White House: Boston bomber won’t be tried as “enemy combatant”
The Washington Times reports that Jay Carney told the media today that Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, the fellow who bombed the Boston Marathon and led the Boston area police on a merry chase reminiscent of the popular Fox series “24”, won’t be tried as an “enemy combatant” even though he is an “enemy combatant” in every sense of the word.
So that means a trial, but the court of public opinion has already determined that he’s innocent. Twitchy tells us about the Twitter hash tag for #FreeJahar and apparently all the chicks dig him. Some empty headed “artist” somewhere named Amanda Palmer has written “A Poem For Dzhokhar.”
Mike Lillis of The Hill predicts that, because laws prohibited prevented the Tsarnaev from legally owning guns, we obviously need more laws;
The news that the suspects were not authorized to own firearms will likely add fuel to calls for tougher gun laws – an issue that was put on the back-burner last week after the Senate blocked the central elements of a gun-control package backed by President Obama.
That was obvious from the start – we need more laws that don’t work. Make some more criminals, until we’re all criminals. How Lillis got there from her, I’ll never know. The trial will be a joke.
But, Leaky Leahy is concerned because the Republicans are “exploiting” the incident to block immigration reform, says the Washington Post. So there’s something for everyone to exploit for their own purposes.
Category: Terror War
@32: Yeah, he was still tried and convicted in civilian court, as it should be. Padilla got 17 years and with time served and good behavior, as our prison system seems to go; he should be out by next week.
If there are links to established terrorist organizations, they need to be identified, and the links exposed; if for no other reason, so that our extremely short national memory will understand that this isn’t just garden-variety murder, and that it isn’t just an isolated incident.
@30.
Agreed.
Anonymous: in this case, intent may or may not be relevant to the crime. Given our somewhat disfunctional current legal system, it will probably end up being relevant as to whether or not the little prick gets the needle or not.
Regarding WMD: OK, you tell me – what would you call a bomb packed with ball-bearings and other metal pieces (to serve as shrapnel) planted in a crowded public area if not a “weapon of mass destruction”?
The intent was to cause mass casualties. That intent was realized. The injured, especially those who lost limbs, would certainly say the device was quite destructive. Ergo, in my book that makes it a “weapon of mass destruction”. Compared to a nuke, it’s definitely at the low end of the spectrum – but it still qualifies.
For the ordinary American citizen, there will be consequences:
1. Legal geniuses like Alan Dershowitz are kibbitzing saying the US will be sorry Tsarnaev wasn’t mirandized.
2. Tsarnaev was sedated and as such was unable to understand his rights. Already we citizens are seeing the lawyer laying the ground for lawsuits by Tsarnaev, his family, the victims of Tsarnaev’s alleged actions. –> this isn’t about justice, it’s about the lawyers getting paid big damn money.
3. As we learned with the Ahmed Ghailani trial in 2009 and the arrest of Nakoula Basseley Nakoula (maker of the film credited with murdering Ambassador Stevens and 4 other Americans in Benghazi), Obama is not above waiving the Bill of Rights if there is a risk that the judge will set the accused free.
#3 is the scariest as Obama’s already done it. Tsarnaev simply provides an excuse to continue that behavior.
@Hondo: My issue above wasn’t with intent, it was simply related to the degree to which I’m personally willing to bend on suspending one’s rights as an American. If an American leaves the country, lives in Pakistan for ten years, trains with bin Laden, and then commits a crime like this, I’d have fewer reservations about his constitutional rights – you can make a (common sense, not legal) case that he gave up his rights a long time ago. On the other hand, if someone who has lived here for years and doesn’t have direct connections to key terrorists does a crime like this, I think it’s a bit dangerous to let someone simply ignore what our society promises its members. Not so much for HIS sake, but for our own. Again, none of this is a legal defense of anything, it’s just my personal feelings. As for WMD, I think that it’s one of those terms which means something that’s well-understood, even though it could technically refer to countless other things, like these bombs. Or, say, an automated weapon. Heck, anything other than a single-shot, single-use weapon for that matter. Do we want to change this term to mean anything explosive is a WMD? If a soldier fires an M203, is he attacking our enemies with WMDs? There are plenty on this blog who get understandably upset when terminology shifts and people use ‘machine gun’ or ‘assault weapon’ as words that don’t have the meaning they should, so surely we can agree that re-branding WMD to mean anything even slightly explosive is a bad thing? More importantly, I also just think that labeling this a WMD attack lionizes what he did and basically highlights almost an over-reaction to this sort of act. Which, in turn, is likely to provide more inspiration to sympathizers than if it was a more simple, “Asshole plants bombs, kills three and injures many.. police get him, scared and injured hiding in a boat, and arrest him.” sort of statement. By contrast, “Two people detonate WMDs in Boston, whole city goes on lockdown, thousands of… Read more »
Hey Hondo. Here’s something that you may have fun with, at least as an academic issue. Your assignment (should you choose to accept it) is to make a case that the young bomber should–and validly could–be charged with treason. This message will self destruct in 30 seconds.
