Where have all the fiscal conservatives gone..

| January 30, 2019

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..or why are we spending so much on an endless war without goals?

More from VoV:

For a long time it’s become clear the fiscal conservatives like the classic liberals have become the unicorns of their respective political parties. These days neither party is interested in reducing the cost of government and neither side has a met a debt increase they didn’t like. No one really asks on a national level these days what are we actually getting for what we’ve paid out in the Middle East? In addition to getting what we’re paying for, one might honestly ask, are we even paying for it at this time or are we using the national credit card to pay for our operations in the Middle East?

Examining costs in the DoD budget, or the budget overall isn’t particularly user friendly by design these days. The Watson Institute wrote this paragraph in a report on Obstacles to Public Understanding of the Costs of War: “

Public access to information about government spending is presumed – and required – by the US Constitution, which directs that:

“A regular Statement and Account of the Receipts and Expenditures of all public Money shall be published from time to time”
(Article 1, Section 9, Clause 7).”

Some estimates come close to 6 trillion dollars since 2001 spent on the GWOT. That number includes Homeland Security spending as a component of Prevention and Response to Terrorism, which used to provide a detailed breakdown of cost based on mission. Oddly enough PL 115-31 has since eliminated that requirement, one wonders why that might have been passed. Well one wonders only if one is an idiot as it’s pretty clear previous analysis was far to clear in how much this was costing the public.

So, 6 trillion how do we get there from 2001-2019? If one looks at the budget for Overseas Contingency Operations between DoD and State one finds about 2 trillion dollars (2,022). If we look at DoD base budget increases over the same period that we consider war related, such as increased health care costs, higher pay rates for retention, we come up with increases totaling 918 billion give or take a couple of billion. Throw in some medical and disability for 353 billion, 924 billion or so for Homeland Security spending on Prevention/Response to Terrorism and some interest for borrowing at 716 billion, and you get close to 5 trillion. The remaining trillion is an estimated number based on future obligations to our current GWOT veterans who will have those costs as they start to age into the system like our WW2/Korea/Vietnam vets have done to date. That trillion may be higher if the war continues endlessly. As of today we are looking at a little over 3 million GWOT veterans, that number is expected to grow to about 4.3 million veterans according to the VA’s own projections by 2039 and as they age their health and disability care needs will increase.

So what’s been achieved with all that money and all those, to date, dead American troops? Is anyone confident that Afghanistan is a stable, America friendly democracy that we can rely on for future generations? How about Iraq? Are you confident that Iraq is now a stable regional player able to fend off Iran without decades of additional US support? Does anyone feel good about Syria? Or Pakistan? How about all the good we’re bringing to Yemen by supporting our great friends and allies in the Kingdom as they slaughter their way through the country?

Our national debt is almost 22 trillion dollars, our personal debt is 19 trillion dollars we have long since ceased to be a nation concerned with paying its bills. Every person in America owes the nation around 67 thousand dollars for their share of the debt, which amounts to about 180 thousand per taxpayer.

Clearly the cost of war isn’t our only concern, but all of these costs should be a concern to everyone in the nation.

We can argue over the numbers regarding the cost of the war, all day and all year if you like. I’m not going to dispute they’re open to interpretation, but the 22 trillion national debt doesn’t change, the 19 trillion in personal debt doesn’t change and the situation in the Middle East doesn’t change tomorrow because we argue over the finer points of the data collection today. We can even argue over the costs of other programs, but in the end the reality that we spend too much and bring in too little doesn’t change. The Common Defense and the General Welfare are always open to discussion as to their meanings and to what proportion around which we’d like to build our budget. I’m certain we spend too much on all of it, but that’s just me. Others seem content to spend endlessly on the GWOT and also offer “free” healthcare and college. Fiscal conservatives ought to be asking who is going to ultimately pay the tab on these “free” government offerings as well as the cost of wars.

