Aurora mass shooting
Another tragic, senseless shooting occurred in an Aurora, Illinois industrial park yesterday. Six dead, including the shooter, and five Law Officers wounded.
Authorities have confirmed that the shooter, Gary Martin, 45, was killed in a shootout with police. Police said he was a 15-year veteran of the Henry Pratt Co. and was about to be fired.
The five wounded officers and a sixth employee also wounded are expected to survive.
At a late-night news conference, Ziman said it was not yet clear whether the suspect, armed with a Smith & Wesson handgun, was carrying the weapon at the time of his dismissal or whether he “went to retrieve it” before opening fire.
An eyewitness and fellow employee told CNN he saw the gunman running through the building carrying a pistol fitted with a laser sight.
Also uncertain was the degree to which the shooting was premeditated, Ziman told reporters.
“The information that we have indicates he was being terminated today,” she said, adding that the reason for his dismissal was not known to police.
The chief said investigators were still looking into whether the gunman had a prior criminal history, but public records show Martin was convicted in 1995 for aggravated assault in Mississippi. Convicted felons are generally barred from possessing firearms.
Read the rest of the story here:
Reuters
Once again, a good guy with a gun…
I’ll just leave this here.
“The five wounded officers and a sixth employee also wounded are expected to survive.”
So he has a problem with task completion. No wonder he was being terminated.
There was a comment on a Fox news thread the other day about us being past due for another “mass shooting.” If we just had stronger gun control laws, we could fix this problem. (hand wringing and throat/pearl clutching) /s/
I wonder why that “No gunz allowed” sign didn’t stop this? It’s posted in a prominent place and is right at the front door. #gunzsignsmatter
I like the signs prominently displayed at the gate of just about every place I went in the Viet of the Nam.
“CLEAR ALL WEAPONS”
It assumes you and everyone else is armed.
Just clear your damn weapon.
Should something come up, unclear it.
Pretty simple concept.
Simple solutions to complex problems are not allowed.
Simple problems are required to have complex solutions.
No reason, it just policy.
Guards at the gates of NAS Corpus Christi always ask if there are any weapons in the car. Not sure how Daniel King answered that question, or even if he answered. It all came crashing down in the end.
https://www.caller.com/story/news/local/2019/02/15/man-37-fatally-shot-after-fiery-crash-nas-cc-identified/2881148002/
Fact is, he had a DV and a felony conviction on his record which should have prevented him from owning a weapon in the first place.
The sign on the front door worked out great to keep everyone safe, didn’t it?
/sarc
10-15% of Americans have an IQ below 93 according to researchers with some placing it at the 10% level and high estimates at the 15% level.
What does this mean?
People with an IQ below 93 are far more prone to using violence to solve problems and far less likely to experience empathy toward others. This population is also basically shut out of the modern economy. No one is sure what to do with or about these people.
While violence in the USA is not completely committed by this population, a very high percentage is.
IQ testing is rejected by the left as some of of “ism”–pick your ism of the day–yet it might shed light on the true nature of the problem here.
Just thinking out loud on this one.
Reminds me of the studies focusing on the foreheads of criminals. Seems there was some correlation.
Have an adult relative that consistently tested in the 63-66 range. Rather passive individual but Yuuuge.
My score was lost in the records fire.
The “ism” most likely to be the liberal trope in this shooting may be racism, as the perp was black–so wait for media cries of racial discrimination–after all, it was a black man being let go from his job.
On the other hand, we may hear very little media outcry because of that very fact–that the perp was black. Their calls for more gun laws may be somewhat muted as well since Martin was a convicted felon and therefore already breaking existing gun laws by having one in his possession. Kinda reinforces that old conservative adage that if guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns. Not to mention he completely ignored the gun-free workplace policy.
Oh my, what’s a liberal reporter supposed to do?
“Oh my, what’s a liberal reporter supposed to do?”
Ignore it and go back to outrage Russia.
The Aurora PD chief said, later today, that Martin was given an FOID card, after a background check, by the state of Illinois, allowing him to buy the S & W .40 pistol. He then applied for a CPL and that background check turned up his felony conviction from Mississippi. The Illinois State police then sent him a letter asking that he turn in the gun!! They apparently couldn’t be bothered to go take the gun.
I saw that too. What in the actual fuck? He’s committing a felony by being in possession of the firearm. You’ve got PC, go get him.
