. Oh well, at least he didn’t go down the Bernath-WiTgEnFeLd route…

SFC D

Some amazingly racist things would come out of that guy sometimes. I still see him pop up on another site now and then.

A Proud Infidel®™️

Yeah, I remember reading a few of those comments while thinking “Does he REALLY believe what he is saying?!”. I also hope that one day he finds peace with himself.

rgr769

Actually, my MOS was 71542, during my time in RVN. That is airborne infantry small unit leader. But in my five months in my Ranger company I rappelled out of helos, was pulled through the canopy with a STABO rig, and was trained on the use of our rope ladder system. My comment was somewhat in jest, as I have enough badges, tabs and combat patches. That is why I find guys like our radio wrencher sporting the Bullwinkle and the blue cord so humorous, since the REMFs even in the 101st rarely rode a Huey anywhere, let alone trained on how to conduct airmobile operations. Whereas, those of us in leg rifle companies had to conduct airmobile ops on a regular basis, without any special training. I finished my career as a Special Forces officer over 40 years ago.

AnotherPat

Thank you to rgr769, Pappy and SFC D for the info and to rgr769 for his MOS clarification (my apologies for the error!)

There have actually been times I have felt sorry for that TAH Commentator, but when he crossed the line in making insensative remarks such as the victims of the Las Vegas shooting should have been in Church instead of being at a concert or making unnecessary racial comments, then my commpassion was turned off.

He was being TOO forthright with his personal feelings on issues…IMHO, I felt he should have kept those feelings to himself. There is a time and place for everything.

It also bugged me that he was critical of others when it came to STOLEN VALOR issues, when ironically, he was wearing unauthorized items on civilian clothes.

I am not a better person than him, so will leave it at this: I hope oneday he finds peace with himself.

Thank You again for sharing.

rgr769

Thanks for your service to this great nation and your comments on this site. Your ‘puter links are invariably spot on. Hope you rapidly heal/recuperate. Nobody deserves hospital food for long.

AnotherPat

thebesig commented:

“…Before that, and still ongoing, is the movement to remove religious references from government and public spaces.”

Next thing that may happen is reprinting of US Currency…”In God We Trust”…and the changing of the Pledge of Allegiance…

I respect all Faiths. I respect those who do not have a Faith in a Higher Being. We are all different.

That said, I am not ashamed to say that I believe in the Bibical God and hold true to the Bible Verse 2 Chronicles 7:14:

“If my People, which are called by My Name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek My face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from Heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.”

History IS important…unfortunately, we don’t learn from it….how many Empires have crashed because of folks turning away from God?

Too many. I hope and pray it does not happen to our Nation…

justmytwopennies

Graybeard

Amen.

SFC D

Present! Happy birthday, Army! This message brought to you by the United States Army Signal Corps, where we do it till our gigahertz!

26Limabeans

Our symbol is a crossed screwdriver and condom with the motto “if we can’t fix it fuck it”

AnotherPat

Am sure there is a NSN for the Screwdriver (depending what type), but not sure there is one for condoms…(Class XIII item?)

Only our TAH Supply Daddy knows….😉

beansandbullets

SFC D

NSN 6515-00-117-8416
NSN 6515-01-266-3802

Hondo

Those seem to check out (replace ####-##-###-#### in the following URL with the NSNs above):

https://www.armyproperty.com/nsn/####-##-###-####

Unfortunately, the URL doesn’t indicate if the unit of issue is EA, BX, or CS. And they’re almost certainly made by the lowest bidder, so caveat emptor. (smile)

Claw

The ordering unit of issue is a PG. Within the PG you get 48 foil wrapped smaller packs of three each individuals, for a grand total of 144.

Funny thing, though. The shelf life on the older FSN/NSN is 60 months, while the newer 01 NSNed Condom shelf life is 36 months.

So, like Hondo said, “Buyer/User Beware!”/smile

11B-Mailclerk

You could order a crate of 288, but that would be too gross

Claw

Hee Hee!! I see what you did there.

Hondo

It would also be two PGs – which I thought those things were supposed to prevent. (smile)

Dennis - not chevy

Back when I was a medic in Korea; we’d give out condoms like halloween candy. All you had to do was stop by the clinic tent and grab all you wanted. We placed them on a piece of cardboard labelled small, medium, large, and extra-large just to see who’d take what. The joke was they were all the same size.
I think they are a class VI item.

