Female Veterans Quietly Struggle With Sexual Harassment, Suicide
Female veterans are almost twice as likely to kill themselves as civilian women.
Pfc. Nichole Bowen-Crawford said she was walking to lunch on her Army base near Nasiriyah, Iraq, in 2003 when she received her daily proposition from a passing fellow soldier.
“Hey, Bowen,” the officer tossed out, “let’s go f— in the bunker.”
Bowen-Crawford told VOA that while this was the most shocking example of the day-to-day regimen of verbal sexual harassment she experienced while in the Army between 2001-2004, it was not her worst experience — she had been assaulted by a higher-ranking sergeant earlier that year.
When she reported the incident to a male supervisor, she was advised to stay quiet for the sake of her career.
Ummm… No Pfc. Nichole Bowen-Crawford I do not believe you. An “officer” that said such a thing to anyone let alone a Private would find his and or her ass in deep shit. The probability that an Officer cares less about their “career” than a Private does is nonsense.
“Certainly a mental health diagnosis like PTSD is a risk factor for suicide,” said Megan McCarthy, VA deputy director of suicide prevention. “Certainly, there’s some evidence that experiencing MST (Military Sexual Trauma) is associated with suicidal thoughts and behaviors, so those that have experienced MST are more likely to think about suicide and possibly more likely to attempt suicide.”
McCarthy told VOA that the relationship between suicide and trauma is complex. The VA’s own research has shown that veterans who experience MST tend to be at higher risk for suicide. A 2016 VA survey of 60,000 veterans found that more than 41 percent of female veterans had experienced sexual harassment.
Quoting, “The VA’s own research…” does not add any credibility to the matter. We have seen so many of these Posturing for Profit studies its hard to believe anything they report.
Women are not experiencing increased Sexual Harassment in the military. That is simply not true. Does it happen? Sadly, yes it does. What women in the military are experiencing is a lowering of the bar for what defines sexual harassment.
How about one of those fancy studies to determine how many times during a woman’s career they use their sexuality for their own benefit. Find me in a drunken stooper and I can give you a dozen examples off the top of my head.
How about another one of those fancy studies to determine how many times some woman makes false claims.
How about “they” do a study to see what the effects of making every veteran in the country a victim of something are and what that is doing to us as a Nation.
You can read the rest of this Posturing for Profit nonsense at the link below.
Source: Female Veterans Quietly Struggle With Sexual Harassment, Suicide
Category: Diversity, Liberals suck, Military issues, Veterans Issues
It all goes back to proper home training. “You boys keep your hands to yourself.” “You girls act and behave in a ladylike manner.” Our Mama.
Does harassment happen? Of course. Do some women lie about it? Well, yeah. I somehow can’t see any officer or NCO making a proposition like this. I could be wrong. During my active duty, I didn’t see the Fat Leonard thing either.
Maybe there are more female veteran suicides now, cause there are more female combat zone veterans? A real tragedy when someone feels they have no recourse other than to end it all.
FFS, now we have a term; “MST (Military Sexual Trauma)”?
Is sexual assault somehow more violent if perpetrated by or against a person in uniform?
PFC after three years? She’s a real high achiever.
I’m not going to visit the study and learn what is included in the term “harassment” or whether the date were based on surveys or actual complaints. I’m still recovering from the Kavanaugh bullshit and I am less inclined than ever to believe anything other than actual rape, with evidence.
This^^. And I believe these stats about as much as the ones preached to us that supposedly show that one in five women on college campuses are raped.
By the modern definition of sexual harassment, it’s almost shocking that the number is as low as 41.1%. These days, even the unwanted overhearing of an inappropriate joke counts. When you have to live with all your coworkers 24/7, vs getting to go home at the end of the day, you’re going to hear some things you might rather not.
It used to be that sexual harassment involved grabass and foul language from some drunken sailor. I never saw any drunken Marines, so I always assumed they were off somewhere grabbing each other’s butts, or something.
Things have changed a considerable lot since then, and now something is reported as sexual harassment when it involves nothing more than plain old bad manners. It’s just gone too far.
The SJW howler monkeys aren’t helping at all because what they’re after is money and public attention.
Well, if they are “quietly struggling” you would never know it with all the metoo bullshit going on ad nauseum.