It’s a normative curve so people at 85 or below would constitute 15.8% of the population or about 52 million…so 93 being still in the first standard deviation of the curve it would be considerably more than that.
Maybe your figures are also limited by a factor such as age range?
…and that 85 mark is interesting, because that is the correlation to an ASVAB score so low the Armed Forces will not take you for anything.
I thought 85 correlated to 1 SD, which is 68 percent, so anyone at the low end would (in theory) have a AFQT of 32.
That might be cutoff today, but I was Company Yeoman in boot back in the day, and well, let’s just say we had more than a few Cat IVs.
85 is right at the 1SD/2SD mark….68% are 1SD above and below (34 percent to each side).
I have not calculated the numerical correlate of the ASVAB myself, only read that the cutoff point for service based on the ASVAB basically correlates to an IQ of 85.
I know that’s a bit loose, but the ASVAB has changed over the years and I’m not publishing a paper rather just having a conversation.
The ASVAB used to be a score that Mensa would take for admission, but after a certain change they stopped doing it, stating it was inadequate as a measure of IQ compared to standards like Standford-Binet.
The correlation is however something I’ve seen repeatedly and long after that change which altered Mensa’s policy. So I dunno YMMV. 🙂
sorry for the typos…I didn’t proofread.
That thing about the correlation between low IQ and low academic performance is not true.
I have an IQ of 79 and I am very intelligent and very good looking.
Your mama told you that just to make you feel better.
Yeah, their “no firearms” sign and Illinois Gun Laws sure did wonders to prevent that!!!
Gun free zones kill….
98% of all mass shootings occur in gun free zones…
Remember, concealed means secret.
Thank you to the cops that actually did their jobs, went into an active shooter situation.
That didn’t happen in lots of places. Columbine, Orlando, Parkland and many others.
Those were where the cops just stood outside until they thought the shooter had run out of ammo.
The shooting in Sutherland Springs church in Texas was stopped by a neighbor, Stephen Willeford in his jammies and slippers that heard it happening and went in.
Truly a good guy with a gun…
Read more about it here !!!
https://www.texasmonthly.com/articles/stephen-willeford-sutherland-springs-mass-murder/
To be fair to the Columbine cops, that’s how we were trained back then. Parkland guys had absolutely no excuse.
Yep, SOP was form a perimeter, wait for SWAT. After Columbine, all us road dogs got active shooter training. I remember how eye opening it was when we did scenarios with simunitions. As the responding officers we got shot virtually every time because the offenders could hear us coming and ambush us. But not responding never entered our minds-to stand outside a school and wait while people are dying? I’d rather die trying than live as a coward.
Building the “Red team” from other than cops is helpful.
Alyssa Milano hardest hit that it was a gun-free zone.
The shooter was fired from probably the best job he ever had, and the cops still don’t have a motive? DaFug.
But…. But…. It’s a gun free zone !!!!
On the flip side the definition of insanity is doing the same thing expecting a different result
Using a laser sight.
+50 mass killing machine
Time to ban weapons of war
Nobody needs a laser sight
Yada yada yada!
Companies need to be held financially responsible for encouraging gun crime on their premise with their gun ban policies. If your policy is to bar good guys with guns you either hire adequate armed security and check people for weapons at entrances or you allow lawful carry. This getting to escape from the irresponsibility of policies that attract this type of crime is disgusting.
I have been repeatedly told that it is generally cheaper to pay off multiple life insurance policies than to defend against lawsuits for the actions of one employee defending themself.
This is particularly true when the dependents only get to recover the worker’s compensation death benefit, which in many states is only about $200K for adults.
That’s an interesting legal concept, FC. But for the fact that the employer’s policy interfered with the dead employees’ right to legally defend themselves in the absence of the employer alternatively providing that protection, their deaths may well have been prevented.
There is a legal doctrine called detrimental reliance, a form of estoppel, where one party relies on the assurances of another to his own detriment. I once sued a company, citing detrimental reliance, that offered me a job then backed out at the very last minute, after I had turned down a subsequent job offer–I collected a nice two-year salary settlement.
It would be interesting to see if such a reliance concept could be applied to personal safety, wherein it is a duty of the employer to provide a safe workplace when it denies its employees the right of self defense.
What say you legal eagles lurking here?