AnotherPat

Dennis-not chevy:

I almost out of humor wrote that condoms were a Class VI item, but thought “Nah…no one would get the joke…”

Hilarious what you all did in Korea…those poor Troops..😆👏👏

The Stranger

Believe me, on this forum, we’d get the joke. Also, I’d have to say those would be a Class VI item, except now, thanks to General Order 1A, we wouldn’t get to use them for anything except try to make balloon animals!

11B-Mailclerk

Gas station rest room graffiti-

“Don’t buy gum from this machine. It tastes bad.”

The Stranger

There are dudes that I’ve known who would be dumb enough to write that because they actually did think it was gum! The phrase “rock with lips” comes to mind.

Wilted Willy

You forgot the first part of that motto, We won’t fight and you can’t make us, if we can’t fix it, FucK It!!!

26Limabeans

I would like to thank the people responsible for transporting a couple hundred unvetted “asylum seekers” to Portland Maine. It has caused Senators Collins and King to freak out and demand “answers” to the immigration (invasion) problem.
Mayor Ethan Strimling is thrilled and has just announced his bid for reelection.
“Portland”, it’s not just for Oregon.

The Stranger

Yeah, kind of like any town named Lodi is not a place you want to be. I’ve been through both Lodi, CA and Lodi, NJ.

26Limabeans
The Stranger

Tesla’s “Unplugged” version from the “ Five Man Acoustic Jam” is pretty darn good, too. Saw them perform that song back in ‘04.

rgr769

Lodi, CA is quite a nice little town, as I recall. But you don’t want to stop just down the road in Stockton after the sun goes down. According to news reports, there are about half a dozen shootings every night.

Thunderstixx

Then there’s the real Lodi, Wisconsin and the launching point for the great Lake Wisconsin and Okee, the liquor store capital of Wisconsin !!!

Commissioner Wretched

My sister lives in Lodi, Wisconsin. I love that area. Lake Wisconsin can be beautiful!

AW1Ed

Tell it to the folks in Lewiston, but I doubt they’ll have much sympathy.

26Limabeans

Lewiston is a Somali enclave.
The latest group is not welcome there.
Hell, I’m not welcome there and my grandparents family farm next door in Greene was lost in the depression.
It was a Textile Mill town. French and Irish from Quebec and Nova Scotia settled there and made it a great place to live.
Now it is a third world shit hole enclave.
Thank you Bill Clinton.

AW1Ed

I have friends who pretty much homesteaded at the Naval Air Station and lived in Lewiston- been there many times during my tour there. It’s criminal what happened there.

A Proud Infidel®™️

Goes to show what happens when you let do-gooder libtards introduce their version of “diversity” which will turn pretty much anywhere into a smelly shithole.

AnotherPat

To All My Fellow TAH US Army Soldiers on our 244th Birthday.

Rest In Peace, Jonn:

Haywire Angel

Happy weekend everyone!!

Ret_25X

Interesting post. Mostly incorrect, but interesting.

It is not possible that a language that originates in the 100s bc is the source of a language that was already almost 500 years old at that point.

Also, the founders would have also known the concept of capitol from Greek…another language that predates Latin by hundreds of years and from which the concept of both jupiter and capitol are taken.

The roots of the hellenic concepts come from older sources than even that…but why confuse everyone with the facts of Mediterranean trade circa 1200BC? Hint: it includes a nation which controlled ports at the eastern end of the Med…a nation that had its capitol in Jerusalem.

If we are going to use ahistorical speculation, why not attempt to show how DC is actually the last home of the Templars and the Illumminati designed it through the Masons? Yes, that is from an actual book.

10thMountainMan

Wow you are incredibly uneducated. Constantine merged gods? Mohammed merged gods? And “Zeus literally meant god?” Are you fucking serious? If Zeus literally meant God then why didn’t Paul just say that when he went to the Rock of Ares?

If Zeus literally meant God the way the West and the Jews and the Muslim mean God then how did the Christians merge in Cronus the father of Zeus. And Cronus was the babiest Titan. And I don’t have to put on some big bullshit air of learning like you and claim to have read great volumes over decades. I just looked it up in a copy of Bulfinch’s mythology that I have here on the shelf.

What book have you been reading this dumb shit from? Let me guess, the title has “.COM” in it.

Dipshit.

