35 years ago…
The Armorer reminds us that the Vietnam War ended 35 years ago today.
I was in jump school at the time, I think I graduated the following week because a week after that I was a 128 pound 5 jump chump drawing ammo at Hunter Army Airfield for our aborted preparations to rescue the Mayaguez from the Khmer Rouge – the last US operation related to the Vietnam War.
At that time, nearly every enlisted soldier above the rank of E-5 was a Vietnam veteran among infantrymen. Every officer above the rank of captain had a combat patch on their right shoulder. Their experiences in Vietnam added color to every training operation with real life lessons. They were the ones who remained to train us newbies, to make sure that what happened to them would never happen to us. They stayed with the Army even though they were mischaracterized by the popular culture, they continued doing their duty and few ever mentioned their cultural enemies on the Left.
I was fortunate in that the 1/75th Infantry was populated with the heroes of Vietnam – everyday was like some sort of class reunion when the very best soldiers of that era relived their multiple tours of the war with their old classmates. Some had earned battlefield commissions and then gave them back when the Army started drawing down. More than few kicked my young ass with legs that were held together with pins. Most are now remembered in the Ranger Hall of Fame.
The Vietnam veterans didn’t lose their war, yet they shouldered the blame for it silently. Their real victory is in the wars that we’ve fought since. There are soldiers walking around today that live because the Vietnam veterans didn’t abandon the country that largely abandoned them. I count myself in that number of troops who are alive because of the Vietnam veterans that taught me to soldier. That is a debt I’ll never be able to repay.
This latest generation of veterans, from our more recent wars, have taken the cue from the Vietnam generation and serve in difficult times. My generation is lucky to have been bracketed by these heroes.
Category: Military issues, Support the troops
I was too young for Vietnam, but I grew up watching the war news on TV every night reciting the KIA’s. It ended the year before I enlisted. I too met many combat vets in BCT and I was saddened as the years went by and they slipped away. I listened in rapt attention to their stories. One of our medics in the BN aid satation was an SF Vietnam vet, and his best buddy was a little vietnamese kid, probably from one of the many heavily asian enclaves in the US. To listen to their decidedly non-PC banter (that I can’t repeat even here) was, how can I say it, enlightening?
Served two tours in Vietnam thanks.
Look around you and you may be surprised to find some of Us Vet Vets are still lurking. Just did a retiree recall in Balad Iraq and learned a lot from the younger generation.
thanks
01b20
82nd, Airborne
Served with some of the last of the Vietnam Vets in my Armor Btn back in the mid to late 80’s. You guys truely are responsible for a good many of us still being alive and walking after one or more trips to the Gulf, thank you.
Many were larger than life to a good many of us ‘kids’. And even though a lot of us are now retired and have our own groups of ‘kids’ we helped train and mentor, some of those crusty old bastards are still larger than life to us.
I can never repay the Vietnam vets who taught me the lessons they learned the hard way. They saved the US military during the dark years of the mid to late 1970’s. Thank you just doesn’t seem to be enough.
I agree with you, Jonn. Absolutely.
I met a Ranger or two at Ft. Sam who were doing the medic thing…but is the world that small that you might know of them? I learned a few choice lessons, but they were maybe late 20’s, early 30’s. Don Lowe, and Don “Smitty” Smith. Is 1/75th out of Ft. Lewis?
My 1st Sgt. in Desert Storm was a Vietnam vet….we felt alot better having him around. I went to Basic in ’88 and we had a Vietnam vet in my class. The Drill Sergeants never gave him any grief. He never took advantage of it, he did everything we did, I just never saw a DS dress him down. I believe that would be called respect….
“Is 1/75th out of Ft. Lewis?”
2/75 is at Lewis.
I was a 9th ID Leg in 2/23 INF and 2/75 were our next door neighbors.
Junior AG, when was that? I was with 2/77 AR just down the block.
Thanks Jonn
Many thanks to all who served there. I never figured why I didn’t go. I finished my training in Oct of ’69 as an 11C at Fort Jackson. As any of you know we went through the same training as an 11B except for patrolling. We did our mortar training then. My MOS was highly combat. Some told me it was because I had just turned 18. Some said that there weren’t many that went from Fort Jackson. Seems that most of those came from Fort Polk. By the way I had joined in April while still in high school. I really had no plans after high school so my dad told me the Army might straighten me out. Well it did. The ironic thing was that i got orders to report to Fort Ord on May 16th. I was still 12 days from graduation so those have be changed. I left for Ft. Jackson the morning after graduation. I never regretted joining.
I have 2 cousins and 2 friends on the Wall. Even though I was not there it still hurts to look at those names. They had the Wall That Heals in Washington, NC last week. It hurt to look at the letters and all the things they have on display and then to walk out and see the names on that Wall.
Thanks for posting this. As Marcus Lutrell wrote in my copy of Lone Survivor, “Never Forget”.
I remember this well. Vicenza, Italy. I was one of the minority E-5s that was not a combat vet. My squad leader and many other NCOs in the 1/509th were 173rd vets, some SF vets, some Kilo Rangers vets.