I posted this elsewhere, but it applies to this so-called survey.
This summary of statistics on sexual violence https://endsexualviolencect.org/resources/get-the-facts/national-stats/
includes an unfortunate and simple fact.
Victims of rape and attempted rape who did not report to the police did not report for a number of reasons. 43% of victims did not report because they thought that nothing could be done, 27% thought it was a private matter, 12% were afraid of the police response, and 12% felt it was not important enough to report.
At the same time, 2% of sexual assaults reported to police are false.
Out here in the real world, especially where lives depend upon your teammates acting in your best interest, all sorts of things can and will be said and perhaps done. Not one of us will ever be able to say and do things which please everyone we work with. It’s just not going to happen. Today, I may be the one who says something offensive to A/C. Tomorrow, A/C may say something offensive to PH. Two days later, it will be someone else. So what? The stray comment just isn’t a problem.
There are two situations which actually ARE work place problems. First, and perhaps the most destructive, is the fool who not only looks for things to label as offensive but makes sure that everyone knows they are so labeled. Instead of doing whatever the job may be, these clowns are wasting time and energy not being productive.
Second is the idiot who looks for opportunities to be offensive, and is smart enough to walk the line most of the time. This becomes most destructive when it is repeatedly directed at an individual who otherwise is just doing their job. (No, I am not talking about appropriate tests to see if the newby is a team player and willing to do the work necessary to finish a task.) This can be very real harassment and is not appropriate when directed at anyone actually doing the job.
All these snowflakes screaming about things which just don’t matter, and call attention to their own immaturity, is a waste of everyone’s time. What is particularly sad is that it distracts from serious issues which actually cause harm to people and missions.
What OWB said!
My daughter had a newly minted NCO that liked to touch her shoulder, hover over her back, get in her personal space and play the white night. She’s a medic in a medic battalion so from the beginning of their service they are co-ed. I think that in the medical specialties, that probably runs much higher because of familiarity.
I told her to handle it by directly confronting him. Take the problem to the source first. I also told her she can try to have an informal discussion with the SHARP officer (Sexual Harassment/Assault Response and Prevention) for advice but see if the SHARP officer was a mandated reporter first.
And possibly it would be more of an EEOC complaint since he was her first line supervisor.
She handled it herself. He still continued to be a moron but he was shuffled elsewhere for being incompetent. Which happens in the private sector as we know.
I was surprised this still happens. Even when I was in (87-91), there was officially zero tolerance. It’s certainly a career ending move for the unprotected class
Mafia if you don’t mind me asking, where were you stationed during those years that were so good to be in the Army? (89-92 here)
SEP87 – DEC87 Ft. Knox KY, OSUT. 19D
JAN88 – DEC89 Garlstedt West Germany, 2AD (FWD)
JAN90 – JUL90 Ft Stewart GA 2/4 CAV, 24th ID (MECH)
AUG90 – APR91 SA/Iraq/Kuwait, 2/4 CAV, 24th ID (MECH)
APR91 – Back on the block
I had a dude like that when I was working joint service. He was a Navy guy.
Always liked to be in and around the girl’s locker room.
A play’a, he thought he was.
I stepped on him hard and corrected the problem. Moron.
The vast majority of female service I had contact with were whores and not shy about it. While on duty this was a routine occurrence. Maybe I should go report some PTSD now and get benefits due to my victim status.
Oh, wait. I’m a male never-fucking-mind.
I just tried to avoid them at all costs.
It was easier. That being said, I worked with a few solids over the years, but just a few.
Some of us are authorized to say “I told you so”. I’m probably the only one boorish enough to do so.
No, you are not alone. Many folks have long said that redefining terms, giving unwarranted attention to whiners, and all that other BS has two primary sets of victims. Well, three, actually.
The first set of victims is all those who truly are victims of assault and rape. We all know that it happens and should be prosecuted, of course. All this silliness trivializes them instead of encouraging them to report and get the support they need from the rest of us.
The second set of victims, while probably significantly less important (maybe) but still there, includes all those who served honorably, did there jobs well, and actually paved the way for the whiners to be in a position to damage the reputations of those who were not whiners. There are comments in this topic which prove the existence of that group.
