UC Irvine students vote to ban flag
Brent and T Breezy send us a link from Fox News‘ Todd Starnes who reports that the Associated Students of University of California (ASUCI) at Irvine voted 6-4 (two abstained from voting) to ban the American flag from their campus;
“Designing a culturally inclusive space aims to remove barriers that create undue effort and separation by planning and designing spaces that enable everyone to participate equally and confidentially,” read the resolution authored by Matthew Guevara.
[…]
Guevara’s resolution, which was in dire need of an edit, rambled on about “paradigms of conformity” and “homogenized standards” and blah, blah, blah.
[…]
“The American flag has been flown in instances of colonialism and imperialism,” he bemoaned. “Flags not only serve as symbols of patriotism or weapons for nationalism, but also construct cultural mythologies and narratives that in turn charge nationalistic sentiments.”
The university grown-ups don’t support this movement, and apparently they won’t concede to this vote. In fairness, there are 22,000 students on this campus and only 6 people voted for the measure and according to the article, not even a majority of the undergrads concur with opinions of Matthew Guevara that were foisted on the student body. But, I think Mr Guevara needs to focus on being a student rather than being an activist. I mean, that’s why he’s in school – to learn – not to make himself look like an uneducated twit.
Category: Dumbass Bullshit
There is a very simple solution to moronic activity like this. Let it be known, by the federal government, that ALL federal money will be shut off, effective immediately, to the university. All grant money, research money, etc. Every last damn dollar.
Then, call in all the student loans, payable at once, in full, and slam the student’s credit reports if they aren’t paid within 30 days.
You don’t get to take Uncle Sam’s money and not respect Uncle Sam, even if his money was forcefully taken from the taxpayers.
I don’t know if I’d go that far. Unfortunately, since disrespecting the flag is considered to be speech, the government can’t do anything about it. They can’t call in the student loans because how can you tell who supported this or not?
Best we could really hope for would be a massive boycott on donations from alumni, but this is California we’re talking about. That would only happen if they banned the Mexican flag.
Oh, you’d be surprised. Some fine young intellectual Giants at SDSU tried flying the Mexican flag on the university flagpole a few years back. You should have seen the shitstorm that little stunt kicked up! Suffice it to say, Old Glory went back up where she belonged and the numbnuts refrained from trying that crap ever again.
A lot of dumbass double talk by a freaking Mexican! If you don’t like the flag of the country you are standing on, then mexican …GET THE PH-CK OUT!!!Go back to the shythole you crawled out of!
Personally, I’d do that anyway. The government shouldn’t be in the business of grants, loans or education.
Half the reason college is so expensive is because of the government push to make it ‘affordable’ by giving away loans to everyone who wants one.
Also, the only way to control federal over reach is to control the federal money. If they don’t have any skin in the game, they can’t tell you how to play.
“Half the reason college is so expensive is because of the government push to make it ‘affordable’ by giving away loans to everyone who wants one.”
Bravo! But they don’t get it. Ergo, Affordable Healthcare.
Stand by for Community College tuition to skyrocket.
And your moronic plan would make us an exploited periphery country in the international economy within a generation.
And the social security system, medicaid/medicare, and VA assistance you are probably getting would be unfunded.
You idea would LITERALLY destroy our national strength.
You are not just a fucking moron you are a traitor. You want to weaken our nation and make the US public a low skilled labor market for other nations to exploit.
Let’s make the entire defense sector privately funded. Turn the US military into a private army. Why don’t we make all police privately funded?
Why don’t we sit back and let all defense research privately funded?
If you want to have ideological purity for your moronic ideology stop cashing your social security checks, stop taking VA assistance.
People like you are truly the ones destroying our nation. And you do it all the while claiming to be “freedom loving patriots.”
“If you want to have ideological purity for your moronic ideology stop cashing your social security checks, stop taking VA assistance.”
Both are earned benefits paid for with either money (social security) or service (VA/military retirement). Using your logic, people shouldnt draw from their own bank account or 401k either.
What have people to earn their entitlement programs like welfare?
AW1 Tim:
There’s only one solution to this bullshit. And that’s for we, the people, to step the fuck up and do our duty as citizens of a republic and put the boot, hard, against all the bullshit.
This crap goes on because we, the people, sit on our hands and let it happen.
That is precisely why this is happening.
And it was not banned from campus.
Irvine is the bastion of conservative thought in conservative Orange County, CA.
Note that the flaming liberals of UC Berkeley still proudly fly the Stars and Strips.
Yes. UC Berkeley is still flying the flag.
As is UC Irvine. The flag is not banned from campus.
The student council only voted to remove it from the student council lobby because the student council represents all students and due to cuts in public funding the student body is now 9% international students and climbing.
UC Berkeley is more than 13% international students. And climbing.
Why the Fuck isn’t an American university’s student population represented by an American flag? If someone doesn’t like the American flag being flown then they don’t need to live here at all. End of story. Full fucking stop.
Can we ban all federal aid to students at the people’s republic of UC Irvine
UC schools already get less pubic funding per student than private schools like Harvard, Stanford, or Yale.
They shouldn’t receive any public money at the college and university level. None of them should.
The college admins should learn to keep the financial needs of their schools to within the tuition costs of their student body.
Cut the fluff, cut the faculty perks, cut all the unnecessary classes and faculty that infest them, and focus on actually educating their students.
so damn clueless.
Yes; yes you are fucking clueless. With no incentive to compete with other colleges because former elite colleges can coast on reputations earned long before modern grants, those same colleges in modern times have ZERO reasons to compete. That applies to ANY business. More so if the Government can force people to buy a business’s product.(ODUMBASS CARE)
taylor, you are the only clueless twatwaffl on this thread. There was no reason for you to post a comment like that. You did that for the sole purpose of needling someone, which is not the purpose of the blog.
If you want to make enemies you’re doing a heckuva job, brownie. You can always start your own blog to spread venom, lickspittle. This isn’t a forum for letting your neighbors know how much you despise them. The air will certainly be a whole lot clearer if you do that.
In fact, anyone here would gladly encourage you to find the nearest door, and don’t let it hit you in the ass on the way out. Be a stranger.
Pubic funding? When did state schools start getting that?
I thought Annie Sprinkle was the only recipient of pubic funding.
Looks like lars the cankerblossom’s proofreading isn’t any better than his reading and comprehension. That should put a damper on his own pubic relations, don’tcha know.