There were some depressed mo fo’s in the AO for a while, and the Rod and Bottle did some booming business.
11B4P
Sour Grapes sorta:
When we came back we weren’t even welcome at the VFW, nor the American Legion. I can provide details if needed. That hurt worse than being spit at.
That’s when an informal group began. GoE might be considered a culmination of those efforts.
Never Again!
Thanks Jonn:
Not for me, but for those who served in the ‘Nam. I was at the other end of this shitstorm, out by ’64, and had Korea and WW-II vets as NCO’s n Officers. At A co. (Air Mob), 101st Aviation Bn, (Prov), 101st Airborne, we trained crews to go to Laos, Thailand, and some to go to S. Vietnam,(UTT Helicopter Co. ). Like Y’all, I learned much respect from and for those who served the hot shit before me.
Nuf Sed
“When we came back we weren’t even welcome at the VFW, nor the American Legion. I can provide details if needed. That hurt worse than being spit at.”
I’ve heard much the same from my father, who went over in ’66. Back in the 80’s, when my grandfather was an officer in the VFW, he could not understand why the Vietnam vets would not join. My dad told him it was the way the VN vets (including my dad)were shunned by these organizations. My dad to this day refuses to have any part in the VFW or American Legion.
Mike: It was a difficult time, but a valuable thing as well.
We can be thought of as the precursor to GoE.
Even then… We were determined that the young guys would not be treated as we were.
Works for me. Geezers in action! It really matters little that the last generation was less than supportive.
I am a bit troubled that there is a dismissive thing going on, but we’ll keep keeping on so long as we’re alive.
Gentlemen,
As a member of this current Generation, having served(almost done) two tours, I want to say thank you for what you did over there. Gordon, Bravo Zulu! I have an Uncle who was Brownwater Navy in ’66, and the stories and mementoes that he shared with my cousins, sister and I were big influences on us growing up. I am, have been for 6 years now almost, a member of the VFW, and am a Legion member too. It was not right that many of you were turned away. Not every Post is/was like that. I can remember my first meeting to the Post as an official member, having helped out the older Vets around that Post for years with general upkeep of the building. The stories I have heard over the last decade from WW2, Korea, and Vietnam Veterans definitely helped to shape me into the man and NCO I am today. Thank you for your Service, and Keep the faith!
I know I owe every fiber of my existence to a Vietnam vet; I love my Pop more than words can express.
They will never be forgotten.
I joined in ’77. Served under a lot of Vietnam vets and learned a lot of lessons from them, not just about how to be a good infantryman but a good person. They certainly didn’t deserve the stereotypes and the reputation that has been heaped on them.
I think the real eye opener for me was once I got to my first duty station in Germany and we had a dress greens inspections, normally on pay day since back then they paid in cash, and I saw all the ribbons and medals that these guys had. I swear my First SGT had a note on the top row that said continued on backside.
Those guys were humble and never really talked about their service, and they certainly didn’t embellish it. Hell most of the time if you asked one what he got a medal for his response would be, “For being stupid.” But when we were out training, if they told you to do something you knew there was a good reason and you didn’t argue.
Somehow I made it through 22 years in the Infantry without ever getting a combat patch. Some people say it was just a matter of being in the right place at the right time. Me, I have always chalked it up to life is a mystery.
Re: the way VN vets were treated. I can’t excuse or condone the way they were treated, but I can say, thanks to their outspoken nature, that those that followed after Vietnam were not treated in such a shabby manner. You did the time, you earned the right, and nobody, but NOBODY, is going to dismiss one’s service at a Legion or VFW hall anywhere around where I live without them catching some serious shit for it. Welcome brothers, one and all.
My thanks, heartfelt, to all Vietnam Vets. You are the cream of the crop of my generation. You folks inspired me to enlist and serve in addition to doing one hell of a job in Vietnam and for the country. You are welcome back!
I read this maybe 20 years ago. My apol;ogies to the author for not remembering his name.
The lesson learned in Vietnam – You not only must be prepared to kill the enemy for your country, but you also must be prepared to die for it.
RVN 69-70
B 2/503rd Infantry (Airborne)
173rd Airborne Brigade (Seperate)
First i want to say Welcome Home to all the Vietnam combat vets…i try to say that every chance i get because they were all treated like shit when they returned, whether it was in San Fran or not and, as a few stated here, by the VFW and Legion.
That fact was well known at the time and i saw it myself because of how my brother was treated and my best buddies older brother when they rotated back.
I got out of high school in ’73, but most of us talked about getting drafted from the 9th grade on because it seemed the war would go on forever. I knew eleven young men in my brothers ’69 graduating class that are on The Wall,and that is from a small town in W.Va.
I joined the Army after high school and almost every NCO in basic at Ft.Bliss was a combat veteran. One thing i’ll always remember is that they all looked older than their age. That’s just something that has stuck with me all these years.
Sometimes it doesn’t seem like thirty five years and sometimes it seems like a hundred.
I wanted to add that to all of you combat vets, i know it seems like yesterday.