Conservatism isn’t supposed to be blind obedience to the government’s position on an endless, expensive, and currently ineffectual war in the Middle East. It’s supposed to be a challenge to government over reach, to mindless government excess in the pursuit of who knows what ultimate strategic goal. Conservatism is definitely not supposed to be about approving ever larger budgets without consideration of how we pay for those budgets. We used to raise taxes during wars so everyone felt the weight of the war, during Korea the marginal rate went to 92% even Johnson during Vietnam raised the top rates to 77%. Because we’re choosing to finance this endless GWOT on credit there will be no “peace” dividend that the public will see because we’re not asking the public to pay for it now. I wonder why that is, perhaps if we were all forced to pay for it there might be a few more unpleasant questions being asked.

Good conservatives aren’t supposed to be bootlickers supporting everything their government does, they’re supposed to be voices of reason and restraint, and frankly we could use some of those voices today.

So long, and thanks for all the fish!

VoV

Category: Economy, Foreign Policy, Guest Post, Politics

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2/17 Air Cav

“[P]erhaps if we were all forced to pay for it there might be a few more unpleasant questions being asked.” Ain’t that the truth and it applies to everything, not just the cost of warring or national defense. The game has long since been out of hand. “Not me! Make the other guy pay. Yeah, get the rich guy!” Government takes and takes and takes and its appetite cannot be satisfied. It never will be satisfied. Its nature is to take and to expand. There is much that I do not understand about economics but little I do not understand about human nature or the nature of government.

Veritas Omnia Vincit

It saddens me that so many seem so willing to pass the cost of government today onto the next generation instead of bearing the weight of our choices ourselves, today as we should be doing.

Our debt should be about half what it is currently, that would be a positive we would all benefit from. Especially our children and grandchildren.

Roh-Dog

It’s sqaurely the fault of us via our representatives. Let’s make a list of all the Ponzi/poor investment schemes they’ve enacted, you know, ‘because it was right’:
Welfare
Social Security
Medicare/Medicaid
Colleges and the student loan debt
Fannie/Freddy
Public unions
…Ad nauseum
To hell with every ‘entitlement’

Roh-Dog

Allow me to continue:
Fed monetary policies/FOMC rates
TARP
TiGER/BUILD programs, you know, those ones that were oh so ‘shovel ready’
States’ bonds, FFS

IDC SARC

and why have the individual states apparently abdicated any and all responsibility for themselves?!?

2/17 Air Cav

The answer, IDC SARC, is that they are bought. Virtually every “great idea” put forth to the states by the monster comes with a threat of the loss of money or the promise of more money. Added to that are the true believers within a state gov’t who look to the feds as lord and master. Some sell their souls and others give it away.

IDC SARC

cocksuckers

David

Government by its nature is an organism. An organism’s highest priorities are survival and growth. Everything else follows naturally from that.

IDC SARC

Good analogy…and the rules of thermodynamics can readily be applied since there’s no such thing as abiogenesis.

Roh-Dog

Bravo!

IDC SARC

Looking at that pic…my fiscal conservatism flew out the window and fantasies of a home in Thailand with LBFMs in every room took over.

fapfapfapfapfapfapfapfapfapfapfapfapfapfapfap

Veritas Omnia Vincit

Well damn son you know how to paint a picture…

Thanks for making me laugh…

Berliner

Telling you to get a grip would be the wrong thing to say. You have matters well in hand.

5th/77th FA

Spot on VoV, again. If we ran our households like the gubmint is run, we wouldn’t have a household. And it appears, by some of these figures, some folks are running their households like the gubmint. My personal debt is a tad higher this past year due to medical expenses and not working full time, but it is not unmanageable. I expect to have that down within 6 months. I did not know that my share of the national debt was so high. Maybe if we had a few more taxpayers that would be cut back some. You can not continue to spend yourself out of debt. At some point in time you have to begin paying off more than you accumulate. The notion of having the “rich” pay more taxes is also absurd. If you took all the money that all the “rich” people have, I don’t think you’d have enough to pay it off. And where do you draw the line as to who is “rich?”