Now there’s six students in particular destined for absolute failure.
Or a oval office.
“Oval Office” and “Failure” are interchangeable these days.
I wonder if the little snowflakes will either blame Bush for any backlash they get, or will they just label it as “racist”?
It’s nice how 6 little commie kids make a decision like that and the other 22,000 effectively do nothing.
Pull their federal funding AND shut down their ROTC program. (Yes – they have ROTC there).
Don’t want to offend anyone by using money with United States of America or In God We Trust printed in it.
Screw Kalifornia…
The 22,000 student body probably didn’t know what the Student Kommisar Kouncil did until after the “vote” was done. Transparency, don’cha’know?
But I agree with the general consensus (does that make it a “settled science”?) that ALL federal funds be pulled from “publicly” funded colleges (to start).
But I always liked to dream big.
Idiotic.
Oh, look, lars the cankersore is annoyed that someone thinks he should have tp pay the same tuition as peeps at private schools do.
Ain’t that sad? NOT.
Still, trying to needle people for no reason other than he can, too, which means his only intent in posting this comment was to pick a fight. Says a lot about his pubic relations, too.
Sounds like its right out of the textbooks about Che Guevara and Marx.
I’d take a stab that he’s got a Mexican flag flying at his house, or maybe even hanging from his rear view mirror.
I’d concur with Tim that they don’t like the American Flag, but they sure do like being a citizen, they like going to a school that’s supported with state and federal monies, and enjoy the subsidies they are probably living with.
Like Merle haggard sang, “They love our milk and honey…”
Trace Adkins Fightin Words is good too.
Six votes out of ten in their little group was all they could muster – six immature, bed-wetting attention-seeking dipshits.
Trolls. Ignore them and they’ll wither away.
No, that’s the problem, they don’t go away. They leave college part time, work for Soreass soros and protest at every chance they get…
I lived through the recall of Scott Walker and remember seeing all these idiots protesting him. These dumb asses are part of the trust fund crowd and should just have the shit kicked out of them…
What a lamebrain. This moron should learn what it’s like to NOT live in a country where the privilege of getting an upper-level education is not a privilege, reserved only for those who are in an elite genetic class, e.g., royalty.
I don’t remember if it was Irvine or Berserkley, but the original hippie ‘revolution’ started at one of the UCa campuses in 1960, when some students decided to exercise their right to free speech, and gathered on the front steps of the admin building, reading the works of Socrates, Plato and Aristotle. The Dean of the University was appalled. It just went from there.
These idiots have no clue.
Ola! ‘Che’! Pendejo! Tu es una norteamericana, imbécil! Si no te gusta este país, volver a su país de mamá!
Yep. If he doesn’t like it here, no one is forcing him to stay.
Yeah. When UC Berkeley explicitly banned any political discussion not approved by the campus administration they had every right to do that because free expression should only be allowed when approved by the state!
Fuck those “hippie” Berkeley students for defending the fist amendment and protesting the ban on unapproved political topics!
Reagan was right to decide it was an insurrection and deploy troops to crush it. These students were demanding the right for free, non-state approved, expression on campuses nationwide! How DARE THEY! TRAITORS!
/end sarcasm
You are a moron.
What the bloody hell are you babbling about this time, taylor? Are you actually that dense?
Ronald Reagan did not become the governor of California until 1967. He was still hosting GE Theater in 1960, you moron. He quit acting in 1964 to go into politics.
I said, very clearly, that the students at Berserkley pulled that stunt in 1960.
Your reading and comprehension skills leave MORE than a great deal to be desired. You just keep proving that you have no idea what you’re talking about.
At this point, you’ve proved, in spades, that you are so stupid you don’t even know you’re alive. You’re a boring, self-involved jackass with a brain the size of a baby lima bean.
The free speech movement at Berkeley was 1964-1965. (noticed you completely dodged the issue that you know fuck all about why they were protesting).
Reagan used the movement as a foil during his entire campaign for the Governorship. He made it a central theme of his campaign.
Since I had not referred to the history of the movement in quite some time I did not recall which governor had ordered the troops. But my characterization of what Reagan felt about the movement is absolutely accurate.
But don’t avoid the FACT that you seem to think defending free speech is a hippie or liberal things to do. It is sad that conservatives think that is a bad thing.
The incident I’m referring to took place BEFORE 1964, dork. I was still in high school. Kennedy had not been elected. The news about this INCIDENT, which was all it was considered to be at the time, was brief and was accompanied by a black & white video of men and women students engaged in doing this ‘reading’.
The men were dressed in suits and ties, the women in dresses and skirts with below-the-knee hemlines. The UC women had the typical pageboy, bell and flip hairstyles that were in vogue. Some of them were even wearing scarves as headbands, because that was what I was wearing in my hair. The miniskirt had not been invented by Mary Quant and the Beatles had not even been heard of. I was in high school when this happened and in my history class, we were discussing the French-Indochina war.
There were no hippies anywhere in 1960. They did not exist. The closest you could get to anything like that was beatnik coffeehouses, and that was beginning to fade because it was mostly leftover from the post-war 1940s and 1950s, and people were busy making a living.
It was a small, odd item on the evening news. If you think I don’t remember these things, you are sadly mistaken. Sometimes, the small, odd news items are remembered because they led to other, larger items. This was only one of many events that led to bigger events later.
You weren’t even an egg in your mother’s ovaries back then. You have nothing because you have no memories or background for my generation. You are a waste of time.
Got that, sport?
Oh, yes – this attempt to twist my words is as childish as you can get, taylor.
‘But don’t avoid the FACT that you seem to think defending free speech is a hippie or liberal things to do. It is sad that conservatives think that is a bad thing.
My offhand remark that a bunch of UC students gathered to do readings from the classics at the campus admin building, which annoyed the Dean of Students, is taken out of context by you – as is everything else you say.
What you said about me is a blatant lie.
What I said was nothing more than an observation of something that happened that briefly got attention in the news and then faded.
Your attempt to twist my remembering this INCIDENT, which is all it was at the time it happened, into the presumptuous assertion on your part that I despise people who express themselves freely is not only a lie, it is also another display of your arrogance and your obnoxious attempts to bait people, which is just about the only thing you know how to do.
You can twist what I said all you want to. Kick your little propaganda machine up all you like. You’re still nothing but a facile, arrogant, lazy, self-absorbed, pseudo-intellectual clown.
You are, without a doubt, the most dislikable excuse for a human being ever.