Study him. Gain the info, use him as a guinea pig and then when has no more to offer take him out to pasture.
@ #58: Yes!
Personally, I don’t care what they charge him with. Or what motivated the attack. Young blood is a terrorist, whether or not that is a valid legal designation. I just don’t care about those details.
Get all the investigators and attorneys in a room somewhere. Decide what charge will be the easiest to prosecute and get on with this show. Could be murder x 4, add hate crimes, threats, treason, possession of illegal weapons, terrorism, violation of international courtesy, whatever. I DON’T CARE. Just get it done, folks.
But don’t consider anything which does not carry the death penalty, even if a lessor sentance is considered. Sure, I’d let him plea out for a life sentance. Then file another charge on his happy ass which also carries a death penalty.
As I see it:
1. Rope.
2. Tree.
3. Terrorist.
Some assembly required.
2/17 Air Cav: not worth considering, because it ain’t gonna happen.
Tsarnaev’s act could arguably qualify as treason under the Constitution’s definition (it arguably constitutes an act of war against the US). However, in practice acts that technically qualify as treason have not been prosecuted as treason unless they occurred during a formally declared war for the past 100+ years. If one excludes the small number (3 or 4, I believe – I’m working from memory) of cases from the Philippine Insurrection, that period becomes roughly the past 200 years. See Hurst, The Law of Treason in the United States, available at
http://www.constitution.org/cmt/jwh/jwh_treason.htm
@62. Okay, don’t have any fun, but there is such a paucity of SCt decisions going to it, and the language of the Treason Clause itself is so plain, it really is a good time.
The last Federal execution was McVeigh. Before that it was some run-of-the-mill kidnapper/killer. The year was 1963.
Adam Gahdan has been indicted for treason in California. If he’s captured, he will be the first citizen prosecuted for treason since WWII.
Yeah, take that Hondo!
2/17 Air Cav: don’t get me wrong. I personally think the case would be sound, and there’s probably sufficient evidence to convict the younger Tsarnaev even given the Constitution’s extraordinarily high bar of proof.
Unfortunately, though I could well be wrong I also think the courts would probably overturn any such conviction on appeal. My sense is that the Federal courts today (even the SCOTUS) would take a very dim view of any treason case outside a formally declared war. I think quite a number of folks got a pass they didn’t deserve on treason charges during Vietnam and the current GWOT on cases that IMO constituted treason for the same reason.
About the only treason case that the courts IMO might buy today outside a declared war would be a US citizen engaging in a direct attack on US forces while acting as an armed agent of a hostile power. IMO Lindh only got off because of youth and the fact that he killed one (Mike Spann) of the two reliable and Constitutionally necessary witnesses to his crime while committing same. Had Spann lived, I’m guessing Lindh might well have been tried and convicted of treason – unless the courts also ruled he’d been “mistreated” after capture and cut him a break because of that.
JAGC: true, I’d forgotten about Gadhan’s indictment. However, an indictment is nowhere near the same as a successful prosecution. I think it’s an even bet that Gadhan ends up facing other charges instead of treason if and when he’s ever captured and finally tried – if for no other reason than the Constitutionally-imposed difficulty in prosecuting treason cases (two witnesses to the same overt act and/or admission in open court).
I hope I’m wrong, and that Gadhan ends up prosecuted/convicted/executed for treason. We need to reestablish the legal principle that aiding US enemies is wrong, and is also prosecutable as treason. We seem to have lost sight of that fact since World War II.