Roh-Dog

Have a great weekend y’all!
Happy Birthday to my fellow Soldiers!! Stay strong! (Or whatever it is this week)

Commissioner Wretched

Damn … work gets in the way every week now, it seems. The coveted “First” in the WOT may never be mine again. Sigh. So I console myself with this week’s trivia column. I hope you enjoy it! DID YOU KNOW…? Was the cartoon character of Betty Boop based on a real person? By Commissioner Wretched Do you know what starts in just over a week? Summer! Yeah, I know … summer unofficially started at Memorial Day weekend, and it unofficially ends Labor Day weekend. That’s when most folks figure summer, anyway. But the summer solstice itself – the actual longest day of the year – is June 21st, or next Friday (for those keeping score at home). And that, of course, means vacations. You probably have your favorite vacation spots – beaches, mountains, or what have you. I also have my favorite. I don’t go to beaches any more … not since some silly kids decided it would be fun to try to push me back into the water while yelling, “Beached whale!” Somebody ought to slap those kids. I can never seem to get my flipper around where I can do it. Now I enjoy going to the mountains, though I do have to wear orange outfits so hunters won’t confuse me with a moose. I hope that, wherever your vacation plans take you, you’ll take the trivia from this little column along with you. Speaking of trivia, let’s get to it! Did you know … … Sir… Read more »

AnotherPat

CW:

Reference Betty Boop:

Have you seen the movie “National Lampoon’s Christmas Vacation?”

In the movie, Aunt Bethany, the one who brought the Griswalds a “Cat In a Box” as a Christmas present as well as providing Green Jello with Cat Food for dinner and “Saying Grace/The Blessing” was played by MAE QUESTEL, who was best known for providing the ORIGINAL VOICE for Betty Boop and Oliver Oyl.

Ironically, her “Blessing” is the Pledge of Allegiance…for today, Flag Day, 14 June 2019.

And now you know….

Thank you for the Trivia!

Commissioner Wretched

I love me some Mae Questel! I did know that she was the voice of Betty … and it’s a great tie-in to “Christmas Vacation,” probably the best of the series. Thank you!

The Stranger

Yeah, Chevy Chase’s rant was epic!😂🤣😅

A Proud Infidel®™️

TOP FORTY and Honorary First once again.

((((OVER))))

Sapper3307

Over 100 Golden Retrievers just rescued in N.H. I have submitted my paper work.

26Limabeans

That’s a lot of tennis balls.

Veritas Omnia Vincit

Neither the money nor the pledge had the words Under God or In God We Trust prior to the commie scare of the 1950s…somehow we beat the Nazis and the Japs without those words on our money or in our pledge…

I’m sure we’ll be okay if they are taken back out again like they were before the 1950s.

I could go on an on I suppose, but it’s Friday and I’d rather be sailing. Have a great weekend folks and enjoy yourselves however is appropriate for you and be safe.

AnotherPat

VOV:

You commented:

“Neither the money nor the pledge had the words Under God or In God We Trust prior to the commie scare of the 1950s…”

I pulled out my coin collections. Those coins dated before 1950 had “In God We Trust” on them.

I’m talking old coins as well…Liberty Half Dollars. Mercury Dimes. Pennies with Wheat on back. Quarters dated before WW2. Have not looked at the Buffalo/Indian Nickles.

What do you think?

BTW…Thank Goodness HRC lost. Can you imagine if someone came up with idea of having her on a US Currency…that would be one currency I would REFUSE to collect…😉

Somewhere, I have an old Silver Certificate One Dollar Bill that was printed before 1950..am pretty sure “In God We Trust” is on it as well.

rgr769

I can also confirm that most of our gold coinage from 1866 to 1933 contained the “In God We Trust” motto. So the idea perpetuated by progs and atheists (but I repeat myself) that the motto was only first put on our money in the 1950’s is total bunk. VOV, perhaps you should peruse “The Handbook of United States Coins.”

Hondo

Federal law formally adopted the motto “In God We Trust” in 1956, and mandated its use on currency (paper money) at that time. Prior to that time, if I recall correctly most US currency did not have that motto. However, US coinage had long included the motto “In God We Trust” – in some cases, for 90 years. The motto first appeared on the 2-cent coin in 1864, during the Civil War, after legislation was passed allowing (but not mandating) its appearance on US coinage. It appeared on other US coins as follows: Penny – 1900 (Lincoln cent) Nickel – 1866 (Shield nickel; omitted from the V nickel and Buffalo nickel; and reappeared in 1938 on the Jefferson nickel) Dime – 1916 (Mercury head dime) Quarter – 1866 (Seated Liberty quarter) Half-dollar – 1866 (Seated Liberty half-dollar) Dollar – 1866 (Seated Liberty dollar) I’ve omitted uncommon coins that are no longer minted above (e.g., 3-cent coins and silver half-dimes). By 1908, all current US gold coins (the US minted gold coins for general circulation until the early 1930s) also included the motto. Since those aren’t commonly seen, I’ve omitted a detailed listing. Bottom line: precisely one US coin during World War ONE did not have the motto – the Buffalo nickel. And the nickel re-acquired the motto prior to World War II. FWIW: Wehrmacht belt buckles during World War II were inscribed with a similar motto: “Gott mit uns”, which translates as “God is with us”. (SS troops had a… Read more »

MustangCPT

Well, Hondo, it’s been said that there are no atheists in foxholes! Personally, I don’t ask if God is on my side. I ask myself if I am on His.