I despise you for what you tried to do.
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I’ve about had my fill of Lars “Fucking” Taylor. I’ve blocked him so that I at least won’t have to look at his Facebook comments anymore. (Only the second person I’ve ever blocked on Facebook, btw.)
Back of PH2
I interpreted your comment about Hippies at UC Berkeley (you used the word initially) and free speech to be about the free speech movement which a well known event in 1964-1965.
I had not idea that you were referring to some news broadcast that you saw this one time while watching TV four years prior.
I did not see the news broadcast but if you saw students reading ancients on the steps of Sproul Hall in protest to the campus restriction on speech they were probably reading topics that the campus had prohibited and were using the ancients to demonstrate their the policy effected even discussing revered ancient philosophers.
Perhaps you should pay closer attention to what you read – if you’re capable of doing so, that is. Her original comment on the issue very clearly said she was referring to an incident occurring in 1960.
No, I will not back off, taylor.
You are nothing more than a pretentious ass who likes to poke people until they are ready to st7uff your useless face into the toilet.
If you want to be a pompous ass and sneer at people, go spend your time in a bar full of winos. You’d be in real good company then. You’re just about down at their social level.
(I just read his post)
It’s “off” dumbass. Now let me give you a real fucking history lesson, and no I obviously wasn’t there since I’m 31. Unlike you I actually fucking read shit that isn’t completely left wing.
It is well known that medical supplies, and food supplies were sent to the NVA and VC by Berkeley in the fucking 60s. It is also well known that the KGB heavily influenced the “peace movement” during the 60s. The only fucking thing your hippies did was support Communism. This is something I alluded to in our previous “discussions.” Leftists like you are AGAINST free speech or you wouldn’t do so much to stifle it. Hiding behind the Constitution while burning our Fucking FLAG is weak sauce.
Kinda interesting how the worm has turned Eh?
You would say burning the U.S. flag is protected speech right? Displaying the flag would also be protected speech.
So those ass clowns who voted for this really are denying free speech.
Damn oppressive bastards.
Sounds like those folks certainly have made UC-Irvine A-SUC-I place.
I wonder if they will ban the gay pride flag?
Ban one, ban them all.
Green Thumb…A big Roger That Sir! No other nation’s flag, Gay Pride, Commie, Green Peace or any other flag, including sports, on campus if it have been approved. But I am sure this disloyal little, should have been swallowed mattress stain fuck head, already had another flag in mind, had the grown ups allowed this. I am also sure he was fully backed and egged on by several of his tenured, liberal, cock smoking professors and TAs. Screw him and screw them.
As for MY money to send them to school, screw em. I worked all my life and saved to send my son to college. He worked in high school and during college to help pay his way and he paid for his own Masters. His saving grace was, having an honors GPA, plus a well rounded application which got him some financial help from the university itself, mostly in the form of, head of the line for, on campus job opportunities. Several reasons why no loans. I taught him not to live in debt except a mortgage. Also should we have even wanted loans, we didn’t qualify. If you work for a living anywhere in the middle class your out of the running, even if you’re “working poor”. Too much income they say. If he had been a minority with welfare class income or…the trifecta…a black female on welfare (lesbian helps and gender preference WAS on the apps if you chose to “self identify”), they won’t stop throwing money at you. Then they will pretty much forgive the loans when the person says, I can’t afford to pay it back. Whether they finish their free college education or not.
so much stupid in this thread.
Including yours, Lars.
L. Taylor…I’m not feeling so great today so I’ll keep it short. GFY and then GFY and then go pound sand in your ass. Fucker anyway!
Well here’s an idea…quit reading and posting to it you twit.
This story was misinformation.
Sorry I am interrupting you circle jerk of ideological masturbation.
No you’re not. You’re fapping yourself silly being the asshat you are.
The only stupidity here is what you bring to the table, Lars. Ironic that you are ALL for freedom of speech and expression, unless of course what is said or expressed contradicts your POV.
I have a new neighbor down the street who thought it would be cool to fly a gay pride flag from the flagpole of the house they just bought, to the disgust and irritation of pretty much everybody in our quiet little SoCal mountain town. To express what I think of that, and of the transplanted flatlander who did it, I just ordered a 48-star Flag to fly from mine, as a reminder of better days when such things were not flaunted or celebrated. If they complain, I’ll just go full redneck and start flying the Southern Cross below it, as two of my other neighbors already have.
Ah yes, the old 48 star. 1958 was such a simpler time, eh?
A time when blacks couldn’t vote, all our enemies were commies and queers kept their mouth’s shut.
I’m sorry to say, but times are changing. I hate to break it to you, but ALL people deserve equal rights. I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but your closed minded bigoted views are no longer accepted as valid opinion. The Constitution does not exclude someone based on who their religion, race or sexual proclivity.
And finally, before I hit “post comment” and the dog pile on my comment, or my “liberal”, or perhaps “elitist” point of view begins, some of you clearly don’t understand the the 1st Amendment isn’t about protecting popular speech. It is about protecting UNPOPULAR speech.
Notice that I haven’t vandalized their house or stolen their gay pride flag. I simply choose to excercise the same 1st Amendment right as they do. I disapprove of the gay pride movement. I picked a somewhat subtle method of expressing that disapproval. And I most certainly do not emulate the chickenshit of the westboro baptist church (those douchebags don’t rate proper noun status in my book) with “God hates fags” signs or any of that crap.
According to the LA Times, the students voted to remove all flags:
http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-american-flag–ban-uc-irvine-20150306-story.html
It was a resolution, the student council rejected it.
http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-uci-vote-to-ban-american-flag-others-misguided-20150307-story.html
The University does not approve of the action:
http://news.uci.edu/briefs/campus-statement-on-flying-the-american-flag/
From this brief exercise in google I conclude:
a. it was a resolution, not the act of the full student council
b. the student council, student body, and university opposed it and killed it
c. much ado about 6 wackos
Commissar enjoys twisting the tiger’s tail but he isn’t good at it – he gets his facts wrong so he looks like ass when corrected by his betters. Taylor stands for things – but he doesn’t understand the things he stands for, he uses erroneous and disconnected facts and he uses them incorrectly, and he confuses correlation and causation so his reasoning is laughable.
Attacking, Lars leads the legion of history against the forces of darkness. Only his sword is broken and history is half a mile back laughing its ass off and flying the “enemy” flag. The forces of darkness keep interfering with the attack by shining spotlights in his eyes.
