New York Times; Concealed Carry’s Body Count

| February 26, 2015

Jacobite sends us a link to an article about the New York Times‘ attempt to poison the debate on concealed carry laws. The use data from the Violence Policy Center to make their case;

In studying the 544 shootings, the center found 177 cases where people with gun licenses were ultimately convicted of crimes, including homicides, and 218 cases where the permit holder used the gun to commit suicide. There were 44 total lives taken by licensed individuals who first murdered others, then committed suicide.

The full death toll attributable to concealed carry is undoubtedly larger because the center’s study did not cover all 50 states. Lawmakers dare not allow a national tally, so badly needed, to be kept by the government. No one is sure how many citizens now legally carry guns, but estimates run beyond 11 million nationally with many statehouse agendas pursuing even more permits.

John Lott takes a closer look at those statistics in Fox News and does a much beter job tearing up the NYT’s Editorial Board and the Violence Policy Center better than I ever could;

The VPC keeps a record of permit holder abuses in each state. Take the claimed worst state, Michigan. The VPC cites state police and media reports indicating that permit holders committed 277 suicides or murders during the period from 2007 through 2015 (217 suicides and 60 murders). If accurate, a 38 percent share of all 722 deaths nationwide that the VPC attributed to permitted concealed handguns occurred in Michigan.

But suicides are not in any meaningful way linked to the act of carrying a permitted concealed handgun outside of one’s home. The Michigan State Police reports it does not collect information on how the suicides were committed, just that permit holders committed suicide.

Interestingly, the 2013 suicide rate among Michigan permit holders (6.2 per 100,000 permit holders) is lower than the rate among the general adult population (16.59). Typically, suicides — with or without guns — take place at home. So, again, what do these numbers have to do with the concealed-carry debate?

Yes, I know that none of you are surprised that the New York Times’ editorial board would lie but a few states are considering permitless concealed carry, among them, my own West By God Virginia. I’m sure that the New York Times would like to derail that process. Our State Senate passed the legislation unanimously the other day and the West Virginia Sheriffs’ Association is standing in the breech according to the National Rifle Association’s Institute for Legislative Action.

The Sheriffs’ Association has armed itself with the inflated statistics of the New York Times in an attempt to derail the legislation. They claim that felons and the mentally ill will then be able to carry weapons concealed, despite the fact that those people are already forbidden to own or possess firearms even without permitless CCW. So what’s the big whoop? WV law allows for the open carry of weapons for law-abiding citizens.

The Sheriffs’ Association expressed a further public safety concern, arguing that law enforcement would now have to treat everyone as if they are armed. However, conventional law enforcement training already dictates that law enforcement treat everyone as if they are armed, anyway.

Only foolish officers don’t treat everyone they talk with as if they are armed. The only people who will be able to carry a concealed weapon legally are those people who would qualify anyway. Permits will continue to be available for those of us who carry concealed weapons out of state – and those permits require background checks and training.

The New York Times and the WV Sheriff’s Association should save wetting themselves for the criminals who carry guns instead of law-abiding citizens who carry guns.

Category: Gun Grabbing Fascists

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Silentium Est Aureum

Of course, what the NYT doesn’t want you to know is that the vast majority of gun murders are committed with guns illegally obtained or owned by people who never should have had them.

But law-abiding citizens are a much easier target, so to speak

David

so 177 of 11,000,000 works out to about .0016%? (That would work out to an annual guncrime rate of about 4800 – which as we know is ‘WAY less than the actual rate.) So, surprisingly, well over 99% of gun crimes are committed by non-CHL holders.

Nicki

So I blogged about this for the Zelman Partisans a while ago.

http://zelmanpartisans.com/?p=689

There’s so much hyperventilation over stupid shit in this article, it’s not even funny!

“They did not mention until the very bottom of the article (more as an afterthought), for example, that there are at least 11.1 million concealed carry permit holders in the United States. I say “at least,” because according to the CPRC, that number is likely much higher, given the fact that several states, such as New York, don’t report the number of their concealed carry permit holders. And several states have no permit requirements for concealed carry at all.

But let’s go with that 11.1 million people, which represents roughly 4.8 percent of the population.

According to the VPC, there were *GASP* 544 shootings involving concealed carry permit holders, 16 of which were ruled lawful self defense. That would leave 528 shootings between 2007 and 2014 (I’m assuming they are including 2014, as the editorial merely states there were that many shootings since 2007) or 75.4 per year.

In comparison, between 2007 and 2012 (the latest year for which the CDC has data), average of 548 people were stabbed to death per year, 425.6 were beaten to death, and 138.5 per year were strangled or suffocated.

Now let’s look at those 528 shootings. Let’s assume that these involve 528 separate concealed carry permit holders. Given that there are at the very least 11.1 million concealed carry holders currently residing in the United States, those 528 represent .048 percent of people with valid concealed carry permits. Not even a half a percent.”

This is what they’re shitting their pants about. Pathetic.

Pinto Nag

Nicki, as much as we enjoy your clear presentation of facts, they’re useless here. The NYT, and their intended audience, is too busy wetting their panties over evil, possessed, scary concealed guns, to worry about something like facts.

Veritas Omnia Vincit

75 per year is only slightly higher than the number of people mauled to death by dogs each year…which is about 45-50 depending on year. So you’re only 1.5x as likely to encounter a legal permit holder committing a crime as you are being eaten by a dog…

Jacobite

Far more interesting to me were the statistics cited at the original link I sent to Jonn, from an organisation called ‘Firearm Owners Against Crime’ out of Pennsylvania.

https://foac-pac.org/Guns-And-The-New-York-Times:-Why-Shouldnt-Americans-Be-Able-To-Defend-Themselves/News-Item/1792

According to the statistics cited, concealed carry permit holders as a group are more law abiding than even law enforcement officers as a group.

Pretty interesting reading. Can’t say I’m surprised.

nbcguy54ACTUAL

So how often are vehicles used in the commission of a crime? Like I’ve said before – better ban them too.

Richard

John Lott wrote a book called “More Guns, Less Crime”. I own the 3rd edition. If you are interested in this topic, Mr. Lott’s book is really good. He point is that in every case, when a state begins to allow concealed carry, the violent crime rate goes down. The book has 55 pages of footnotes. He identifies all of the conflicting “studies” that attack his work. For each study, he isolates their complaints about his work then explains why they are wrong. I think that it is remarkable that a guy would add so much information about his detractors and defend himself in writing.

Jacobite

What’s even more amazing is that Lott started out as a devout gun control advocate, then changed his world view as he examined the evidence.

E-6 type, 1 ea

Kansas’ unlicensed concealed carry just passed the state senate this afternoon.