AnotherPat

Thank You, Hondo, for the info.

VOV: Perhaps I made things confusing when I used the word “Currency” in my previous comment. “Currency” to me meant paper money and coins.

I apologize if there was a misunderstanding.

Since Hondo confirmed the Buffalo Nickle not having “In God We Trust” engraved on the coin, am not going to even bother dragging out my coin collection to look at them….😉

The same with the Silver Certificate $1.00 Bill.

Hondo is correct about the Wehrmacht Belt Buckle. Additionnaly, during the Imperial Era (World War 1), they also wore Belt Buckles that said “God Is With Us”. After WWI, the Reichsweer Army continued to use that Motto on their Belt Buckles.

And Yep, the SS had a different Motto.

At least we know Hitler did not wear a Belt Buckle that said “God Be With Us..”

And look what happened to him as well as his dreams of establishing an Empire.

Crash and Burn.

😉

dontmesswithgod

Mason

The documentary They Shall Not Grow Old about WWI had a great story in it about that. British soldier said the Germans put up a sign on their side of No Man’s Land that said “Gott Mit Uns”, to which they put up a counter sign that said “We’ve got mittens too!”

A Proud Infidel®™

According to one book I read about the SS, it was said that Hitler was quoted as saying that “Religion is for those who wear panties” in his propaganda to the SS Trainees.

Fyrfighter

The phrase “God, Liberty, Law” was suggested by the minister of the Baptist church in the town I grew up in (Prospect Park PA) to the Secretary of the Treasury Salmon P. Chase in 1861, and adopted soon after. If you search “In God We Trust Prospect Park”, or “Prospect Hill Baptist Church”, you can find plenty of info on the subject

AnotherPat

For this upcoming Sunday:

HAPPY FATHER’S DAY to All TAH Dads…even if you are a Dad to a Pet…or your Car…or your Bike…or even a Foster Parent, you are still a Dad!

🤗

The Stranger

Thanks AP. Fatherhood is what I consider to be the true measure of a man. I love being a Soldier and I love being an Engineer, but I only consider my success as a man in relation to how my son and daughter turn out. So far, so good, although the boy really gave me a few scares over the years. Hell, I can’t figure out who is responsible for more of my gray hair, him or my Privates and Specialists!🤣🥃🍺🍷

AnotherPat

Amen on your comment on Fatherhood…and you are so welcome.

We have 4 Sons and 1 Daughter…the question always pops up “Which one was the worse to raise?”

Our answer? “Well, when they were all Teenagers, there were challenges…”

Good point about your Troops…being Dual Military, we both had our share of “Problem Children”i.e. young Privates and Specialists. We both agree that those Soldiers were worse than our Munchkins…and those troops were no longer teenagers.

Don’t know what became of those Soldiers since we Chaptered them out of the Army. 4 of our children finally got over those teenage phases. It took the youngest one a bit longer, but he finally got his act together (Prayers DO WORK and so does LOVE).

Gray Hair is good for the Soul. At least we still have hair…😎

Thank You for sharing!

Enjoy your Special Day this Sunday. 😊

AnotherPat

Thank You for the reminder, thebesig!

trinity

5th/77th FA

69rd and back to the Firebase Magnolia. Congrats to The Stranger “Pappy” on his 1st FIRST. But then again it was no challenge when the King of Battle had a captive audience of estrogen on a Bubbas Tour of Historic Middle Georgia. Made them a brunch of thick slab hickory smoked bacon, scrambled cheese eggs, grits, and cat heads. Hit some high spots and did the Friday Evening Dining in at the S&S Cafeteria where everyone got pure ol’ de stuffed. Will be having a large time over the next few days.

A most Happy Army and Old Glory Birthday to all of the TAHellcats. I raise a toast and light a seegar in Honor thereof!

The race for the Holy Grail of a 5 pete ACE on FIRST will begin again on Friday next. Lube up your F5 keys boys, it’s gonna be a fight.

The Stranger

Dammit, Redleg…that meal sounds spectacular. Throw in some biscuits and I’ll drive down. As for next week, I gotta drive down for drill and do some “Commandering.” We’ll see if I’ll be in the hunt for the coveted “First!”