I can’t lie, I give less than zero Fucks about the national flag. I care about the Texas and Louisiana state flags much more.
The federal gov’t is not my friend, their symbols are not my symbols. Texas didn’t trade terrorists for a deserter. Louisiana didn’t charge and fire The Bonus Army.
10thMountainMan…I respect your opinion sir. But when I left base camp and upon returned, it was not my home state’s flag I looked for or which gave me the lift in my spirit, it was Old Glory.
Just out of curiosity, with your screen name I assume you spent some time in the Army and carry enough pride in that fact to proclaim that you were assigned to the 10th Mountain.
You do realize that service in the Army required us to possibly sacrifice for not only two states but the whole nation.
The Flag represents our nation, not its government.
What he said…
I often defend others rights, even if they use them to do shit that pisses me off. They have a right to piss me off.
Those who served with me, those who served before and after me did so under our national standard.
That flag does not represent everything I see wrong with our country, it represents everything I see right about it.
To me, it is a symbol that I will cower before no man. I have met the enemy, I have seen their way of life and that flag is a statement that I and my fellow Americans will not live under their rule.
To me it represents our united message that this nation with all its shortcomings and flaws will stand united against against tyranny.
I do not like many things about our current leaders or our President, but they are our leaders and I do love my country.
Sounds good, Dave. I don’t know when it happened, but at some point I only saw the bad and forgot about the good. Thanks, bro.
Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.
However, if that’s indeed your true opinion . . . then IMO perhaps you should renounce your US citizenship and emigrate.
Good luck on finding someplace better.
I think I’ll just stay on the Bayou.
Hondo, I think you’re a great dude as far as I know. And I can’t think of one comment you’ve posted that I thought was off or wrong. That said…
First, I know I was being a prick earlier. Don’t let it sink, I’m a wild man and I talk fast. I was just pissed about something or other and spewed some shit. Forgive me please.
Secondly, do you think America will “recover?” I put recover in quotes because I can’t think of better word right now. But it seems like things are shitty right now and that it might be terminal. Did you ever read the lines from that fat Englishman?
“The walls of gold entomb us, the swords of scorn divide.”
Share some wisdom, gray-beard. Is it going to get better, or is it all traitors, debt, intrigue, scandal, and gunpowder for the next century?
Hey 10th, our Nation has been bruised and has her share of problems, but she’s always righted herself. Yep – we all bitch about the bad stuff (I know I do), but there’s plenty of good too. You saw something worth fighting for before so don’t give up on her yet.
Also, could I renounce my citizenship and stay in Texas? And not pay taxes anymore? I didn’t get an Obamaphone, I didn’t get bailed out, and I don’t need the ACA. Man I’d live like Midas without taxes. Holy shit, the thought makes my dick harder than Japanese arithmetic.
The flag does not represent the federal government, 10th Mountain, it represents ALL of the states, both those that exist now through the symbol of 50 stars placed upon the Union, as well as the original 13, as represented by the 13 red and white stripes. The Union itself has a dual meaning, as do the stripes. The Union also serves as a constellation of stars in the night sky, and the stripes as rays of light shining down from heaven. Our flag is a symbol of unity of all of the states in a federated system of government, something that was clearly seen as being divinely inspired by the designer. You can’t be loyal to only 2 of the stars on the flag. We are 1 nation, united, not 50, divided.
As I often do, I hearken back to Johnny cash introducing “Ragged Old Flag” when he upheld free speech and said “Even burning the flag.(boos.) Hush now… yes, you have the right to burn the flag. But we also have the right to bear arms… and if you burn my flag I will shoot you. But I’ll shoot you with love in my heart, like a good American”. As someone said…the First even covers unpopular speech. But free speech does not excuse the consequences of unpopular speech, and you must also face the consequences of what you say.
Me, I look at Lars as intelligent and somewhat articulate, and a shining example I can point to when someone say “everyone in the military is a brain-dead Republican redneck”. I don’t agree with about 99% of what he says, and think his BS-tank is filled clear to the top – but he sure is a great example of intellectual diversity among the ex-military.
Matthew is probably getting a degree in “Wymyn’s Studies” at UCI and planning on using it to further his professional career as a barista…
That or he’s getting one in say, “Gender Studies” or “Social Studies” on the seven-year BA plan, and he’ll be just another one of those “Occupy’ pukes demanding a six-digit starting salary and keys to the Executive Washroom “Because it’s only fair”!
Ah, you guys have it all wrong. It isn’t about those basket-weaving social media studies that embrace everyone, and the can’t we all get along philosophy.
It’s about how the good ol’ USofA should not exist because all these people who immigrated here from other countries decided that being a live American, with possibilities, was better than being a dead or starving person some place else, with zero possiblities.
There are people in this world who simply don’t get that Americans are allowed to have national pride, too.
Besides – Guevara? He’s a chicano, probably from Cuban boat people, who despises his own origins and thinks that being called Latino is disgusting. So he’s deflecting his Latin background away from him, but demanding this ‘open cultural space’ twaddle. That way, no one can make nasty remarks about Hispanics. Can they, Mateo?
Also note that there were only 6 of them altogether. No one else joined them.
I bet the only flag that kid likes to seeing fluttering in the breeze is rainbow colored.
Yeah, sniveling snotnosed glitter-farting creampuff Sparkle Ponies like him and his ilk would applaud anyone stomping on or desecrating an American Flag, but I bet they’d demand that you. me, or anyone else be arrested and imprisoned the moment we did that to a gay pride, Cuban, or Mexican flag, or say, a Che Guevara or 0bama flag!
I’ve been having an ongoing argument with one of my fellow Marines on this subject since yesterday. He is so blinded by liberal ideals that he can’t see what this truly means. His argument is that it is just a flag that was picked from a school project that received a B+, blah blah blah. No matter what iteration the US flag has gone through it represents our values and unity as a nation and so many have fought and died to preserve that.
Your friend was correct and it is you that is blinded.
The student government offices are tucked away in the back of a campus building.
One of the students took it upon himself to hang a flag on the wall outside the student council office.
It created a controversy since the student council represents all students and many are international students (9%).
The student council voted 6-4 to remove the flag from their wall.
It is a non-story. It was probably the appropriate thing for a representative body that represents students from 72 different nations right now.
Well by all means let’s add some more flagpoles at our Nation’s Capitol too.
Congress does not represent internationals living in the US. Only US citizens can vote.
