Well, Well, Well – What Have We Here?
No, I didn’t write what follows. But I rather wish I had. I can’t find a damn thing here I disagree with, and it sums up the issue both succinctly and well.
I am skeptical humans are the main cause of climate change and that it will be catastrophic in the near future. There is no scientific proof of this hypothesis, yet we are told “the debate is over” and “the science is settled.”
My skepticism begins with the believers’ certainty they can predict the global climate with a computer model. The entire basis for the doomsday climate change scenario is the hypothesis increased atmospheric carbon dioxide due to fossil fuel emissions will heat the Earth to unlivable temperatures.
In fact, the Earth has been warming very gradually for 300 years, since the Little Ice Age ended, long before heavy use of fossil fuels. Prior to the Little Ice Age, during the Medieval Warm Period, Vikings colonized Greenland and Newfoundland, when it was warmer there than today. And during Roman times, it was warmer, long before fossil fuels revolutionized civilization.
Yes, the above was indeed written by a self-professed “climate change skeptic.” However, you might find the identity of that self professed “climate change skeptic” a bit surprising.
It was written by a guy named Dr. Patrick Moore.
Yes, that Dr. Patrick Moore. The same guy who co-founded Greenpeace and who served as its General Director for seven years. The man just might know a thing or two about science – including the Earth’s environment and how it functions.
I can’t say I see eye-to-eye with Dr. Moore on all issues. But I have to say that I do agree with him here. And I will also say this about the man: he does seem to have the guts to speak the truth as he sees it when doing so is unpopular.
The quote above is from this article by Dr. Moore. It’s not very long, and is IMO very much worth the time to read. It seems I’m not the only one who thinks we ought to “follow the money”.
I’m guessing this ought to go over well among our “good friends” in the grubbing for grants “politically correct conclusions-here” modern-day Luddite global warming “true believer” community. For that crowd it’s really gotta sting when one of the co-founders of Greenpeace tells them they’re full of it and are talking out of their 4th point of contact.
Hell, maybe it will even make a few of their pointy little PC heads explode – figuratively speaking, of course. IMO that would be a good thing. (smile)
Category: Global Warming, WTF?
I work with several PhD scientists and one of them, who is considered Sheldon Cooper smart, but also has commons sense, is on board with the global warming/climate change bs. So, we had a discussion a couple months back and, so I presented their science to him in their methodology and asked him if he were my boss on one of our projects if he would accept my conclusions based on the methodology I used, or would I be fired. He had to look at it objectively and then said “I would fire you”. I then asked him why he accepts that same junk science methodology when used to promote “climate change”? He had no answer.
Did you have to sing Soft Kitty to him afterwards?
Lol!!! No, no soft kitty. He’s actually a really cool guy for being scary smart. He likes guns and hunting, so it’s not all bad. He used to work at SNL (Sandia National Laboratory), which is why I’m surprised that he would accept the junk science of global warming/climate change.
Nobody’s perfect.
According to the EPA, the 6 common pollutants are ozone, particulate matter, carbon MONoxide, nitrogen oxides, sulfur dioxide, and lead.
There is a difference between carbon monoxide (CO) and carbon dioxide (CO2). The former is what the propagandists hope people would easily confuse for carbon dioxide.
Also, the fact that the Romans and others around the Mediterranean wore robes/tunics wasn’t a coincidence. It was brutally hot back on those days compared to now, and the tunics allowed for air circulation. There are ancient depictions of Egyptians wearing even less clothing.
Actually, the most abundant “global warming” substance is H2O, i.e. water vapor.
Anyone interested in REAL climate science should read Watt’s Up With That. From historical records, to poorly placed monitoring equipment and the heat island effect, Anthony Watts is the go to guy for cutting through the global warming/climate change crap.
There are historical reports from the era of the Roman Republic (BC) and Empire (AD) that include the Tiber freezing over more than once, but that it was a rarity. Livy recorded it, as did St. Augustin.
The Tiber appears to have been in ancient times occasionally frozen, at least partially; a circumstance to which the Latin poets repeatedly allude. But we must not construe their rhetorical expressions too strictly; and it is clear from the terms in which Livy notices its being frozen over in the extraordinary winter of B.C. 398, that such an occurrence was of extreme rarity. ( “Insignis annus hieme gelida ac nivosa fuit, adeo ut viae clausae, Tiberis innavigabilis fuerit,” Liv. 5.13.) St. Augustin also alludes to such a winter (apparently the same noticed by Livy), “ut Tiberis quoque glacie duraretur,” as a thing unheard of in his times. (Augustin, Civ. Dei, 3.17.)
