More on LT Caron Nazario

| April 14, 2021

LT Nazario of traffic stop fame has graced our site here: Since Mason posted the article our own ninja has been hard at work doing what ninjas do best- fact find. And the facts are telling. This isn’t the LTs first rodeo with LEOs by a long shot. Our ninja found:

Court documents: Army lieutenant in Windsor traffic stop pulled over a month before viral incident

ISLE OF WIGHT Co., Va. – News 3 has uncovered documents that show that Army Lt. Caron Nazario had been pulled over by Windsor Police about a month before the incident where he was pepper sprayed by a Windsor Police officer in December.

The November 7 traffic stop was for speeding.


Our intrepid ninja then dug around in court records looking for any cases involving Nazario. You can look here: Va Court Case Information . Following the link (click on “On Line Case Information System-Statewide Search” then type in Nazario, Caron R) our ninja found numerous entries, recording a pattern of speeding, tinted window violations, and failure to display license plates. Sound familiar?

Time frame covers 2014-2020.

Isle of Wight General District Court
Case #: GT20008474-00
Offense Date: 11/07/2020
Hearing: 05/12/2021
Charge: 54/35 SPEED
Code Section: G.46.2-875

Chesterfield General District Court
Case #: GT16005707-00
Offense Date: 02/02/2016
Hearing: 03/28/2016
Code Section: 46.2-1052

Dinwiddie General District Court
Case #: GT14011945-00
Defendant: NAZARIO, CARON R.
Offense Date: 12/02/2014
Hearing: 01/15/2015
Charge: 75/60 SP
Code Section: G.46.2-870

New Kent General District Court
Case #: GT18003278-00
Offense Date: 05/31/2018
Hearing: 06/27/2018
Charge: 70/55 SP
Code Section: G.46.2-870

Petersburg General District Court
Case #: GT18005493-00
Offense Date: 03/28/2018
Hearing: 07/17/2018
Charge: 43/25 SP
Code Section: G.46.2-874

Brunswick General District Court
Case #: GT16006946-00
Offense Date: 06/03/2016
Hearing: 09/22/2016
Code Section: 46.2-1052

Brunswick General District Court
Case #: GT16006947-00
Offense Date: 06/03/2016
Hearing: 09/22/2016
Code Section: 46.2-716

Petersburg General District Court

Case #: GT16005157-00
Offense Date: 05/28/2016
Hearing: 08/23/2016
Amended Charge: SP 1-9 OVER LIMIT-55/70 ZONE
Amended Code Section: A.46.2-870

Petersburg General District Court
Case #: GT16005158-00
Offense Date: 05/28/2016
Hearing: 08/23/2016
Code Section: A.46.2-104

Prince George General District Court
Case #: GT15001106-00
Offense Date: 02/09/2015
Hearing: 04/27/2015
Code Section: A.46.2-852

Sussex General District Court
Case #: GT14012193-00
Offense Date: 10/07/2014
Hearing: 11/18/2014
Amended Charge: 44/35 SPEEDING
Amended Code Section: A.46.2-875

Link to the police report:

Quite the laundry list of traffic infractions- he was no stranger to interacting with LEOs. Amazing work, ninja. Thanks. Glad you’re on our side.

Category: Crime, Guest Link, Legal

Inline Feedbacks
View all comments

Slow Learner, dumb or just acts like a E-1?


The GiveMeMoney Fund (established by the LT’s own lawer) went up overnight by 2K.


He is already doing better than his uncle’s fund for when he was killed by the police. The real money for the uncle’s family was in the lawsuit.


Windsor is one of the small towns on the Main route between Ft. Lee and the Hampton Roads area. Likely the LT travels it a lot. The Highway drops from 55 to 35 there and it is a speed trap. Given the number of years between the sets of charges I am guessing the LT grew up in area.


And that he learns at an incredibly slow rate. My son goes to Texas A&M. On the road from Waco to College Station, there are several small towns with speed limits going down to 35 from 70 to 75. Despite having made the trip countless times in the last two years, I haven’t gotten a ticket. It’s a miracle.


Many old US Highways were notorious speed trap towns.
Some still are.
It’s part of why FLORIDA now has warm down signs,
from 60mph, to 50mph, to 40mph, and then 25-35mph,
where fat Sheriff Donut Hole still sits
with a radar gun, strips, and chaser cars.