A student council represents all students because all students vote for their representatives, including international students.
How do 10 people effectively represent 72 countries?
And if you don’t think Congress represents non-Americans, why are they so hell-bent on kissing the illegal alien’s asses?
Coming from a state being bankrupted by illegals I figured that you of all the talking heads would see that.
I believe it was a California school that banned American flagged shirts during Cinco de Mayo so it wouldn’t offend the Hispanics. I suppose December 7 is next followed by January 15 and so on. California is acting like Germany in the mid 30’s.
You received a high enough score on the ASVAB to serve?
Oh, is that your way of hitting back, taylor? You have to poke somebody just to see what it takes to piss him off?
What does the ASVAB or his test score have to do with what he said?
NOTHING.
You just keep making a bigger and bigger ass of yourself in front of the entire world when you do that. There was no reason for you to make a comment like that, was there?
No, but you do have this desperate need to find some way to let everyone know what a scurrilous sewer rat you are. We already know that, so give it up.
Go make enemies some place else.
Ex-PH2: you don’t suppose UC-Berkeley could be trying their own version of “Project 100,000”, do you? (smile)
That is a good question, Hondo. I don’t want to hazard a guess on it right now.
I certainly did.
And while we’re at it, I’ll put my SAT and ACT scores up against yours anytime.
I received a 32 on the ACT. So 98th percentile. First try. No prep.
My score was effected by the science portion (last portion). I received a 28 on the science but my test was interrupted and ended early.
I was taking it in the education center and someone screwed up the calendar. An AIT class came in for a scheduled test and disrupted my test. I was not allowed to complete the time and had to rush through the last dozen or so questions in 5 minutes.
When I asked if I could just retake it they told my once I started the test they have to send in the test for scoring regardless of if I take it again and universities will see my first score as well.
I felt cheated but when it came back a 32 I decided, screw it, it won’t hurt my admissions and never took it again. Probably would have a 33-34 if it was not for the last part of the science. In my opinion the science was the easiest section and should have increased my score not lowered it.
Never took the SATs.
Cool story bro. Did you ever figure out if someone saying that drill and ceremony could help the enemies war effort was sarcasm? I would assume(yes I know the saying) that anyone who couldn’t figure that out probably has extremely low reading comprehension.
Are you referring to some other post, on some other day, about some other story?
Yeah.., I don’t remember your post. You seem to have held a personal grudge about it though.
Do you want the link again, because I posted it before. And yes I have a grudge with every leftist who tries to play with their own facts. Perhaps your lack of reading comprehension when it comes to sarcasm proves just how much smarter you are compared to everyone who is not a pajama wearing man child… then again perhaps not.
At least I served. What’s your excuse?
According to his FB profile he graduated from DLI in 1990, and served as an officer in Civil Affairs between 2008 and 2014. Did 1 tour in Iraq, and 1 in A-stan.
I know. I was curious as to what he’d say. That’s what makes his drivel even that much sadder.
DLI? The Berkeley of the military?
Reading comprehension is fundamental.
I said they “represents students from 72 different nations”
Because students from 72 make up the UC Irvine student body.
So the 10 student councilman represent these students in the same way any student council represents them. They represent the ENTIRE student body. Of 72 nationalities.
a 32 on an ASVAB should have been sufficient to understand that. Maybe you were waivered?
I’ll tell you what I told him. Those foreign students came to America to attend an American college and if OUR flag offends them then they need to get the fuck out. You are on the wrong site if you think you can spew that liberal shit here and not come under fire.
The international students were not complaining.
The student council chose to do this on their own in recognition of the fact that they are representatives of a student body of 72 nationalities. Rather than put 72 flags on their wall they chose to not have any national flags on the wall.
“he student council represents all students and many are international students (9%).”
Who represents the taxpayers?
They did not ban the US flag from the campus. It is still flying proudly over the campus as it has every day since the campus was founded.
The student council only voted to remove the flag from the lobby of the student council.
Completely irrelevant information, assuming it is even true. Without documentation, my assumption is that it is as accurate as all the rest of the stuff you purport to be true but cannot substantiate.
But a troll’s gotta troll.
Whatever.
What L. Taylor wrote is mostly true. The vote to ban flags applied to the LOBBY OF THE COMPLEX that houses the student council. Now, if the only offices in that complex are those of the student council and the lobby, as well as those offices, are used exclusively by the student council, L. Taylor’s point is on mark: otherwise, not so much.
The student government “complex” at UC Irvine is some offices tucked away n the back of a building.
Near the entrance to one of those offices one of the students chose to hang the US flag on the wall. This created some controversy among the student representatives and some students because the student council is supposed to represent all students and the student council space is supposed to be an “open and inclusive space” for students.
The student council voted 6-4 with two abstentions to “ban” the flag from their office space somewhere in the back of a building.
That is what happened.
I wonder if any international students were actually “disturbed”by the U.S. flag hanging in the hallway. If so maybe they should take their tender feelings back home.
My guess is the main push for this action was by some mush headed “natives”.
It was most likely US students.
But if the student body represents all students they legitimately had a point to choose to hang any national flag on their wall.
It was a practical decision and consistent with their responsibilities as representatives of the student body.
It should not be spun the way it is in con-media circles.
You wanna try explaining to us “dumb” conservatives just how a U.S. flag hanging in a school hallway is repressive or to use some made up loony term non inclusive?
If I was attending school in Russia I would not be shocked to come across a Russian flag now and again for fucks sake.
That is idiotic.
They removed it from the student council lobby. Not the campus.
That is a FACT.
Something you can verify if you bothered to check.
And in doing that, they make the statement that they choose to dishonor our Nation and what it stands for, that’s how I and many others view the actions of your vapid little fellow sniveling snot-nosed moonbats that are devoid of common sense and logic.
No, they did not.
The student council is not a US governing body. It represents only the students at UC Irvine, and those students are 9% international students.
This flag is not the campus flag, it is not even a flag displayed by the university in their office space.
It was a flag that one of the students chose to hang on the wall in the student government office space located at the back of a building.
The student council voted 6-4 not to display the flag in front of their office.
Reading comprehension isn’t your strong suit, is it? API made the point that the “students” were dishonoring the country. He said nothing about the students being a US governing body. Try to keep up.
They sure do enjoy coming to the US for schooling. I’m going to take a stab that most international students wouldn’t mind the flag. Its the dipshits in the US who don’t like it.
the % of int’l students is irrelevant. It is a US school on US soil funded with US taxpayer money.