5th/77th FA

Cat head is sho’nuff Southern American for biscuit. Comes from them being big as a cat’s head, and when hand patted out, laid on the biscuit pan, you leave two little “ears” when you pull your hand away. For those who are biscuit challenged, Mary Bs frozen country style are a decent substitute.

BTW, the light is always left on for My TAHellcat Brothers and Sisters. If there isn’t something already on the Bar B or in the crockett pot, it’s an easy fix to remedy that. There are Battalion level mess SGTs that are pea green with envy over my consumable stores inventory. Class VI stores too.

AnotherPat

Nothing, absolutely NOTHING, beats homemade biscuits.

Use to watch my Grandma make them…and have yet to master her art. Her “stove/oven” was not electrical. Was heated by firewood.

Grandparents had a well for watersource. Forgot where they got the buttermilk for those biscuits, but those were the best ones I consumed in my life.

Grandma always wore a flowery type of apron that covered her dress. The magic of mixing flour, lard, buttermilk and forming them into perfect biscuits without using a cookbook…precious childhood memories.

My Grandparents were poor. No indoor plumbing. Outhouse. No heat except a potbelly stove fed by firewood in one room.

But they had a roof over their heads. They successfully raised 8 children..5 sons and 3 daughters. All Sons joined the Army even though my Grandpa was in the Navy during WW1.

I miss them.

Thank You for sharing, 5th.

We both can say “Happy Father’s Day” to our Dads in Memory…both of our Dad’s served in the Army…and both of our Dad’s left unexpectly from our lives.

Memories of them will always stay.

Enjoy Father’s Day!

hapoyfathersday

5th/77th FA

God’s Blessing to you and yours on this upcoming day of Remembering our Papas. And many many Thanks for not only those kind words, but for also the added posts your research brings to us. It means a hell of a lot to a bunch of us. Be nice if every reader of the posts and comments would say something, just to let us know they are there. If that gloating “Pappy” The Stranger would FIRST get off of his gloating butt and do some proper lording over, he might could issue an edict to that effect. Your story of your Grandparents is nearly a mirror image of mine. G Mother was the 2nd wife of G Father and he long before I was born. She raised her step children and the 6 they had together as all her own. She remarried several years after his death and had another son by him. All the boys served in WWII, some in both WWII and Korea, and the last in Korea and VN. Her father and 3 Uncles served in the Artillery, Infantry, and Cavalry during the WBTS. Cooked on a wood burner, milked her cow, raised 2 pigs a year, and kept a flock of chickens until about month before she passed at age 84 or 86. She had 3 dresses; one for everyday wear, one for Sunday go to meetings, and a black one for funerals. Wore an apron all the time and saved every scrap of cloth she… Read more »

Thunderstixx

Now this is just plain cool !!!
F-14 Tomcat, RC.

SFC D

I’m hearing music, something about that aircraft reminds me of a movie, can’t quite put my finger on it…

The Stranger

Don’t go there, man. Just don’t go there. I hate that song and the movie it is associated with, and I’ve never served in the Navy.

AnotherPat

But Pappy, I don’t think SFC D is talking about THAT movie.

I think he is talking about THIS movie with THAT song:

beegees

The Stranger

I’ll tolerate that song and that movie is funny. The reason I won’t click on the link is because every time I hear that song, I have an urge to order up a “7 and 7” and those go down WAY too smooth. I need to be on my game tomorrow so I can do next week’s homework. That way I don’t have to worry about it at drill next week.

A Proud Infidel®™️

You mean Macho Grande, I’ll never get over Macho Grande.

rgr769

No one who was there can ever forget Macho Grande. Those memories flooding back are what caused Lawn Dart Danny to freeze at the flight controls, making his recovery from that dive into dirt impossible.

5th/77th FA

And he is still maintaining minus 6 feet AGL.

A Proud Infidel®™️

I think that “Hot Shots” was more accurate than that flick which was Naval Aviation’s “The Hurt Locker”.

Cameron Kingsley

Here is the Iranian Fateh-class submarine. Looks like the second one is undergoing sea trials. The damned thing can also carry eight mines and can fire cruise missiles. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fateh-class_submarine

A Proud Infidel®™

So just how quickly can we spot and blow it to smithereens?

26Limabeans

Be nice if a leak developed over the battery pile.

Ex-PH2

If you can poke a hole in the hull with a can opener of some sort, it will go nowhere. They’ll be too busy trying to figure out what did that.

Sapper3307

It has a standard complement of eight (8) MK12-MOD3 love goats.