I think this debate will not only not end, but spawn some new kind of Gaia worship. Or perhaps it already has? AGW is, after all, an ideology now. What else could follow?
If the Romans weren’t so factory and SUV crazy, the Tiber would’ve frozen more frequently… /sarc
++100.
“Who Founded Greenpeace? Not Patrick Moore.”
http://scienceblogs.com/gregladen/2014/06/27/who-founded-greenpeace-not-patrick-moore/
Turns out Dr. Moore is a paid-4-shill.
Here is what Greenpeace has to say about Dr. Moore.
http://www.greenpeace.org/international/en/about/history/Patrick-Moore-background-information/
So Dr. Moore is a shill for the nuc industry.
Okay, your computer runs on electricity. In fact, your entire household runs on electricity, which you use without thinking about its source. In fact, civilization itself now runs on electricity, and as evidenced by loss of power during severe storms, and the dead battery in your car, as well as the complete breakdown of the infrastructure in ISIS-occupied Iraq, without it there is no clean water, no instant communications, no way to start your car if there is no way to recharge that dead battery. Even the Amish have partly caved in to the modern world.
Power plants use steam from heated water to power turbines that create electrical current that goes to you, the consumer.
You have a choice between electricity powered by a generating plant using some kind of fuel, or no electricity, a world lit and heated ONLY by fire.
No laboratories to create modern medicines. No sterilizing equipment for surgery. No way to charge your cellphone, or run a landline, for that matter. No internet, no nothing. We’ll all just have to move back to the Dark Ages, which is what is happening in ISIS-occupied Iraq NOW. There is no clean water coming out of the faucets any more. The power plant is only able to provide current for about an hour a day, at last report.
You can grumble about the nuke power industry all you like, but your shortsightedness fails to take into account that the ONLY alternatives that are viable for population of almost 7 billion people nuclear power or carbon-fueled power.
Solar power and wind power have proven to be inadequate for any heavily populated area. They are fine for individual and small population consumption.
Which would you prefer? Electricity or the Dark Ages?
I am actually a fan of nuclear energy. The major draw back (besides melt-downs .. which almost never happen) is the 30,000 year half-life of the spent fuel rods.
The amount of water vapor in the atmosphere is self-limiting. The balancing mechanism is called rain.
Actually there’s a very simple solution to spent nuclear fuel, and the French have been doing it for years. You can recycle the spent rods, and use them all over again. Why aren’t we doing this, you ask? Very simple. Government regulators say no. NRC won’t even consider the idea.
There is also the small issue of arms control agreements. One of the natural byproducts of nuclear fission is Plutonium. That can be a bit thorny to deal with. Not that we can’t rework treaties and all. Perhaps its time to consider it.
And most every global warming/climate change proponent is a paid shill of the green industry. So; what’s your point? Algore isn’t running around the world spewing all that CO2 from his private jet to warn the world of global warming/climate change because he cares for the environment. He makes his money the really old fashioned way; scarying dumbasses like you into believing his bullshit.
Tell me; how is it that a trace gas in our atmosphere, which is a fraction of a percent, can be so devastating to our climate by increasing by an even smaller fraction of a percent? If you care to look at “greenhouse gases”; CO2 barely makes honorable mention, because the biggest “greenhouse gas”, by many factors above CO2 is water vapor. Of course the religious zealots of global warming/climate change don’t want to hear that, because there’s no money in claiming man can control water vapor.
Global warming/climate change nutters act a lot like islamic extremists. They want all dissent quashed and the dissenters punished severely, because the dissenters don’t buy into the religion. And that’s exactly what it is; a religion, since they really don’t have any scientific models or methodology that backs their claims without first manipulating the data. The cult of global warming/climate change.
I could spend all day destroying every argument you think you have involving the subject, but there is enough factual science already out there for you to look at, if you are intellectually honest.
“And most every global warming/climate change proponent is a paid shill of the green industry.”
Perhaps … but they don’t claim to be in the CO2 industry, do they?
Al Gore is getting rich being a CO2 shill.
And of Course, Al Gore could buy Mitt Romney 5 times over and still have his private jet and homes left over with some extra in the bank. BUT, Mitt Romney was the evil rich white guy who couldn’t be president because he’s an evil corporation!
Al Gore was the king of hypocrites, until Barry got into the White House, then he had to settle for Silver…
Gore, Barry, fuck ’em both sideways.
They don’t have to, because their funding comes from many different sources. I noticed you can’t refute my claims on the junk science, but that’s OK, we all know that the cult relies more on faith than fact. Carry on at the alter of global warming/climate change. If you ever get around to referencing in manipulated data, let me know.