We have had a runaway government with run away spending for far too long now. We have had way yonder too much American Blood and Treasure pissed away in too many places that have become tar babies. True leadership and fiscal restraint starts at the top. I will not hold my breath waiting on congress critters and other career politicians to do anything about it. The State of Georgia’s “debt” from the War Between the States was not paid in full until 100 years after the fact. It was no where near the “debt” from the WOT. Anybody think it will be paid off in a 100 years?

Grunt

I’ve heard it said best (may have even been by a commenter on here):

The average American is great at leveraging their income to acquire debt.

Roh-Dog

“We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common [DEFENCE], promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.” -emphasis added-
How is launching $100k missile at a bunch of goat herders providing for the common defence?
IMHO Liberty ain’t servitude to any system.
And domestic tranquility, HA! Those so-called Democratic Socialists won’t be Happy until they smash every last pane in this Great museum, squandering the art for their fallacies.
Grading on a very generous curve I’m giving this debtbomb ridden experiment a D.

2/17 Air Cav

Our government structure is unique, thanks to the Constitution. The Founding Fathers understood that a monolithic central government was anathema to local interests and the survival of the country’s confederation of states. Their concern was well founded and their fears have been realized, in large part. Aside from a few things, such as how much a state government takes from its residents and how much it redistributes to some of them, there is little difference, in terms of government, between living in any one state or another. The laws are all but identical and all are subject (yes, subject) to the same monster, the central government. We are so accustomed to this that we unconsciously and consciously check ourselves constantly about whether it’s okay to do this that or the other thing, lest we run a foul of government dictate. And, as a whole, we are so accustomed to the sloth-like movement of government that one individual, in the person of the president, whose ideas and manner are different so rocks the boat that some people fear certain hats and scrutinize his every past action for bases to impeach him. It’s some seriously crazy shit.

Sparks

You made a good point 2/17 Air Cav. In it, I realized we do have in essence a de facto monarchy. The fed uses “give your state more to pass this, take away more if you don’t”, as their monarchy’s heavy hand. States then do it to counties and their citizens. (Currently casa de Sparks, just sent in our ballots to vote against ANOTHER school bond issue for $120 million. Phrased as, NO MORE THAN $120 million. We are not turning out Rhodes scholars in our local schools but they want the money for more free breakfast and lunch programs for the immigrants ALL SUMMER as well as the school year!) I pray for our nation every day. I pray we will not have to see another revolution from within to have things change. But that is a fear of mine. The generations younger than us, as a whole, have no idea what our debt is, means, where it comes from or who will pay for it. Many of them run their finances the same way the government does. There would have been no housing crisis had greedy people not decided that “sure I can buy the $750,000 house, even though I was barely paying for my $60,000 mortgage because some guy says I can and will lend me the money”. Common sense is very, very, mucho grande missing from our populace. If it’s not on Twitter or Instagram, these generations are blissfully ignorant of our nation’s state of affairs and these truths are not on either of them. Neither do they understand civics and how our government system works. All they hear is the likes of AOC telling them everything should be free and they vote for anyone who drinks that Koolaid. I am conservative in my lifestyle and economy. I always have been. But to define myself as politically conservative anymore seems foolish because few of those elected who call themselves conservative live as I do or stand for a government that is what VOV described. One in which statesmen (a lost concept) demand something in return for… Read more »

2/17 Air Cav

Run for office, Sparks. I want to vote for you.

Finrod

The budget is out of control, but it’s not the Department of Defense that’s the cause. The DoD was half the budget in President Kennedy’s day, now it’s what, 20 percent? Until entitlement reform happens, the budget will continue to get more and more out of control each year. Complaining about defense spending is rearranging the furniture on the deck of the Titanic.