The third group is all the rest of us who just served. Our time is wasted with having to put up with all this whining. Yes, a certain amount of grousing is normal, even healthy in any group, but this “harassment” crap is destructive to the entire workforce, both military and civilian.
I remember getting in trouble when asked in a message (from higher authority, of course) to confirm that everyone in my command had attended “Sexual Harassment Training.” I responded (also in writing) “Yes, we’ve all gone to SHIT” Needless to say, this unleashed a firestorm, even after I explained that the acronym stood for “Sexual Harassment Intervention Training.” I further explained that “Sexual Harassment Training” would be training someone to sexually harass. Sexual Harassment Intervention Training (SHIT) would assist in preventing sexual harassment. Therefore we’ve all gone to SHIT. I’m glad I’m now out of that business.
You forgot to start this with, “Now this ain’t no shit…”
Was this right after Tailhook?
That was truly a SHITshow.
Ummm… No Pfc. Nichole Bowen-Crawford I do not believe you. An “officer” that said such a thing to anyone let alone a Private would find his and or her ass in deep shit. The probability that an Officer cares less about their “career” than a Private does is nonsense.
And yet these very pages are filled with stories of assclown officers blowing their careers, marriages and pensions over pussy on a fairly regular basis.
Always interesting that we acknowledge the regular transgressions yet are uncomfortable considering those transgressions might be part of a larger problem. Seems a big of a disconnect.
I have to agree with VOV here. For the vast majority of us decent, respectful guys it’s hard to imagine that this is such a problem because WE don’t do it and we don’t see OTHER PEOPLE doing it, so it’s easy for us to think these claims are exaggerated. But the reason we don’t see it is because it largely happens outside of our sight. And the reason it’s so widespread when only a small number of guys are doing it is because those few guys are “punching above their weight” in terms of how pervasive their harassment and creepy behavior is. Put more simply, it may only be one guy in 20 who harasses/stalks/creeps on or outright assaults women, but that one-guy-in-20 is harassing/creeping on WAY more than 20 women. And if he ends up in any kind of leadership position where he has authority or control over those women, there is virtually nothing to stop him from his creepish/harassing/assaulting behavior. But don’t take my word for it. Talk to your wives, your girlfriends (not at the same time 😉 ) your sisters, your female co workers. I guarantee you that every one of them has had to deal with creeper/stalking/harassing behavior. And not just once or twice, either. Given the distorted male/female ratio in the military it doesn’t surprise me that there would be a higher-than-normal incidence of this type of behavior (and in fact, that was one of the primary concerns that was raised during the argument over increasing roles for women in the armed forces.) Also, given the fact that (a) in the military people of higher rank have considerable power over their subordinates in a way that civilian employees almost never do, (b) military service often takes place in remote areas where a victim’s opportunities for avoiding harassment or outright assault are limited and (c) the ‘assumption’ that “no officer/NCO would risk his career for that”, I think it’s a credit to the Armed forces that the problem isn’t worse than it has been reported. But to pretend it’s not a serious problem does… Read more »
We are moving ever closer to where sexual harassment will be the mere presence of a male….
In my old fashioned Army, the only women we infantry types ever crossed paths with were Army nurses and the dough-nut dollies of the RVN. Being abusive to either category would likely get you and ass-whupping.
Same same for this Signal type.
Ditto. What was the warning given in BCT, that if you looked at a woman for more than a few seconds while not talking with her, you could be charged with a sex crime. It was some such thing. Of course, back then, in mixed company, a rare event, women were to act and be treated as ladies. If one refers to a woman today as a lady, he is likely to be scoffed at, maybe slapped.
Don’t take this the wrong way as I am not making light of sexual assault/trauma as it is a very real and very powerful event with tremendous impact, but I talked to a PA the other day at the VA and he SHE stated that almost all female Vets are claiming MST in their claim applications.
Her response was that no one in the VA will challenge any of it (tough to do anyway) as it is a political and social hot button issue that has resulted in reprimands and dismissals in the past for challenges to the claims from examiners and raters.
So for those that have a legitimate claim, there are many that do not. It is becoming kind of like “The PTSD” to get paid.
Once again, I make no light of this issue and have no opinion, just relaying a conversation.
Anecdotal accounts aside, claiming MST is free money for many women, just as claiming PTSD is for many men. It’s a venn diagram with the overlap being men and women who qualify for both!