God Bless every one who served.
John, are you coming down for the Best Ranger next week at Benning?
I thank God every day that circumstances steered me to Viet Nam and brought me back. My Top was one of the old Korea Vets. Double lucky.
Funny, but my heroes are the guys who enlisted when there was no longer a draft, and when it looked like the Army never would recover – but they volunteered anyway. Those are the guys who are MY heroes.
I started out my Military career in the Air Force in 77. Served with quite a few AF vets and vets that had been in other branches and then joined the AF. Even had A good friend that was a MARINE and had been at Khe Sahn. Man the stories these guys would tell. Some would curl your toe nails ,some would bring a tear to my eye and others would have ysa in stitches laughing so hard you’d about piss your pants. Made those long nights on alert go by so much faster. Now I have quite a few BROS in a Vets M/c that are VN Vets and I can say I’m a better man for having known them all. Thanks Brothers and WELCOME HOME!
To all Vietnam Vets, the VFW will welcome you now, you are the guys running them now. At age 50, I barely qualified due to Iran in 1980. The younger guys, most likely they dont want to join because the place is filled with old men! 🙂
Well, the doors are open, combat awards for being there prove you’re a member, not just the date you served like the Legion.
Hey Jim, I am a young guy, and have been a member for 5 years, Life Member too! My Post is fast becoming full of GWOT Vets.
Jim Bancroft said: the VFW will welcome you now
I’ve been a Life Member for some time. Shucks, now we run the place. [grin]
What was is a fact… I very much appreciate your words.
We must never lose sight of those that are serving now. My first parade was in Hawaii. The Desert Storm vets ask us to join with them…
“…few ever mentioned their cultural enemies on the Left.”
That was not my experience at all. Well, okay it may have been only a few, but it was a very passionate few. Before 1976 was even out, I was thoroughly imbued with the knowledge bestowed upon me by my superiors that Jane Fonda was nothing less than Satan walking the Earth…
Thanks John and all above. Never gets old hearing it. In my many years working at a Vet Center my main project was instilling in my Vets that we can never allow what happened to us happen to any other veteran, of any war. I think Vietnam Vets have been on the forefront of just about ever support the troops effort since Grenada. The DAV was always supportive and started the Forgotten Warrior Project, the precursor to the Vet Center Program. AmVets also included Vietnam Vets immediately along with the MOPH which I’ve been a Life Member of for well over 30+ years. Now, the VFW and Legion were slow and the VFW did NOT recognize the Vietnam Campaign ribbon at first. Basically told it wasn’t a war. Sound familiar Korean War Vets? Like all organizations there were good and bad. When in the process of opening a Vet Center I was ridiculed and told to get out of one AmLegion Post. Another not only welcomed me, it provided a huge coffee pot and the VFW provided coffee for years. Have no idea if it still continues. In our youth most of us didn’t have the time to devote to service organizations. It’s not until retirement that you really get involved which is why at most meetings it’s just FOG’S like me. Thanks again John, as always my old friend, for recognizing us and for all the comments above.
AIRBORNE!
Honor and Courage
Hey Jon, Thanks for the reminder. You know my story, but some folks on here don’t. On 11 February 1976, I was a young, optimistic 18 year old when I raised my right hand, joined the United States Army, and swore to protect my country against all enemies, foreign and domestic. At Ft. Jackson, South Carolina, the majority of Drill Sergeants were Vietnam Veterans. One in particular, SSG Juan Rivera, was an Infantry Soldier in ‘Nam, and he was absolutely fucking crazy. He was pretty rough on us recruits and told us in no uncertain terms that the training we got had two main purposes: kill the enemy and survive. A typical Drill Sergeant was tough, committed, hard core, loud, obscene, and had unique “names” for Army recruits. Political correctness and ‘touchy-feely’ methods took a back seat to mental stress and combat training. They had 9 weeks to mold, shape, and kick our asses into Soldiers. A lot of them suffered from what is now known as Post-Traumatic Stress Syndrome, before the medical community gave it a label. The silhouettes on the rifle range bore a Red Star to represent the Soviet enemy. We marched, did pushups, side-straddle hops, squat-thrusts, and low crawled. We went through the obstacle course, drilled, and shouted risque “Jody” cadence until we were hoarse. Our Drill Sergeants did have a “sense of humor”; we got the requisite “suicide speech” about not trying to hang ourselves with the buffer cord because if you put the cord around your neck and threw the buffer out the 3rd story window, the buffer would hit the ground before the cord ran out, and were told that our M16A1 was made by Mattel. When I graduated in June, 1976, I was bursting with pride and Esprit d’ Corps. I was a young, gung-ho Soldier ready to “kill commies for Christ”. Thanks to those Vietnam Vets both NCO Cadre and friends I knew, the lessons they learned were passed on to us. I served two tours in Iraq and Bosnia inbetween. Unfortunately, we are now saddled with a Marxist idiot who… Read more »
Oh yeah, I forgot. To all of you Vietnam Veterans:
WELCOME HOME.