The heroes of Lindt Cafe
The Australian Courier tells the story of the two folks who lost their lives in the Lindt Cafe in Sydney today;
Both died while doing extremely brave acts.
Lindt cafe manager Tori Johnson was wrestling a gun from hostage taker Man Haron Monis when he was killed.
Mother-of-three Katrina Dawson, who had stopped at the cafe for a morning coffee, died while trying to defend her pregnant friend.
From The News;
LINDT Cafe manager Tori Johnson has been hailed a hero after he died trying to knock the gun from Man Haron Monis’ hand in Martin Place about 2am.
Police entered the cafe after Tori was shot dead and the ensuing gunfight resulted in the deaths of the gunman as well as mother-of-three Katrina Dawson.
Category: Terror War
Contrast this with the pussy scumbags in the BF tournament.
RIP to these two
Rest in Peace, both of you brave people.
The police chief says, “All of the hostages acted courageously.” He was responding to a question specific to the reports circulating about Johnson and Dawson. I am skeptical. I see no attribution for the reports of heroism. It is presented as fact and that’s that. If Johnson had not done what he did, Dawson might still be alive. I wasn’t there so I can’t say whether it was correct for him to try. I just hope he considered what result if he failed. And he did.
http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/7-it-is-not-the-critic-who-counts-not-the-man
The link to the Roosevelt quote speaks to the man in the arena. Perspective changes when the man in the arena’s actions affect not him alone but those in the ringside seats as well. In this instance, Johnson’s actions resulted in gunfire which, in turn, prompted the police to storm the cafe. Whose bullets killed whom? I don’t know. Was the hostage taker about to begin shooting when Johnson acted? I don’t know that either. My point remains that I am unwilling to award a medal just yet, but as eyewitness statements are published, I may be first in line to do so.
2/17 Air Cav-first your premises are wrong and so is your understanding of the quote. Your premises are wrong because it wasn’t Johnson’s actions which resulted in any of the tragic outcomes-only the Islamonutter can be held responsible for the situation and any of the outcomes, ethically or legally. Your understanding of the quote is wrong because ultimately we don’t-we can’t-know what motivated Johnson. His perception of what was taking place was what motivated him and died with him. Maybe the objective observer would say that he was wrong for whatever reaso, but the objective observer isn’t “in the arena” which is the only variable that matters.
2/17 Air Cav:
I agree there’s a huge tendency to label anyone who undergoes hardship a hero, regardless of their performance.
I agree, but only conditionally. My knee-jerk reaction is to praise the bloke for having the stones to have a crack at this pillock.
Did his actions, however, cause that young woman’s death? Unknown. Would the gunman have been able to inflict a higher volume of casualties had it NOT been for the young man’s actions? Also unknown.
So you see, we can’t be certain that young Johnson failed. Maybe he succeeded.
The real truth of the matter is known only to one man: The offender. The sole fact of which we can be supremely certain is this: None of it would’ve happened had it not been for the offender. Blame him. Blame only him and others like him.
I have to admit though, I’ve got a whole lot of sympathy for a bloke who is willing to have a go at an armed hostage taker.
Steve
Sydney, Australia
Ex Australian Regular Army
Good on ya mate. Too much “monday morning quarterbacking” going on, let’s see when more facts are released.
Got to work with 8/9 RAR in a company exchange in ’91.
Mikey:
Condolences….I was from 6 RAR.
haha 🙂
Fair enough, Steve.
Cav, you’re a wise man and my wife and I really enjoy reading your comments and insights here at TAH. Initially I was in full agreement with you, but after last night’s rest I find myself more sympathetic to the fallen rescuer. Homeboy, was dealing with Islam and I don’t think any other options existed.
Exactly.
Islam, ISIS flag (or close enough). Says it all.
Better two dead doing what is right, then all of them being butchered like Halal lambs.
Under these circumstances, I hope I’d have done the same.
If only Australian laws were different and he was allowed a CCW……
And the press is wondering what his motivation was. When will people wake the hell up.
All she wanted was a muffin and coffee. A beautiful mother of three….gone.
Australia voted for gun control, if I remember correctly. (Please correct me if I’m wrong.)
But I’m not sure CCW would have done any good. It is rare in the mass-shooting / hostage-taking scenarios, for a CCW holder to appear during the crisis. Whether that’s because they aren’t there, or because they make the choice not to engage, still hasn’t been answered to my satisfaction.
While I have seen people post “if they only had CCW laws in Australia, then this wouldn’t have happened”. I believe it would have. We see examples of it in our own country in our own states, where scumbags still take hostages, rob stores, attack others, etc., because not enough people are armed and the roll of the dice on whether a good guy with a weapon is in that store, bar, etc. The scumbag has to make a decision if whatever they are after is worth the chance of them running up against someone who is equally armed and possibly losing their life. The daily Feel Good stories answer that question. The problem with fanatics and lunatics is; they don’t care. This nutjob would have still done what he did. He may not have been successful in securing the cafe, but there would probably still be casualties.
OT,
I think that the point bizjetmech (and any others) is trying to make is that Mr Johnson was not even given the OPPORTUNITY to choose if he wanted to carry concealed or not. If the Aussie gun laws were more CCW friendly, this story would have ended before it had barely begun, with a whole lot less trauma (relatively speaking) for all concerned. Except for Mr Jehadi Asshole Imam, of course.
2/17 Air Cav: accounts here appear to indicate that Johnson’s acts weren’t what caused the terrorist bastard (may he be tortured nonstop by Shay’tan for eternity) to start shooting.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/australiaandthepacific/australia/11293694/Islamists-take-hostages-in-Sydney-cafe-siege-live.html
Other accounts say Johnson caught the gunman dozing and tried to wrest his weapon from him. However, it’s not clear precisely when that may have happened, or if Johnson was shot immediately after attempting to take the terrorist’s weapon vice at a later time.
In any case, the above accounts also raise (for me) a troubling question. Those same accounts appear to indicate there were opportunities for a police sharpshooter to take out the terrorist bastard before any hostages were harmed. Unfortunately, those opportunities were not taken.
Hondo: I guess I am guilty of doing what I am cautioning against: trusting early, unattributed accounts of what happened in the shop. I read yesterday in an Australian newspaper story that the police entered the shop when gunfire was heard coming from within it. If Johnson went for the weapon (reportedly, a sawed-off shotgun)and the POS fired, well, it made sense to me that the police would move in, as reported they did. Eventually, after the US news cycle on this ended (probably, 20 minutes ago (!), we’ll get the official accounts. Also, the British newspapers read like the Nat’l Enquirer. I’ll await the Australian police account.
We all have at one time or another, amigo. Making that mistake from time to time is a part of life.
Should you find a link to a copy of such a report, please post it. I’d like to see that myself.
The religion of peace claims two more…..my sympathies and best wishes to the families.
I continue to wonder when and at what point will we stop pretending we are not at war with islam, and take appropriate reactions to protect ourselves.
When, VOV? When someone at the Federal level in this country snaps out of the daydream. But since that is unlikely to happen soon, we must be patient.
The Constitutional duty to grab the Federal level by the neck and slap the stupid out of it is on us, the citizens.
“I continue to wonder when and at what point will we stop pretending we are not at war with islam, and take appropriate reactions to protect ourselves.”
Me, too. Especially, the political whores in DC.
I have a great deal of sympathy for the two people who died at the hands of this sociopath, and for their families.
None at all for the sociopath.
Rest in peace, to those two brave souls and God bless their families now.