So fucking dumb.
Says the individual who apparently has difficulty spelling the word “paid”.
Simple logic here, but Lars, you are obligated to prove the assertions you make. Not my job to prove your assertions. You make them, then you should be prepared to back them up.
So, what exactly difference does the location of the flag make? You still haven’t suggested the point yet, just thrown out some more red herrings.
How have a thrown in a red herring.
THE ORIGINAL POST THAT THIS ENTIRE THREAD IS ABOUT SAID THAT THE FLAG WAS BANNED FROM CAMPUS.
That was a flat fucking lie.
It was not banned from campus.
The student council voted not to hang it on the wall in the lobby of the student council office which is tucked away in the back of a larger building. This was directly in response to a student hanging the flag up and the student council deciding that since the represent all students in a community from over 72 countries that NO NATIONAL FLAG should hang on the wall in their lobby.
THat is the ENTIRE EVENT!!
Okay, let’s get to the crux of the issue, Lars.
WHY didn’t they want the flag there?
Read the statements of the special little snowflake who pushed for it. He hates America. Period.
He loves him some Che, though.
Well, then you should have no problem citing a reputable source confirming the assertions you just made.
After all, since you’re (presumably) not a UCI student you must have gotten the information on which you’re basing your comments here from some reputable source – right?
So, Lars, that office is NOT on campus? What exactly are you trying to say??
A college group ordered that a US flag be taken down on campus. You are saying that it was NOT on campus?
Make up your figgin’ mind, child! Either it was or it was not. You can’t have it both ways, except in your own delusions.
The effect is the same on those commenting. But you already knew that, thus the red herrings. (By your rules, I am under no obligation to point out your specific red herrings – your rules dictate that you have to figure that out yourself. Or just take my word for it.)
I did not say it was not on campus.
I said it was not banned from campus.
The flag could and was still flown all over campus.
It just was banned from bring hung on the wall directly outside the student council office located in the back of a building.
Lars, Freedom of Speech (Expression). You want to deny the same right as any other your beliefs? Try removing any third world flag and see how fast you are in jail. It does not matter if it is in the Lobby, freedom of speech,has dunk in yet? Joe
nonsense.
“The student council only voted to remove the flag from the lobby of the student council.”
You are expecting us to accept that Mr. Guevera’s diatribe about national flags being oppressive symbols only applied to the lobby of the student council?
Do you really believe us to be that naive?
His diatribe is irrlevant to the decision. The student council does not have the authority to ban the flag from campus.
The issue being debated was whether to hang the flag on the wall at the entrance to their office.
A student had done so, someone took it down, it was rehung, and then it went to a vote among the 12 student council members.
They voted 6-4, with two abstentions, to not hang any national flag on their wall.
That is what happened.
Then someone turned it into a complete lie and media misinformation by turning into a story about how the flag was banned from campus.
It’s only a matter of time before our flag pulls a disappearing act all over the place like the Ten Commandments have because it offends someone.
I am truly tired of this PC ass kissing. Don’t like what our Nation stands for then Lars. Try Mexico, you have no rights,protection and everything that happens to you is your faulth.Go to Thailand and badmouth the Royals and go to jail and the list goes on. M E lose your head. Joe
real fucking freedom loving prick you are. If someone does not agree with you they should leave the country.
How about you go fuck yourself.
I did not badmouth the flag. I said it was not banned from campus.
“real fucking freedom loving prick you are.”
“How about you go fuck yourself.”
Jonn – your house, your rules – but how much longer do we have to put up with this jackass?
So, If I stopped swearing would that change anything?
Probably, not but I will remove and swearing from my posts before I hit enter.
I doubt it is the swearing that you are really angry about.
And, I admit I do not know who Joe Williams is, but if someone told you to leave the country I doubt you would react well to it either.
Ever consider that I am as vitriolistic on these issue as I am because I actually do care about my country?
And I’m sure our little troll Lars would be perfectly happy to see the flag removed from every public space, and any expression of patriotism prosecuted as a thought crime.
YMMV.
Bullshit.
This story is complete misinformation.
A student council member hung it on the wall of the student government offices tucked away in the back of an office building.
Since the student council represents all students and the student body is 9% international students the student council voted 6-4 to not have any national flags hanging on the wall.
It is a non-story.
You certainly have those panties all wadded up over a non-story. Well, whatever the internationalist flavor of the SGA (or whatever it’s called) the fact that some people thought it appropriate and reasonable to vote to remove Old Glory from wherever it was displayed on an American college campus is sufficient to throw a few raspberries their way.
The defunding of universities is absolutely harmful to our nation particularly in an era where there is a massive surplus of unskilled labor in the international labor market.
and the right is twisting this story to anger conservatives into buying into the defunding rhetoric and even to get them to buy into removing grant aid to students.
It is no coincidence that tuition costs and student debt spiked just as the mortgage industry went into decline.
Student loans replaced the mortgage industry as the next cash cow for the financial sector. And these profits are being driven by the rising tuition costs and constraints on non-loan aid programs.
Right wing propagandists are doing everything they can to further undermine low cost tuition and aid to students that does not come in the form of interest bearing loans.
Nice speech. Next time play this first:
clueless fuckstick.
Who payed your salary when you served?
How is investing in a strong defense no different than investing in an educated population when loss of power in the international economy is a much greater national security threat than any foreign enemy?
Poor misguided little boy.
Reading comprehension obviously isn’t your strong suit. Start with Article I, Section 8 of the Constitution. Which is specifically authorized under said article–funding our military, or schools?
While I agree education and training are important to where this country got today, we can do without the “free” crap. Education costs have FAR outstripped inflation. Why? “Free” money. And when people say they’ll pay any cost for a commodity (which includes an education), any cost is usually what it becomes.
And when that educational system becomes a leftist indoctrination system rather than an educational system, how does that serve the nation’s interest?
Food for thought.
In state tuition and fees in the UC system is the highest of any public school in the world.
$14,577
Non-residents pay and additional
$22,878
The amount students are paying for their education today is flat obscene.
Obscene or not, it appears that internatonal students pay the same tuition as US citizens who have not been CA residents for at least 1 year.
I believe you stated otherwise above. Care to elaborate?
And care to take a wild fucking guess WHY it’s so obscene?
You are completely incorrect, taylor.