*un manipulated
Answer my questions on CO2, then you might have a chance at buying a clue.
“Global warming/climate change nutters act a lot like islamic extremists. They want all dissent quashed and the dissenters punished severely … ”
IMO, that is the Quote of the Day.
OS54, like any other liberal cause, it has cult like followers. Christians worship God, the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Liberal moonbats worship global warming, abortion, and the LGBT agenda, condemning anyone who dissents with them like radical muslim terrorists screaming for the extermination of anyone who doesn’t share their beliefs and agenda!
Not a founder, eh?
Try this..
http://www.desmogblog.com/2014/07/12/greenpeace-co-founder-patrick-moore-not-co-founder-all
You didn’t answer my question, 91A10.
Electricity or Dark Ages? Which do you want? If you use batteries, rechargeable or not, they require a power source for manufacturing, whether they are for you cell phone, your computer or your car. If you put a solar panel on your roof, it has to be manufactured from raw materials created in a factory.
You can’t avoid any of that.
Gee, since Moore no longer “toes the party line”, is there any possible reason Greenpeace might want to lie about his status as one of their co-founders?
Don’t bother to answer. The question is rhetorical – well, for anyone with 3 or more working brain cells, it’s rhetorical.
Nice semantics from a blogger with a hatchet.
Greenpeace’s first action/protest was the sailing of the ship “Phyllis Cormack” renamed “Greenpeace”,at the time of the sailing the organization was called “Don’t Make A Wave” it was not until later that a group known as Greenpeace was established.
Dr. Moore sailed with the “Greenpeace”.
So yeah, semantics.
Oh I also noticed your sandy vaginal blogger failed to mention Mr Moore’s years as President of Greenpeace Canada…
A common theme from the left, stray off the chosen course, and the knives come out.
The left used to call it, “global warming” but because the weather that we all experienced over the last 20 odd years did not fit their BS narrative the movement (as in bowel) morphed into “climate change.”
This actually isn’t true – at least not in the scientific community. The term ‘climate change’ was used prior to ‘global warming’ and is still used more frequently, and the two refer to different but related phenomena. Here’s a brief NASA page that has a bit more info:
http://www.nasa.gov/topics/earth/features/climate_by_any_other_name.html
And then you might take a look at this..
http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/graphs_v3/
Of course you have to believe that NASA actually has scientists on board.
You might notice that prior to about 1910 we were actually cooling and in fact probably headed for another ice-age. This is well known in science because the amount of green-house gases had being going down due to the reduction of volcanic gasses (Huaynaputina, Peru 1600 and Krakatoa, Sunda Strait, Indonesia 1883).
Apparently, 91A10, you do not know how to do research. The Tambora volcano erupted in 1815, causing a worldwide drop in temperature. The year of 1816 was labeled ‘the year without a summer’. You should read up on it sometime. It was, in fact, the worst volano eruption in 10,000 years.
Oh, here, this will do. It’s designed for school children to understand.
http://www.volcanodiscovery.com/tambora.html
The volume of particulates and sulfate aerosols (H2SO3) was enormous. The eruption column reached an altitude of 40 to 50 km (about 30 miles).
Any questions?
Are you even remotely aware that at present, there are six major volcanoes now undergoing eruptions, including Erta Ale in Djibouti, which is outgassing a higher-than-normal volume of sulfates and other gases? Are you vaguel aware that solar activity has dropped below ‘normal’ sunspot levels since its solar minimum in 2008-2010?
Your argument does not hold water.
You’re aware of the current controversy regarding the NASA GISS data and it’s post-1987 “adjustments”, right?
Data that has been “adjusted” is suspect as hell. Absent a rigorous analysis of the adjustment methodology, adjusted data should never be used. And even then, it’s better to exclude it in all but the simplest cases (e.g., a single sensor found to be mis-calibrated by a known factor).
Why? Simple. In all but the simplest cases, you never know whether the adjustments are accurate or not.
And if you let me “adjust” raw data as I see fit, I can prove any damn thing I want from any data set.
Scientists like James Hansen, who has been caught manipulating the data? And NASA did/does nothing to set the record straight? Are those the kinds of “scientists” you’re talking about? NASA has become nothing but political. Hell, they ignore and manipulate their own satellite data in order to make it look like it’s warming, when the raw data shows it’s not. Just like the chuckleheads in England that have been caught manipulating the data, but we’re supposed to believe them, because they are at a prestigious university. Michael Mann’s “hockey stick” has been dis-proven so thoroughly that it’s considered a punchline.