<< Last speeding ticket Fall 1990,
71mph in a 55mph, heading home from National Guard drill.
In uniform.
Geez, nothing happened to me, but the ticket.
That section of PA61 (former US122) in Port Clinton, PA
is now 35mph.

30 years since war.
30 years since a police ticket of any kind.


I’m glad I don’t have his car insurance premium. I wonder if he has reported this these to his insurance company.

A Proud Infidel®™

I still bet that he gets a Christmas card from his Insurance Agent every year!


Most insurance companies scan their customers’ driving records. Drivers seldom report their DUIs, or tickets.


This guy sounds like a Beach Boy Song;
I Get Around


More like Sammy Hagar, “Can’t drive fifty five.”




Holly jeez, what kind of dipstick is this? Might these shenanigans have delayed him being CPT Nazario?

A Proud Infidel®™

Forest Bondurant

The Sergeant Major of the Army should be made aware of this, though it’s unlikely he’ll reconsider or retract his statements about defending this “officer” upon learning of more facts and the LT’s history with LEO’s.


Oops, beat me to it.


Especially considering he’s be cited for license plate issues and tinted window issues before.

And since he claimed to be in fear of his life, what exactly changed between the almost dozen stops he had prior and the last one?

E4 Mafia 83-87

That many violations should cause his license to be suspended, right?


You mean the E9 of The Army?


More like PV9 of the Army, acting like a barracks lawer (sic), a threat to good order and discipline.

Soldiers are special now. Scorpion pattern means cops must bow.

Clown world.

Green Thumb

What will be interesting is if the SMA sticks by his guns after all of the other stuff comes out.

If this is the case, he should establish a commission to review every LE and NCO who had potential UCMJ issues with respect to traffic / moving violations


He’ll stick to ’em–as a fully Woke SMA he’s authorized to wear Master Jump-to-Conclusion Wings…

James H.

I’ll have to steal that “master Jump-to-conclusion wings”.

Name edited to protect PII.

Green Thumb





“He represented himself and our Army well…”

By whining about his debilitating fear of the police? Yessiree, I would follow that officer to the Gates of Hell.


I see that /s tag, but I might follow him, just to see what in Hell he could fook up.


The CSM put his boot in his mouth
WTF is the Army and why are they playing PC
before the facts come out ?????
Must be how it’s done now under Biden


The LEO told the LT to get out, the LT didnt comply. Everything after that is good-to-go. SMA should unf**k himself, posthaste.

Pennsylvania vs Mimms

USMC Steve

NO, one popo told him to get out the car, and one popo told him to stick both hands out the window and freeze that way. Two clearly contradictory commands that he could not comply fully with at the same time. Then that fat fuck gassed him repeatedly, making it impossible for him to see to get out.


Ok guy. If you can’t see this for what it is maybe cartoons or finger painting are more your style.
Every time he had an opportunity to be compliant he chose to be a bag of cocks, starting with the stop.
He got what he wanted. Have you seen the video he recorded? It exists.
Give some people a little power and a grievance….


Question for those who may be more knowledgeable than I:

Are ROTC Cadets allowed to wear the NDSM prior to graduation/commissioning? A news report video shows him (LT Nazario) wearing it along with an ASR at graduation ceremonies.

If so, the LT is good to go. (although one forum commenter says only if the Cadet has completed BCT/AIT)

If not, the Brotherhood weeps once again.


I wouldn’t think so. Not back in my Army. When I was a senior ROTC cadet I had more ribbons than as an O-3 returning from the Viet of the Nam. Three rows versus two, including the vaunted NDSM.


It depends. He appears to be a NG officer, so he was very likely in the Simultaneous Membership Program (i.e. enlisted in the NG while completing ROTC). He probably went to Basic and AIT, so he probably rates both. Cadets who are SMP can wear their State and Federal awards, or Cadet Command awards, but they can’t mix and match.

Green Thumb

Probably on his way to Advanced Camp to instruct.

Saw a few of those clowns.

The Army will put anyone on the payroll. And many of those clowns needed it.


I’m still waiting to hear back from someone
Who runs a ROTC in Nevada about this

Big Bigs

He was enlisted before joining VSUs ROTC program.


So, do you know him personally or was that just a general statement?