Resident international students pay $7581 in tuition. ALL ELSE IS FEES INCLUDING THE SUPPLEMENTAL TUITION FEE.
Non-international students pay $5610. ALL ELSE IS FEES.
I did the research on this. You did not. You do know what you’re talking about and you can’t read simple charts. And don’t blame that on dyslexia. You’re a liar, plain and simple.
UGH. ‘do know’ should be ‘do NOT know’. Geez, I’m having repeated typonitis this weekend.
I paid these tuition and fees myself so i did more than “research” this.
The distinction you are making between tuition and fees is practically irrelevant. Students have to pay both when attending.
I did not lie, my post explicitly says “tuition and fees”
The tuition and fees per year in UC system for residents is $14,577
The tuition and fees for non-residents is
$37,455
You acting like the fees should not count is fucking nonsense. They are not optional.
Actually, the tution and fees have gone up.
Per year the current fees schedule is
$15511.50 for residents.
$38389.50 for non-residents.
It is $350 cheaper for continuing students.
While I originally said they are not optional that is not true for the health insurance fee. If you can prove you have better health insurance outside the university. But it requires a waiver application and verification. If the university decides your coverage is inadequate the health insurance fee is automatically re-applied to you bill.
The problem is this is not education, but indoctrination. Kids are graduating from college dumber than they were when they started.
The word is “paid”, Lars – not “payed”.
You’ll find people give more credence to your opinions if you appear more than semi-literate when you offer them.
I have a form of dyslexia that causes me to occasionally replace words with similar sounding syllables or words. Or replace it with words that mean the opposite like “from” instead of “to”.
Then perhaps you should look for the red underlining that appears below misspelled words when you type your comments.
That’s not simply appearing as a decoration. It’s trying to tell you something.
It appears that same dyslexia causes you to frequently replace sound reasoning with utter nonsense.
And to aggressively and insufferably thrust yourself upon a group in which no one likes or respects you, and everyone wishes you would just go away.
So you are the spokesperson for this “group”?
What about all the lurkers who just decided it not worth their time to argue with this crusty group?
The military is 20% liberal. My “nonsense” is an aspect of the veteran community. And since this group is seen as representative of the veteran community by members of the media I think you can learn to deal with someone that disagrees with you.
It’s not the “liberal” part that I have a problem with. It’s not the “disagreement” part that I have a problem with. It’s the “insufferable, know-it-all, jackass” part. People do come on this blog with contrary opinions, and if they do so with a friendly attitude, humility, and a sense of humor, they are welcomed. I see where you just invited our friend Joe WIlliams to go fuck himself. That pretty much sums up why people have reacted to you the way they have. Yes, opinions get argued vigorously, but not with the same vitriol you’ve triggered. It’s not because you’re a liberal. It’s because you’re an obnoxious prick. If you could somehow change your entire personality, you might be accepted here – or you might have been, anyway, if you hadn’t already poisoned the water.
That is the lamest excuse for pure laziness that I’ve heard in a long, long time.
Dyslexic? I don’t think so. How about functionally illiterate instead.
Dyslexic? Well, I guess that’s better than less-dixic…
I had a boss once who claimed that he was dyslexic or dispepsic but he couldn’t remember which one.
When I type it wrong, I typed it wrong and I did a bad job of proof-reading. I don’t try to claim some physical disability when simple carelessness is to blame.
“How is investing in a strong defense no different than investing in an educated population when loss of power in the international economy is a much greater national security threat than any foreign enemy?”
It may surprise you to know that the US spends more than any other country on education. Yet we have among the worst results. Our students have few math/science requirements and effective writing/critical thinking is becoming a lost art. Of course, if we were teaching critical thinking, you might have more uncomfortable questions for your social ecology and gender studies professors.
Help me understand the logic of investing more money in a system that is clearly not working.
Lars,
Why are so many of our college grads having a hard time finding a job?
Can you blame conservatives for having an issue with their tax dollars going to these institutions. They are rife with liberal professors who have a stranglehold on higher education. There are many documented cases of liberal bias in academia.
What you and your ilk will never understand is why we “right wingers” foam at the mouth when events like these happen. It is a slap in the face of something that represents this country and all those who came before us and sacrificed more than these ungrateful piss ants could ever imagine.
I call bullbutter on your explanation that 9% of the population is foreign. So what?? It’s a US public school funded by US tax dollars.
Those international students are *guests* and have no right to expect something like this. What would Lars have to say if I was hanging out in Cabo or Cancùn or Cíudad Mexico and asked them to take the Mexican flag down as a gesture of “hospitality?”
Well, I would expect that any “guero” who tried that crap down would get his ass kicked. As it should be!
When you’re a guest, you don’t get to make demands of your host. Kinda the whole definition of “guest.” Now I will agree that there should be a standard of hospitality, but there are limits. A guest in my house may park in my driveway, eat my food, utilize my downstairs bathroom, sleep on my couch, and watch my TV. They may not, however, insult me and mine, take my property, sleep in my bed, or bang my wife. If the guest doesn’t like the limits of my hospitality, they may kindly get the fuck out and stay gone.
Those international students are paying a high tuition premium. More than US counterparts. Much more than their true cost of their education. They are in essence paying to fund US universities that are being left underfunded by the state and federal government.
As students they vote in student election and their representative body represents them as well as all students on campus.
The student council voted to not fly ANY national flag in their office.
None of which is in any way relevant to my point, nor does it answer my question, Lars.
Are you saying that a guest in my house is free to, for instance, have sex with my wife as long as he pays me for it? I’m gonna say no to that, seeing as how I’m not a pimp, my house ain’t a brothel, and my wife is most definitely not a whore. They pay tuition. Great. That doesn’t give them, or anybody allegedly acting on their behalf carte blanche to pretend that a part of America is not America. Free Speech Bly means that nobody will be prosecuted. I do NOT have to respect this crap. I am not legally permitted to force it to stop, but I also am not obligated to respect it, and as a California taxpayer and college graduate I have every right to express how pissed off I am and call bullshit.
You disagree, as is your right, but you’re coming off AT LEAST as pompous as you accuse the rest of us of being. You are right to clarify the real scope of the action in question, but the action remains egregious chickenshit nonetheless.
That’s supposed to say “only means,” not “Bly means.” Damn smart phone.
OK Lars, let me see if I’ve got this right:
“Those international students are paying a high tuition premium.”
Which they and their families chose to do on their own accord.
“More than US counterparts.”