Go ahead; keep throwing up examples that have been trashed by real scientists. No matter how you spin it, the non-manipulated data shows flat or slightly decreasing temps over the last 18 years, but since it doesn’t fit the meme, it has to be “massaged” into being what they want. That’s not science, that’s fraud.
As a parting question, which I ask all global warming types; please tell me what the normal average global temperature is supposed to be?
Well, I guess a great many people missed that 2008(!) article, LC, which attributes the popularization of the term global warming to NASA scientist James E. Hansen’s congressional testimony. And then, of course, there was that Al “Airbrush-My-Crotch” Gore’s fanciful and alarmist 2006 mockumentary, “An Inconvenient Truth,” which sealed the deal that global warming was the great threat. (Oh, that poor polar bear floating away!) Over the ensuing years, that hasn’t worked out so well as truth,inconvenient or otherwise, so on came the striking change in language among the same purveyors of global warming propaganda to call it climate change. Well, like it or not, most of us who are among the great unwashed deemed the language change to be manipulative gamesmanship, regardless of when some in the scientific first referred to climate change.
Global warming is real. In the last fifteen minutes, the temperature outside of Stately Stone Manor went from 39 to 41 degrees. Extrapolating 8 degrees per hour, by midnight tonight it should be about 150 degrees.
I look out from inside my house this fine Spring morning and do you know what I see? I see lots of evidence of global warming. It’s white and slushy now and will all be gone by tomorrow. It fell yesterday and most of it will be gone by tomorrow but, at least for today, the evidence is there.
And on a more complicated scale that is what the current climate models do.
GIGO.
Well, global warming IS getting rid of the glacier in my front yard.
OH! The cowbirds, redwing blackbirds and grackles have returned to my kingdom. They do remember me. All is well in my kingdom.
If I could find an island somewhere with whitetail, turkey, pheasant and no woman just to get away from all of these pain in the ass leftist/progressives and all politicians I would consider myself a blessed man.
I know, no such place (really) exists.
Oh, well, you’re welcome at my house. There’s turkey, pheasant, geese, and deer in quantity and plenty of hunting. There are black bear, cougar, bobcats, and coyotes, too. I live in a quiet suburb 30 miles from a large city.
The problem is I will not have a sex change operation just to make you happy. And you have to clean up your own messes.
Ex-PH2 – – I’m sitting here having my afternoon cup of coffee and almost, and I mean it! Almost spit a delicious mouthful of coffee all over my laptop I was laughing so hard.
I’m still laughing!!!!
I think I’ll stay where I am if you don’t mind. 😉
Ex, be careful I know from your posts what a good cook you are. I have been cleaning up by myself for 20 years now. LI, move out to countryside(not the burbs) and stay single . Works for me. I have great Deer hunting in my little 4 acre place. Bird hunting is poor but coming back. Duck and Goose hunting is good. Once in awhile we nieghbors will stop for a cup of time of the Day drink or phone to be sure everything is right in our world. Joe
Get off the whale and out of lower NY. West Virginia is the place for you. You can’t have an island but you can have as many wooded acres as you like and all of the isolation and hunting that you dream about.
2/17 Air Cav
I’ve got too many ties here, chief among them a bunch of grandkids all within 5-10 miles travel. My wife would have my scalp!
The late John Denver had some pretty nice things to say about your state and frankly NY isn’t so bad if about 19.5m of the occupants moved out to the Peoples Republic of California where they belong.
I understand. The thing is, the entire state of WV is like the old Bethpage Park used to be, years ago, except with fewer people and more tees.
As the crow flies I’m about 1.9 miles from the Bethpage course (according to Google earth) – at age 7 I fired my first shotgun (.410 ga) over there right off Central Ave. which borders the park on the South-side.
How times have changed.
Yeah, boy, you would be locked up by Nassau’s Finest quicker than you could eject the shell, nowadays. In most parts of WV, the odd thing is when there is no gunfire heard on Saturdays mornings!
Used to be one of those….Nassau’s Finest.
Hell, when I was a kid my father would cut the top off a few of the .410 shotshells empty the shot – re-crimp and fire in the backyard for the 4th of July. Occasionally he’d do the same with his 12 ga.
I grew up about half way in-between Bill O’Reilly and Billy Joel….never saw O’Reilly, though.
Condor Road…know it? Sparks and Stokes?
Condor is a little over 2 miles South of where I live….you lost me on the Sparks and Stokes.