In the absence of a known threat, i.e., that this particular employee was a threat known to the employer, the employer will not be held civilly liable to family members, plus in many states their only remedy will be death benefits under the state’s worker’s compensation system, their exclusive remedy. According to the information provided so far, there is no indication that this guy was expected to go postal. An employer’s rule that firearms are not allowed on the business premises is quite common and does not, standing alone, afford a basis for civil liability in the case of a criminal attack by anyone, including a disgruntled or fired employee.
Thank you, Counselor. It’s good to have you guys here even if your profession doesn’t get shown much respect by this unbridled bunch. Of course, we all know who’s responsible for that:
Our very own late, lawn-dart lawer.
Terrain Pull up, Terrain Pulsplat
I am still dumbfounded he passed the California bar exam, as it has been one of the most difficult ones in the U.S. for over 40 years. Generally, about only 60% or less some years pass it on their first attempt.
I don’t recall anyone saying Bernath was stupid, rgr769, just full bore crazy.
Well, most of the lawers I’ve known over the years have some connection with reality, which usually helps when one is taking a test that lasts for three days and requires the some analytical skilz. The human lawn dart never seemed to know when to stop digging.
Nah, he was pretty fucking stupid, too.
Stalking a former SEAL kinda settles that argument.
Especially with all that hair…
Full bore crazy does as well,
Ford / Chevy argument.
My sympathies to the families of those killed.
On another note, “fitted with a laser sight”.
So kids, hold on tight to your laser sights because they’ll be on the banned lists coming to a town near you soon.
By the way, I can’t wait to see Pelosi or someone of her ilk, holding up a Trijicon or Eotech sight and looking through it backward.
“I see no downside to my policies”
“I am gonna keep holding this thing even though I cannot see shit.
They never gonna know I don’t know how to turn them on”
AW1Ed thank you Sir. The entire Obama and liberal Democrat platform summed up in one picture. A picture is worth a million words in this case.
Secret Service guys laughing till milk comes out their noses.
Another mass shooting at a “gun-free” zone… when will the libs/socialists ever learn?
Another Christin, white male with a MAGA hat?
Close. Black dude with a felony.
So, let’s see if I have this right.
The government raids sixty-six year old Roger’s Stones house with “about a dozen officers with heavy weapons and tactical vests”, but a convicted felon (Gary Martin) “after his felony conviction was discovered, the State police SENT HIM A LETTER telling him to voluntarily relinquish the weapon to police.”
She (Aurora Police Chief Kristen) said she doesn’t know why Martin ended up keeping the gun, and whether law enforcement followed up with him.
She (Aurora Police Chief Kristen…again)said background checks for buying the gun and obtaining the FOID card are different than background checks for the concealed-carry permit.
“The … firearm purchase does not require fingerprint. There is a background check, but no fingerprint is required,” she said.
And NICS didn’t pick up on his felony conviction??
What a bunch of BS!!
https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/16/us/illinois-aurora-shooting/index.html
Yes, it’s complete BS. It’s not as if those wishing to control everyone actually wants to solve “the problem,” or allow those laws already on the books to work. No, no, no. That is the last thing they want. If “the problem” is ever fixed they would have to create a new problem that only they could fix.
You forgot the two armed patrol boats covering Rodger Stones back yard.
The story being put out on the news is Martin acquired the firearm (pistol) before he was convicted, that after his conviction, he was sent the letter to turn in the gun, and he simply never complied.
90’s conviction
FOID check missed it. CCW check found it.
The folks who bounced the CCW app missed the whole “go get it” aspect.
I suspect the investigation for the FOID was pencil-whipped, but someone actually did their job for the concealed-carry permit. Shame the State Police were too busy to do their follow-up.
And in other news – several million gunzzz harmed no one today, and at least a bazillion rounds of ammo did not harm anyone either. Tomorrow’s forecast is more of the same.
Having come across a quote from a pretty smart feller the other day that goes like this:
“Try not to become a man of success but a man of value” – Albert Einstein
And then remembering a conversation with rgr769 from the other day about the Gunga Dan Line, I thought a David Letterman type of Top 10 list would be in order. So here is the TAH official list (by name and total number of days spent on active duty before being kicked to the curb) (actually found a Hell of a lot more than those listed) of Bedwetters:
#10 John Giduck – 58
#09 Dalton Coldiron – 46
#08 Lewis Byrne – 45
#07 Jesse McBeth – 43
#06 Robert Danny Hay – 37
#05 Stephen Kowalyshyn – 36
#04 Robert Joseph Jones – 30
#03 (3 Way Tie) Zachery Smith, Kennis Smith, and Doug M. Sonier – All with 22 days
#02 Sam Sanford?/Samford? – 19
#01 And still the Current Bedwetter of all time is:
Ron Etzig with a whopping 16 days of “Service”.