I haven’t looked at AR601-210 or USAREC PAMs in a while (thats your mess now, Big A douches) but how the F**K did this turd get a waiver? And why is he still employed by my Army? (I don’t know how he commissioned, but who is willing to bet against he was rammed thru by ‘favorable staff’)

His chip-on-shoulder got him twisted around and decided to act like a child. His actions brought discredit upon himself and he needs to go.
I’m tired of this division leftists are sewing, it’s leading to mistakes and look at the results, unnecessary uses of force. And yes, that is very much your fault LT. Notice how I said it wasn’t right, but actions have consequences.

But misplaced guilt is gonna get this dude paid, just like all the other turds as of late that put themselves in harms way.

One day soon, there will be no actual law enforcement if this keeps going. How do you think that will end?

USMC Steve

So this is all interesting, but I still have a problem with the cops behavior. One fat asshole tells him to do something, the other cop tells him to do the opposite, and they are ready to break out the whoopass on him regardless. They are fucked up cops, plain and simple, and the fat mothafucka needs to get seriously acquainted with a treadmill. Evidence of the fact that the popo knew that they screwed up is that they let him go rather than hammering him with failure to obey, submit, kowtow properly to popo, or whatever they call it in VA.


dumb cops are not rare. But one has to ask why this is so.

The answer is the fine LT.

What decent and competent person would want to deal with over entitled jack asses and work for corrupt jack asses?


Moreover, it was within easy reach.

Green Thumb

It that a fucking flavor savor LT is sportin’?

The new Army standard.

Green Thumb

And I love that picture on the link. The one at the bottom.

Looking all “Mr. Poopy Pants” and shit.

Gangsta LT done had a bad day.


If he was in uniform, and previously on Federal property that day, then he might still find himself in some big trouble.


*For clarification: If he had that weapon on Federal property (which is the assumption, since he’s still in uniform), then he’s in big trouble.


FWIW the most recent charge for speeding (54/35 in November 2020) was likely an officer giving him a break. Typically when a summons is written for 19 over the officer is choosing to not charge for exceeding speed limit (46.2-862 reckless driving/20 mph over posted limit).

Writing the ticket for 19 over is a simple traffic summons. Reckless driving is a criminal charge.


Apparently Dauntay has an open arrest warrant for attempted armed robbery. The Daily Mail is reporting the female officer will be charged with second degree murder. Maybe they will up charge her with first degree and a hate crime to placate the BLM rioters.


Not a lawyer, but it looks like they may have overcharged her. She clearly believed she had grabbed her taser so proving she acted in a conscious manner is going to be a hurdle.

Then again, it could end up with the jury convicting regardless of the law.


The problem here though, is that if you look at the taser and the glock, they don’t look or feel the same. Had she spent more time getting familiar with the tools of her trade, she might have noticed this. I have no particular sympathy for the criminal, but she screwed up royally and should be hammered.


No argument she screwed up and should’ve known better. She should suffer the consequences of her actions.

The problem with the charge of 2nd degree manslaughter is one of the essential elements. The requirement to act in a conscious manner with the intent to kill or cause serious harm.

She verbalized taser multiple times and was clearly shocked she shot him. Overcharging her could easily result in her beating the charges.


So this is what they mean by “being an habitual offender”.


The Sergeant Major of the Army (SMA) commending Nazario for his ‘calm, professional response to the situation’ and said Nazario represented the Army well?”

Well, this is interesting.

Is wearing a mustache and goatee considered a “beard”?

This is coming from the same SMA…in January 2021…

What am I missing?

“Facial Hair Petition Gains Momentum After SMA Tells Force ‘You Will Not Have a Beard'”


ninja, reportedly, SMA Grinston is mixed race himself, half-white and half-black, which may explain his knee-jerk reaction to defend the LT before getting all the facts.

Reacting without all the intel is not a good quality in senior NCO’s, especially the top NCO in the force.


When I was in, the Mess did not make it a habit of openly commenting about O’s and their issues with the law (civilian or military).

PV9 Michael Grinston should keep his opinion to himself and not post his thoughts on social media. I guess he missed out on that lesson at the SMA Academy…


To answer Claw’s question reference the NDSM and ASR:

Dude graduated from Westinghouse High School, Brooklyn, NY around 2011:

It’s him:

Graduated from Virginia State in 2016.

Starting breaking the law in Virginia while attending Virginia State.