Those are elementary schools that are on the Hempstead Tpk side of Condor. Sandwiched between them and Hempstead Tpk. was a big lot, vacant but for Egg Hill and Penn Fruit. There’s a shopping mall of some sort there now. Do you recall the little Armed Forces recruitment shacks neay Mays (Hempstead/Jerusalem, as I recall)?
Lets continue at LIRight47 at yahoo dot com
Thanks but no thanks, LIRight. We have enough moonbats, hippies, and fascists here as it is. The reason they congregate in and around LA and San Francisco, with minimal spread to the rest of the state is that we don’t want ’em any more than you do. Like I’ve said before, apart from geography and lack of tornadoes, much of California would fit right in in just about any other state. As an example, I have a cousin who’s a high school history teacher over here. She’s also the head of the school’s NRA- and CRPA-backed 2A Club, with a sizeable active membership (not at all unusual for San Diego County). The parents love it.
One thing that you all unfortunately have in common with the libtards is that, when referring to California, you focus on those coastal cancers and act like the rest of us Californians don’t exist. The lefties do the same thing–hell, they do it on an hourly basis in Sacramento.
I just took Mrs. Whitey to San Francisco for a weekend getaway. I know, I know, it’s Hippie City (it really is), but there’s a lot of cool stuff to see there, and the overpriced food was good. Driving up through the Central Valley, it was refreshing to see every last farmer from Kern County to Suisun Bay letting you know exactly what they think of the democrats, especially Boxer and Pelosi. Take a drive on I-5 or Highway-99 and you’ll see what I’m talking about. The signs are posted every 15 feet for 300 miles. The best one said, “Coming soon, Dustbowl 2.0! Thanks, Nancy Pelosi!”
Come on, we don’t hold Mikey Bloomberg against you upstate New Yorkers. Can’t we get some of the same love in return?
Touche.
I shall now fall on my sword.:)
NY is essentially the same as California…..cities are liberal strongholds (strangle-hold really) that elect the progressives and the real people live out in the country and suburbs.
West Virgnia is where that big radio telescope is located, isn’t it?
No cell phone towers, no big ol’ high tension power lines.
Probably no light pollution, either.
I’ll bet it wouldn’t be too expensive to set up a Very Small Array of old sports satellite dishes 🙂 and start collecting data from yellow dwarf stars. Hmmm….
I am just waiting for some genius to discover that Climate Change is Mother Nature’s method of crop rotation.
By golly, valerie, I think you just hit the nail square on the head!
Can I borrow that?
I got so caught up with the back and forth with 2/17 that I missed Valerie’s comment and you’re right, it’s a good one.
Valerie wins the internets for today
I read a while back that cows producing all that manure was a contributing cause of global change.
So how do you fix that, beat all the cows to death…oh wait thats baby seals. Seriously, I think that if the money for all the studies proving this global change would stop, all the doom and gloom would be over. The ecoLeft could go back to hugging trees and singing songs and doing drugs.So, get rid of the Dept. of Education and let the states handle education. That would end all this global change right away.
Hondo…My spouse is ALWAYS telling people to follow the money. And it’s usually spot on. As for the bull in Global…AlGore now says we should be punished for being climate change deniers. DMML!! And I say that I will turn myself in when ALGORE gets the current Admin to punish its own lawbreakers AND the illegal immigrant lawbreakers to boot. Since we know that WILL NEVER happen, I’m going to the office so I can do more tax returns.
Nobody would be talking about this today if Mount St. Helens had kept her legs crossed and not been able to find her “G Spot” 35 years ago.
Give the old gal a break already./sarc
CLAW131…I had only been in the state a bit over a year and my son was not 3 months old when Mount St. Helens gave the Northwest the big blow job. Looking forward to the 35th anniversary. By the way, I still say fuck old Harry Truman. He wasn’t the conservationist the liberals made him out to be. Just an old codger with his head too old and far up his ass to hear common sense when it was beating him like he owed it money.
Sparks. I thought, why is he saying that about the man whose decision forced the Japanese surrender? I know now, and should have guessed that you would not have omitted the S (which, by the way, stands for nothing)in the former president’s name. Harry (no S) Truman lived on that mountain for 52 years, unconvinced that there was a threat that it would explode. He was wrong. Unfortunately, his error cost the lives of his 16 cats, too. Poor buggers.
Global warming is not about science or the environment. Its about wealth redistribution and that one world government that Bill Gates wants.
The One says I can’t drive Ann SUV or set my thermostat at the temp I want. Why the hell not? I pay my own gas and electric bill. Its about the destruction of private property rights for the 99%.
You actually think Gore and Obama will fly coach in the Brave New World?