AnotherPat

Mason made a comment about the Documentary “They Shall Never Grow Old”.

HIGHLY recommend to all that if one has a chance, to watch this fantastic, well-produced documentary.

It is amazing how the movie was produced…taking old WWI Black and White footages, converting them into Color…having folks read the lips of those in the footages and then having voice overs for those pieces.

Even though the documentary is about Great Britain troops during WWI, the credits include Soldiers from the US Army who contributed to the film.

“Hey Boys, Here it Comes…We are Now in The Pictures”:

AnotherPat

*SIGH*

For my King of Battle Buddy as well as other University of Alabama Fans…

There are Smart RTR Fans…

Then there are DUMB RTR Fans…

Check out the video of a Roll Tide Fan who tried to rob a store in Huntsville, Alabama using a gun…she is wearing an Elephant outfit…and of course, her Mugshot has her wearing an Alabama T-Shirt.

Her robbery failed. Guess that is what happens when one is under the influence of something:

https://www.waff.com/2019/06/14/bama-fan-charged-with-robbery-botched-holdup/

Oh, well….here comes the Alabama/Auburn jokes..(smile)

AnotherPat

Any Comments? What do you all think? The US Army has now unveiled the new Expert Soldier Badge: https://www.armytimes.com/news/your-army/2019/06/14/mo-badges-mo-problems-expert-soldier-badge-officially-announced/ “As early as October, soldiers could be earning the Expert Soldier Badge — accoutrements targeted at everyone who isn’t an infantryman, combat medic or Special Forces soldier.” “The badge will test general soldiering skills, Command Sgt. Maj. Edward W. Mitchell, senior enlisted leader at the Center for Initial Military Training, said in an interview with Army Times. By offering testing and a badge, the Army hopes to provide incentive for units to train their warrior tasks and battle drills while in garrison and during peacetime.” “The new badge, which is an initiative of Training and Doctrine Command, will be equivalent to the Expert Infantryman Badge and Expert Field Medical Badge and mirror how those badges test core infantry and combat medic proficiency outside of deployments.” “We wanted every soldier to make sure they understand that they are experts in their field,” Mitchell said. “Achieving the new badge … requires a much higher standard, just like its cousins, which are the EIB and the EFMB.” “Pass rates during the ESB pilot testing were similar to that of the EIB and EFMB, the Army said in a statement Friday.” “This is not a badge to award so that the entire Army now has an ‘expert’ badge to wear,” said TRADOC Command Sgt. Maj. Timothy A. Guden in a service news release provided in advance to Army Times.” “As it is now, not every… Read more »

rgr769

Yay. Participation trophies for everyone. I wonder if the Army has a secondary MOS for Badge Hunter. Pretty soon the Army uniforms for those with a few years service will be about as decorated as those NORK generals. Are officers eligible? The staff REMFs need a new badge too.

AnotherPat

rgr769 commented:

“Pretty soon the Army uniforms for those with a few years service will be about as decorated as those NORK generals”.

“I wonder if the Army has a secondary MOS for Badge Hunter.”

😆😅🤣😂!!!!!!!

This is getting out of hand….

Claw

Sigh – SARC Alert

There must be something in the water up at Big Army, or there have been some changes to the regs that we don’t know about, cause every officially posted bio that I read on CSM Mitchell claims he has the NDSM w/2 Bronze Service Stars despite not joining the Army until October 1986. Another potential SEAC in the making?

Mitchell? Wasn’t he the big wig that also was pushing for a Army Retirement Medal?/s

But another badge? Give me a break!!

AnotherPat

Claw is correct about Mitchell’s Bio stating he has 3 NDSM…read the same thing.

Talk about someone or a Command not paying attention to detail…I blame it on the 1st SEAC, born in 1956 (whoops, I said the bad word)..😉

An Army Retirement Medal? What????

Guess getting the US Army Retirement Pin is not good enough.

wedontneednostinkinbadges

Claw

Mitchell’s official picture is all good, only showing one BSS on the NDSM. But——

Look closer at the picture, specifically the Oak Leaf Clusters on the Meritorious Service Medal (MSM).

Are those OLCs silver? Denoting an additional 10 awards? My old tired eye balls see them as silver, not bronze. Just saying, cause the official bio doesn’t list that many.

But, Hey, if he has 11 total MSMs, he’s got the 1stSEAC beat by three, so he’s well on his way to becoming an SEAC./s

AnotherPat

Claw, several of us looked at 2 pictures of Mitchell with a magnifying glass and we were taken back when we saw one pucture that looked as if he had Silver Oak Leaf Clusters on his MSM.