Which makes one wonder if he had any infractions in New York.

His old MySpace account shows a picture of him displaying and bragging about using Gold Condoms.

At least he practiced Safe Sex/Birth Control.

Word To The Wise: Be Careful When You Go Public On Anything, Especially Social Media. Your 15 Minutes Of Fame Can Come Back To Haunt You…



“His old MySpace account shows a picture of him displaying and bragging about using Gold Condoms.”

Go figure, the Virginia State teams are the Trojans…😜


Ah, the New York connection. That’s why the temporary license tag in the rear tinted window of his new ride was from New York state while just going home after work (on a drill Saturday) with his dog in a crate in the back.


Your 15 Minutes Of Fame Can Come Back To Haunt You…

Which is why I’m not telling you my real name. 😉



Dude is NOT a US Army Medical Officer, i.e. Medical Doctor or Nurse.

He is US Army MEDICAL SERVICE CORPS, i.e. Hospital Administration.

Two different jobs.

Makes one wonder if he ever attended a Basic Course for his Branch.

“He is currently serving as a 70B Army Health Services Administration Officer in the Virginia National Guard’s Norfolk-based 1st Battalion, 111th Field Artillery Regiment, 116th Infantry Brigade Combat Team.”


We DO have the very best ninjas. Fine job, again…not that I expected any different. When ninja gets ahold of something, it’s like that Bull Dawg on a bone. And Rolls like the Tide.

Y’all bear with me and excuse my language for a moment. This little pissant mofo has done brought shame upon, our (GO) Army (not that the Army needed help bringing MORE shame upon itself), the Brother/Sister Hood of the NDSM, but also my Beloved Field Artillery…AND the proud traditions of the 116th Inf Combat Brigade. This history has a proud tradition going all the way back to 1741 and includes being part of the Stonewall Brigade (some of the finest Soldiers the world has ever seen), ANV, and continues on thru every war that we have had true Warriors in. Yeah the popo coulda, shoulda, woulda, had oughta handled things differently. Howsome ever this twerp has been playing “that card” or his expected privilege to skate out of trouble (moving violations) way yonder too many times. As stated above, on many of those “tickets” the LEO cut him an assload of slack to keep him from having felony or “Super Speeder” violations. You can bet your left testicle that he would not have a GA DL.

Just my opinion, but I think this punk has been goading and fishing for this type of stop so he could hit the lottery and force the taxpayers of some town/county/state to pay him what he thinks he has coming. PHUQUE HEEM!!!



Have been doing some further research into this 70B MOS and what I gather is that it’s basically the NG/Reserves equivalent of what we used to have in the old Army (for enlisted) as MOS’s 09B (Basic Trainee) or 57G (Duty Soldier). The NG double and triple slot these officers until they finally decide just what career field they want to go into. So it’s kinda like having a Holdover Platoon of Officer Gofers for the command to utilize as circumstances arise./smile

Based on comments from a couple of the forums I read, still being a 2LT four or five years after commissioning is pretty standard fare.

But as I hypothesized over on the initial post, this federal lawsuit didn’t come about until after the 116th BCT had been alerted for an upcoming 10 month deployment sometime this spring, so draw your own conclusion as to the “why now?) timing./s

Ex Coelis

With the above records and all these further details disclosed – this little git needs a very big reset slap – on all four sides… 😀

Pepe Le Pew

Considering the current climate of the military and the SecDef, this boot Lt will probably get deep selected for O-4 and be an instructor in CRT.

A Proud Infidel®™

Likely a Star Candidate for a Civil Affairs O4 Slot when they’re desperate for warm bodies (*HINT*).


Well, he sure as hell wasn’t an Infantry officer, nor any combat arms officer.

“Golly gee, I’m scared.”

Did he pee pee in his pants?


None of that bullshit is relevant to this stop.


Pattern of conduct. Seems I’ve heard that somewhere before, Larsie.


Yes, Lars, it is. All that previous interaction with law enforcement and multiple experiences with getting stopped puts the lie to his tearful performance.

As someone who had a heavy foot in his younger days, ol’ Poe can attest to the fact that getting pulled over gets to be rather routine for repeat offenders.

The difference between young Poe and this jerkoff lieutenant is that I was always polite, respectful and obediently followed the officer’s instructions. Guess what? I very seldom got more than a warning ticket or a verbal warning.