And some are now reporting that they think the motivation for all this may have been, **gasp**, (can we say it out loud?) religious.
Gee, really? Nobody (sane) would have considered such.
Confirmed: motivation was religion, per suspect’s own statement.
http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/04/22/17860373-officials-hospitalized-bombing-suspect-says-he-and-brother-acted-alone-motivated-by-religion?lite
Why am I not surprised or shocked. What a piece of a rotting corpse he is.
While I do not have a problem with him being charged in a civilian court, as he did attain US Citizenship on 9/11/2012, and did commit an act of terrorism inside the US, and was captured in the US….
… that does not mean he cannot be labeled as an enemy combatant, and DOES mean he should be tried for treason, as well as perjury (the oath he swore to the US and the Constitution).
But, I’m disgusted with the political correctness and partisanship that does not include a charge of terrorism, or the 3 murders and 185 attempted murders.
And I’m sickened that some would espouse a policy of double jeopardy, just in case the govt can’t prosecute this case right the first time.
Adam Gadahn renounced his citizenship. He is fair game. Tsarnaev’s citizenship needs to be revoked, by a court of law, but this Admin won’t do that.
http://waronterrornews.typepad.com/ps/2013/04/when-is-the-person-committing-terrorism-not-a-terrorist.html
I guess lack of tolerance is becoming more and more universal. It seems the older (dead) brother didn’t like the preachers at the local mosque and was disruptive at services.
http://feeds.nbcnews.com/c/35002/f/653378/s/2b09e84f/l/0Lusnews0Bnbcnews0N0C0Inews0C20A130C0A40C220C178661170Emosque0Etamerlan0Etsarnaev0Etwice0Etried0Eto0Eshout0Edown0Epreachers0Dlite/story01.htm
He’s an “undocumented enemy”.
The Media is already showing the perps pictures from when he was a baby or at twelve.
He’s gonna get the treyvon treatment while the victims get the Zimmerman treatment.
I can hear the Lawyers now, “Why exactly were all those white victims gathered in that spot?” and “ISLAMOPHOBIA!” this l’il bass turd is gonna get an acquittal and walk with money in his pocket.
I am not trying to sound like a conspiracy theorist, but I have said from the first time I saw the news that things do not seem to be adding up.
I only want this rotting piece of slime to be tried, as are other people (in Chicago, now) and sentenced, and not allowed to get off for technical reasons. That’s all I want.
I do not think that is too much to ask.
What does it cost to keep a high-security federal prisoner these days? About $70,000 a year? Nice.
This is one of the reasons I despise life terms. Think of carrying a food tray to this turd, three times a day for THE REST OF HIS LIFE. Somebody has to do it, right? That’s where our money is going. I don’t know about anyone else here, but I can think of other things I would like to see done with that money.
And no, it’s already painfully obvious he won’t get the death penalty, the poor, innocent lil limpid-eyed moppet. No one in this administration has the spine, or other body parts, to put a needle in this sweet little jihadist.
I’m hoping he gets the exact same sort of Justice Tim McViegh got.
I would hope he gets MORE justice than did McVeigh. I would like to see him charged with Treason, Terrorism, Perjury, and Murder of Civilians. I would like to see the MSM call him what he is: an Islamist Terrorist.
But until and unless his citizenship is revoked, as it should be, I will defend his right against double jeopardy.
http://waronterrornews.typepad.com/ps/2013/04/the-american-revolution-was-no-serfs-rebellion.html
Hey, I would love to have a chance to stomp his head into little squishy bits, or kick him in the nuts til he vomits blood, but that would only express my anger.
It’s more important that he get a trial, with NO PERSONAL CAMERAS and NO PAPOS in the courtroom, and on delayed feed to CourtTV, and that he gets convicted and sentenced. No double jeopardy, no ‘not Mirandized’ stuff, no legal technicalities.
I don’t understand why the families are so surprised by this. There are plenty of half-grown children who shut themselves in their rooms and don’t say anything about what they’re doing and their parents don’t force the issue out of some idea that the kids should have privacy. And then they’re surprised when the kid is busted for criminal activity.
Very True PH.