We said “No way. 11 MSMs? No way.”

Then we found another picture different from that picture, where the Oak Leaf Clusters looked Bronze.

IMHO, the SEAC is a useless position, just as the United Nations. Maybe oneday, the Army will get smart and start cutting back on those type of positions…

And maybe the 1st SEAC, born 1956, will get honest and take off that Star off his NDSM…yeah, in my dreams, just as Rick Cayton will never admit he LIED about being a Vietnam POW, about the scars he got on his face (I know how he got his scars), that Forgin Frank will admit he never earned a BSM w/V and PH…Hey, I can dream, correct?

Thank You for sharing the Bios and Pics.

And I bet if Jonn were alive, he might have disagreed about the Army’s new Participation Trophy Badge, oops…I mean Expert Soldier Badge…

😉😎

rgr769

One of my guys was on Cayton’s team when the bogus shit went down. There is a reason they started calling him Chi-com Cayton shortly before he departed the company to become a door gunner for one of our aviation companies. I still have a copy of the sign-in sheet for the memorial for the two men on his team who died; it occurred on a date Cayton claimed he was a POW. Cayton’s signature is on it. I was contacted frequently by POWNET about him when their investigation was going on.

AnotherPat

rg769: The POWNET did a SUPERB job investigating Chicom Ricky…THANK YOU so much for assisting them in that investigation. Was so thankful Jonn exposed him as well. Am still appalled and disgusted on what Ricky did that probably cost those two (2) Soldiers their lives…Yep, I know the story (Grenade)… And then as you shared, Cayton LIED about held Prisoner by the Viet Cong on the same day he signed the Memorial sheet for those Soldiers… DISGUSTING. Ole Ricky has yet to come forward to apologize or admit he lied. Also found an old newspaper article when Ricky was stationed at Wainwright, where he said he was “attacked” by Black Soldiers. Have heard stories from others that he claimed he got those facial scars from knife wounds to his face from those Soldiers. Others told me he shared with them that the Viet Cong slashed him on the face. IMHO, his stories on his facial scars are pure BS… Still bet he cut himself on the face…probably to get his Daddy’s attention. I know for a FACT that his Daddy, Vernon, told folks that he, Vernon, was a Korean War POW. The apple does not fall from the tree. Ricky will probably go to his grave never admitting he lied about being a Vietnam POW…just as his Daddy did with the Korean War POW BS story. I personally believe there may be some genetic mental brain hiccups in their family tree that caused their Pathological Lying and Narcisstic Personality Disorders.… Read more »

rgr769

Forty years ago I was an SF officer (MOS’s 31542 and 39301). I only spent four years in SF units (two and a half in the 10th and a year and a half in 19th). My total service was 5.5 years AD and five years in the reserve components.

Mason

For those who don’t want to Google:
comment image

They sure do look silver. Especially if you compare it to the ARCOM and AAM next to and below it. Looks to me like three silver oak leaves. Sixteen MSMs has got to be a record.

Claw

Yes, an Army/All Services Retirement Medal. It wasn’t CSM Mitchell (my bad) who was pushing it. The Good Idea Fairy was an SFC by the name of Janotta who was working as the Ops NCO at the Fort Campbell Air Assault Course in February 2014 that came up with the idea. Jonn did a posting about it and, needless to say, it didn’t receive any support here at TAH/s .

But the whole zinger to the deal was he (Janotta) wanted the new medal to rank second only to the MOH./s

11B-Mailclerk

Retirement medal? Give them a pin-on gold-plated “Ruptured Duck”.

Most folks that retire who are worth enough to be missed get a real medal on the way out the door. From my unit (and this was a long time ago), an AAM went to almost any retiree that served honorably.. ARCOM was a typical retirement award for good folks. MSMs went to better examples, and I typed up two retirement Legion of Merit recommendations.

Is the retirement AAM/ARCOM a thing of the past?

We could, if absolutely necessary, create an R device to pin on the retirement award of an existing medal. Thus a hard-charger might get an MSM with R for the retirement award that characterizes the career. Joe Average gets an AAM with R. I would say that sticking around for 20+ is legitimately an achievement.

Then again, the whole ribbon rack ought to do for characterizing a career, as is.

Claw

Since the time of Janotta’s Good Fairy idea, they have created an “R” device. You remember those, the “C” (Combat) and “R” (Remote) devices that are now being used on some medals.

My counter proposal (SARC Alert) to the idea of a Retirement Medal (at least for Army Retirees) is to affix an “R” device to a gold framed Army Service Ribbon along with a combination of the Arabic Numerals (used on the Air Medal, NCOPDR, OSR, etc) to denote the number of years served.