You claim LE experience and Poe also has some, so we both know that attitude and failure to comply with requests and instructions seldom yields a happy ending for an offending motorist.

I agree that these two small-town cops did not comport themselves very professionally but the hard truth is that had the dumbass Eltee kept his mouth shut and followed instructions, NONE of this likely would have happened. He’d have been ticketed and on his way.

By filing his suit, the dumbass is now going to have his full history of driving infractions exposed to the Army, to the State and to Windsor’s legal defense team. Want to bet this jerkoff didn’t reveal his past driving record to his own legal team before they agreed to take his case?


Oh, and I forgot to mention that letter he’s going to get from his auto insurer…


It’s all about DA MAN keeping a brotha down!


Did Commissar just type some ridiculous sheeit?

Obvious answer, it’s totally relevant.

Looks like someone needs to watch a few more reruns of COPS TV.
And this, too.
Everyone (head bonk on Commissar)
can listen and learn from comedian Chris Rock.
After all, this has only been out there for about 20 years.


None of your bullshit is relevant. Ever.


It absolutely is you intellectual coward. He has a level of contact with law enforcement for traffic infractions that dwarfs the average citizen’s.

Yes Officer Gutierrez acted in an unprofessional manner. But this shit stain seeking a payday by claiming he was I fear for his life is beyond reasonable.

Why don’t you fuck off and keep fucking off into 6 fathoms of water? You have no knowledge, training or experience that is relevant to this conversation.

A Proud Infidel®™

Major Moonbat, the more you run your mouth about LE issues, the more convinced I am that you never made it past your Probationary Period when you claim to have been an LEO.


You are partially correct. But his repeated traffic stops are relevant to show his familiarity with the procedure. We are just inclined to bag on him because he is an arrogant butt-wipe of a REMF, just like you. Oh, and his history is not “bullshit.” It is documented fact. Our ninjas were just doing background to find out why this whiny butter bar is such a douche.

USMC Steve

I hate to say it here, and hope never to again, but dude is right. The facts in evidence are that two cops gave him totally conflicting orders, that he could not fully comply with. Cops were wrong, and the fact that this guy is a turd who should not be wearing bars is not relevant here.


Last OER comment:

“His men follow him, but only out of morbid curiosity.”


“Mother Teresa tells him to get fucked”

A Proud Infidel®™

“He almost delivers mediocre performance with perpetual supervision.”


“Couldn’t lead a turd down the bowl”.

A Proud Infidel®™

So if THIS is how he conducts himself elsewhere, I see that as a clue AS TO what kind of an Officer he is when on duty.


Ever had LE pull weapons on you?
Me: 6 times…4 times with multiple weapons…prone on ground once with long gun pointed at head…

The barrel is about 6 inches in diameter when you are looking at it and it is waving in the air…

Big bearded biker type dude…little bit of profiling…

Be very respectful in demeanor, move very slowly…obey all directions with no argument until LE is convinced to put away weapons…

I always say…”The most dangerous person you can encounter is a 24 year old with a badge and a gun.”

The most intense time was being pulled over after stopping at an “aftermarket custom bike shop”…Got out of the truck…gun pulled out and pointed at me by LE…

LE: “Hands in the air” I have a warrant for your arrest!!!”

Obeyed immediately…

ME: “What for?”
LE: “First degree murder!!!
Me: “From where???
LE: “Virginia!”
Me: “I’ve never been in Virginia! What is the name on the warrant?”
LE: ……..
Me: “That’s not me. You know who I am cause you ran my plates when I was at the shop.”
LE: “OK. Put your hands down…” As he holstered his weapon.. “How would you like to be an undercover agent for and infiltrate the group at the shop…”
Me: “KMA”

Needless to say…my new wife of 3 months (who was with me…) was in total shock….
Profiling comes in all shapes and sizes.
Be calm, obey and move slowly…

Went home and had a beer…

Had good experiences with LE also over the years…Got thanks for stopping certain incidents before they got to far out of hand…

Anyway, be calm, obey and MOVE SLOWLY…


Very wise advice. When stopped by a cop, follow instructions and don’t fail the attitude test. If Officer Numbnutz mistreats you, you can always file a complaint later with his department, when he no longer has the power to arrest you.


Words to live by.