I’m not computer literate enough to do blog links to each of these individuals, (Hint, Hint to one of the admins who have some extra time) so I guess if you’re interested in learning more, the search block at the top of the page is the way to go./smile
Oops, Sorry, this was supposed to be entered on the WOT, not here.
Mea Culpa/Boy did I ever screw this one up.
(Admin(s) – Can the above comment be moved to the WOT?
Lolz…I earned more leave on active duty than all those fukkers combined served days. 🙂
At 30 days a year, it wouldn’t take that many years. Collectively, all their time in service only adds up to about 335 days.
It was a joke. You’ll laugh later.
Actually 399 days – I added 44 days for the two additional in the tied 3rd place line. Still less that 14 years to beat them.
Looks like even I earned more leave than any of them served (maybe all of them together), and I was Air Guard!
I got more time on the shitter at test depth eating strawberry ice cream while answering a backing bell than these fuckers have, total.
Claw’s comment moved to the WOT as requested.
No, I’m not linking your hit parade of bad actors to blog posts, you can do that yourself easily enough. “Search” is your friend.
The gun he had was the gun he was not lawfully authorized to have. Yet, a senior LEO did not want to politicalize the situation. With a rap sheet an arms length long.
Another mass shooting absolutely preventable.
So … ah … nevermind.
But what do I know.
Check his work history, company security and HR policies and I bet you will find an active shooter chili that was brewing for years.
I am also betting his work attitude and performance was likely less than stellar. Happy to see the popo take him out so the taxpayers don’t have to support him till he is 90.
You both are correct. Note updated comment below.
Employees of civilian companies are not veterans. Only those who served our country are veterans. Shame on you for calling this scumbag a veteran. It’s an insult to all veterans who have or are still serving this country.
You really should look up the definition of the word, David.
You don’t have much of a vocabulary do you
You should probably stop writing before you seriously embarrass yourself and your elementary school teachers. Then, slowly and carefully read the line where the word “veteran” is used. Pay particularly close attention to how it used. You can sound the words out if you need to.
Here’s the definition for ya, David;
“A veteran (from Latin vetus, meaning “old”) is a person who has had long service or experience in a particular occupation or field.”
Let me help, David. From Wiki:
So he was a 15 year veteran of the company he worked for.
Better?
Heh. Great minds and all that, Mason.
Aurora shooter brought gun to termination meeting, opened fire as soon as he was fired, police say
Fox News
Latest.
The Donks of th House are already pushing “background checks” (registration scheme) as a panacea.
Gee. This turd passed one check, and boloed another. Yet the authorities checking did not one blessed thing to him for being a Felon with a CCW app and an issued firearm owners ID, thus presumptively, you know, Armed illegally. Thus, not even a slight hinderance to his rampage.
Hmmmm. Odd that. It’s like the rules are not even intended to actually stop criminals.
Noteworthy that the House Donks have rejected amendments to their scheme that would mandate notifying ICE if illegals, prohibited persons one and all, pop on background checks, you know, illegally trying to obtain arms.
Is nobody going to comment on the bat symbol on the grill of that SWAT vehicle?
Gee, it looks like those nationwide and statewide background checks for firearm purchases are really foolproof. They are doing a great job of keeping convicted felons from purchasing guns. First, he passed a background check to get the state FOID, then he had to have passed another federal background check when he bought the firearm. Then he had the “audacity of hope” to apply for a CCW, which somehow managed to pick up he was a convicted felon. But surprise, surprise, SGT Carter, he ignored the letter that told him to turn in his gun. So let’s see, he committed about five federal felonies in acquiring and possessing a gun and ammunition, plus about five more felonies under state law, including false swearing on the FOID app and the CCW app, but the D-rats are telling us we need more comprehensive background check laws to prevent these shootings. Yeah, RIGHT. Becuz, restrictive gun regs always deter those bent on committing multiple murders, just like those “gun fee zone” signs. The D-rats truly think the majority of the population in this country are retarded and/or totally clueless.