So, Yeah, when getting a retirement certificate for the wall, a blue ID card and a monthly direct deposit just aren’t enough, you can get another piece of bling for a uniform that’ll probably end up hanging in a closet at Fort Living Room./smile

Hondo

An “R” device? You don’t say!

Yeah, I’m joking – I know full well it’s been instituted. But I’m still claiming it. (smile)

https://valorguardians.com/blog/?p=35249

26Limabeans

“Expert Infantryman Badge and Expert Field Medical Badge”

Where’s my Expert Signalman Badge?

SFC D

Ask CSM Guden at TRADOC. He started his army career as a 31Q.

AnotherPat

Didn’t you preiously say the Signal Corps had a Screwdriver & Condom Badge…

😆😅🤣😂

(Can’t wait to share that one with my 89 year old Uncle, Signal Corps NCO who served in Korea and Vietnam)…

😉

SFC D

That was Beans, but it still holds true !

Mason

I think it’s a micro aggression and overt sign of toxic patriarchy that Army Times includes a picture of only one female and she’s staring into a compact and putting on make up. ;D

rgr769

Too bad Hillary was cheated out of the presidency by those sneaky Ruskies, or there would have been innumerable females and trannies in that photo. Nothing says social justice like a “chick” with a dick in the infantry.
Anyone know what the DA guidance was on how an EM addresses a she-male officer? Would it be “ma’am” or “sir?” How about “Xhir.”

11B-Mailclerk

A wreath, surrounding a floor buffer.

HMCS(FMF) ret

Crossed paint brushes, for those that qualified in painting the rocks around the Company/Battalion CP.

AnotherPat

CSM Mitchell had commented:

“By offering testing and a badge, the Army hopes to provide incentive for units to train their warrior tasks and battle drills while in garrison and during peacetime.”

“Because, again, the key driver behind the badge is readiness — ensuring soldiers are practicing their basic warrior tasks and battle drills in garrison.”

Is he serious?????

Mitchell has been in the Army since 1986, is a Senior NCO and this is his thought process?

He thinks that this Badge will ensure Soldiers will practice basic warrior tasks and battle drills during peacetime and in garrison?

Wow. Amazing. Completely amazing. The way a Unit insures Soldiers continue practicing all of that starts at the TOP…Leadership, NCOs and Officers, in or not in Command Position.

How did the rest of us manage to train our Soldiers or were trained as a Unit in preparation of a Battle without getting a Badge as an award…you know…”Train as You Fight”…

IMHO, this is going to be another Participation Trophy. And another Badge for Phonies to claim.

I guess I am getting too old to understand why this Badge is needed.

If there is any Soldier who is currently serving Active, Drill or Guard and you think this is a great idea, please let us know (Slow Joe? Pappy?).

Reading other folk’s perspectives on this that is different from my own personal opinion on this Badge may help me better understand.

Thanks to All for the feedback.

oldsoldier

The Stranger

I think it’s a horrible idea. Not the least of which is that it will take up training time that is already limited on the Guard and Reserve side to run the lanes for this test. When it’s all said and done, it strikes me as as a half-assed way to try to improve retention with no real benefit to force readiness.

AnotherPat

Thank You for the feedback, Pappy…really appreciate your insight.

This Badge reminds me of the US Army Black Beret…

Hope you finished your paper….enjoy your upcoming Drill…and Happy Dad’s Day again..!

You and my Favorite FA are a scream when you both exchange coversations…LOVE IT!

11B-Mailclerk

Kratman’s “Training for War” would work -so- much better than this badge.

5th/77th FA

The blingiest participation trophy…errr…Award I got was a DD Form 214 that read Honorable Discharge. Too bad for me I got out prior to the advent of the innerwebz and the “We Sell Bling” Companies. My greatest accomplishment was making it without being awarded the I forgot to duck heart.

11B-Mailclerk

If you haven’t read Kratman’s non-fiction, it is really good.

The Stranger

Well, according to the Corps of Engineers LinkedIn feed, on today’s date in 1775, General George Washington commissioned the first Engineer officers into the Continental Army.

Happy Birthday to my beloved branch. Here to you:

Here’s a health to the Army. 
And here’s a health to our Corps; 
Here’s to the Flag flying up on the hill, 
And the bird flying over our door: 
Stand by with your glasses all brimming, 
Here’s health, and here’s how, and here’s luck. 
And here’s to the Castles of Silver we wear. 
And “the Eagle that looks like a Duck.”

ESSAYONS!