Per ol’ Chris Rock:

A Proud Infidel®™

I have been told by LEO friends that about 10% of Drivers typically receive about 90% of the tickets issued and that 2LT appears to be a shining example of the truth in that statement!


So… he drives a little too fast, and his windows are too dark, and that justifies being screamed at by police with drawn guns?

The “window tint” issue is bullshit, and should never have been a law in the first place.

The speeding should be taken care of with a ticket, not at gunpoint.


There are two good common-sense reasons for the laws limiting the allowable amount of vehicle window tint in many if not most states. One doesn’t need an LE background to understand them.

The first is safety. Tint windows too dark and safe night driving becomes problematic. The second is LE safety. Limiting the amount of allowable tint allows LE a better view of what is going on in the vehicle during a traffic stop.

I’ve seen auto windows so darkly tinted that it would be difficult to tell if the individual inside was pointing a weapon out the window. How would YOU like to be an LEO approaching a vehicle with windows tinted that dark at a traffic stop?


Way to reductio ad absurdum!


I always get amused when people tell me laws they don’t like are bullshit. They seem to think this somehow invalidates the law and now people don’t have to comply with it.

It doesn’t.


With the exception of Lars/Commissar’s frequent flights of foolish fantasy, we generally try to keep things in the realm of reality here at TAH, PavePusher.

If you’re gonna hang around here you might wanna try soaking up some of that reality yourself…

Point being, that the reality IS had that dumbass lieutenant complied with the officers’ initial instructions he probably would have driven away with nothing more than another moving violation to add to his growing collection.

See how easy that is?


Since this mukluk Nazario is in Shipley’s backyard,
I need to ask… Is it me?
Or are the videos, years ago engaging and fun, increasingly devolving into a Death Ride?
Getting teeth pulled, or a knee replacement, without painkillers?

Please understand, I appreciate much of what Don has done.
But the 1st minute of this and other recent videos
is a set up, a warning, for the impending root canal.
Steve Martin in Little Shop of Horrors.
I believe he once knew well what fans and followers go there to see.
Not so sure at this point.

Like Aerosmith and Van Halen,
the fans aren’t lining up to hear about the hip replacements.
Let’s hope he returns to the bread and butter, the focus, the primary target(s).

If you can make it through this 1st minute…
BTW, I Googled. NO CHANGE.
Shipley is apparently internet clueless,
and/or his IT Pro Terry may be milking the teet with BS.
Google picks up side links on his older pages, but this new page does NOT come up.

NOTE – Military Phonies and Valor Guardians are far superior in this aspect.

Enjoy. Or not.


I checked again.
36 hours after he posted the page,
the page itself is still not on Google.
Google detects OLDER pages with the new sidebar link text,
but that has always been happening, for years.
Someone needs a Google 102 refresher training.


on the Boob of You,
I don’t know if this is a new dress up gag,
or a 5 year old rerun,
but the attempt at humor here
(IMHO) crosses the line into supercreepyville.


Obviously a metaphor, but does not represent well the people that bring light to Stolen Valor.

Why provide ammunition to the perpetrators of Stolen Valor that say we are a dangerous crowd?

This video was probably made for entertainment value, and you can make the argument that rooting out Stolen Valor is an entertainment sport, but I do not subscribe to that school of thought.



Oh oh.
Concern confirmed.
I scrolled for negative or critical comments
on his Boob of You when I typed above.
(I didn’t leave anything anywhere, but here.)
Well, I just looked again.
1 new comment he won’t like, 50 minutes ago.
The others, from last night, all gone.
Looks like the world of D, D, ducks, and dogs
doesn’t take kindly to criticism.
Someone better tell them,
they are not Van Halen. Nor Aerosmith.


Yes, ’tis a bit much.

Largo Larry

He has had more tickets than I have had interactions with police in 76 years

Name edited to protect PII.


Now I wish they had ran his license when they had him.

Green Thumb

Four day no shave profile, unbloused boots, hat inside at a cant (always taken off when eyeballed nine times), hanging out and making laps at the PX near the perfume station. In uniform.

But missed PT do to a “profile” or “appointment”.

Especially on a Friday.

Just saying.

I wonder if Lars was behind this individual as they bitched (loudly) about having to pay cash for a debit charge under three bucks on Friday as they picked up all the cheap liquor at the VI across the corner.