Similar to how out-of-state student’s pay more in tuition/fees than students residing in their home state? Oooh, unfair!
“Much more than their true cost of their education.”
While you may think so, they apparently don’t. Else they’d all have bailed out back to their home countries by now, right?
“They are in essence paying to fund US universities that are being left underfunded by the state and federal government.”
And state governments and the federal government receive their revenue via tax rolls, ergo US citizens are actually the ones funding those state schools. Yet you’d like us all to pay more in our hard-earned taxable dollars to governmental entities to increase the funding to those state universities in order to allow lower tuition/fee amounts for foreign nationals.
I see your point about the original story being blown out of proportion, but the rest of you “logic” stinks.
By the way, that remark “Who payed your salary when you served?”? Yup the federal government did. An during our long hours on watch down in the engine room in the middle of the Indian Ocean, a few of my shipmates and I did some calculations and figured it came out to $1.36 (plus/minus 3 cents) an hour.
You went off the map with that logical progression.
I never once claimed we should pay more so they can pay less.
Not even close.
Actually, you seem to have implied exactly that when you said foreign students were paying “more than their fair share”.
True or false then, Lars:
Illegal aliens residing within a state should not have to pay out-of-state tuition rates when attending college.
Then again, why are they even allowed to attend college at all, given they’re here illegally?
Eloquent refutation, Lars. What about points one thru three?
And if I and all the other Joe Shmoe citizens don’t pony up, who should/will? Wait I get it, the answer is “Big Business”, right? Which, if done correctly, will decrease their revenues, make them more cautious in investing in the growth of their facilities/properties in the US, causing a slowing of growth in our economy and likely a new round of job losses for Joe Shmoes like myself.
Off the map, indeed.
I’ve been reader/;urker here for a few years, and it never ceases to amaze me when new folks show up to argue points, assuming it seems that the regulars here are uneducated oafs. Good luck with that.
Care to show us how much extra, Lars? Cite UC Irvine catalog.
C’mon, you make the claim, now back it up.
I did the research on this subject just now.
http://valorguardians.com/blog/?p=58596&cpage=1#comment-2488073
I think this more than adequately refutes taylor’s unsupported claim.
See my comment below.
Other than a $10 or $20 premium on their application fee, international students at UCI appear to pay exactly the same tuition as US citizens who do not qualify for in-state tuition rates.
In other words, they pay the same as any other out-of-state resident pays.
Moreover, if I’m reading the UCI website page I linked below correctly, that’s only for the first year. After living in CA for a year, it appears they – like any other out-of-state resident – can qualify for in-state tuition rates.
Interestingly enough, UCI’s website appears to show no difference in tuition between US and international students who do not qualify for in-state tuition.
http://catalogue.uci.edu/preadmissionmatters/expensestuitionandfees/
If there’s a special “international tuition” rate listed there, I must have missed it. The only difference I see is a $10 difference on the international undergraduate admission fee, and a $20 difference on the international graduate admission fee.
OK, I linked to UCBerkeley’s tuition rates for 2014-2015. I didn’t check Irvine. U of IL likewise makes no distinction between international and out-of=state students.
“They are in essence paying to fund US universities that are being left underfunded by the state and federal government.”
Bullshit. The State of California pumped in an extra billion dollars in 2013.
In 2013, according to the financial statement for the entire UC system, UC ran about $2.2 billion in the hole. Tuition and fees revenue was about $3.4 billion or about one eighth of their income. In order for the UC system to break even on operating dollars, they need to increase tuition by $2.2 billion or about 65%.
FWIW, UC Irvine earned about $2.31 billion of the total revenue and spent about $2.27 billion of the total expense.
What actually happened in 2013 was that the State of California kicked in an extra $1.1 billion and the university sucked about $1.1 billion out of their $17 billion in assets. That is how they paid for the year.
The top 3 UC costs are Medical centers $7.1 billion, instruction $5.4 billion, and research $4.2 billion. That is about two thirds of the $25 billion total annual budget.
UC Irvine took in $400 million in tuition and fees and spent $487 million on instruction.
How did anything you say dispute what I said?
I said “underfunded”
not “unfunded”
Shouldn’t the student council either A) consider the preferences and sensibilities of the other 91%,
or better yet, B) have more important issues taking up their time?
If not, then what’s the point of having a student government, other than puffing the egos of a few self-important individuals?
Whitey: If not, then what’s the point of having a student government, other than puffing the egos of a few self-important individuals?
They are “elected officials” after all…
you do not know how representation works.
They voted 6-4 to not have the flag hanging in their office because they thought it represented their constituents to do so.
I am sure a significant percentage of UC students thought that not hanging the US flag in the office of the student council that represents students from 72 countries was appropriate.
Meanwhile, I bet most international students would have thought the flag was fine.
Lars, don’t dictate whether I do or don’t know how to add 2 plus 2 to get 4. Yes, I do know how representation is supposed to work in theory and how it does and doesn’t work in reality at various levels of government and in schools. I went to college too, Lars, even graduated!
You don’t know me, where I’ve been, what I’ve done, or what I know. So shove that cute little reply right up your ass and keep right on shoving until it triggers your gag reflex.
One thing I learned in college is that for the most students are either too busy balancing a job with a heavy class load if they take their education seriously, or too busy partying to care if they don’t. In my experience, and yours may be different, more often than not the students who place such importance on student body government are the ones who have nothing better to do than wave signs on picket lines and be annoying, which often coincides with an exaggerated sense of self-importance. Those student council members know this, and also are not dependent on their elected position for salary or standard of living. Their term limits are limited to their four-year degree program. Their constituency is more or less apathetic and they have little, if any, incentive to pay attention to them anyway.
That’s my real-world experience from multiple colleges, including a state university. Your experience may or may not have been similar. I make no assumptions about that, unlike you. However, I can see that you’re an arrogant asshole. That’s no assumption, it’s a demonstrable fact.
Just so we’re clear here, you’re the one who devolved this into dick-measuring, not me. So shove that high horse you’re sitting on up your ass too, for good measure. Fuck you.
Speaking of financing under-graduate and higher education, Peterson’s used to publish an annual guide to American universities and collegs, as well as the guides to testing preparatio and financial aid.
Those guides hit the bookstores every year in July. I got my GRE test prep stuff from them.
There are literally thousands of scholarship funds available to students who qualify for them. A great many of them are merit awards, NOT based on financial need. There are scholarships for people who are redheads or have a specific last name, for Pete’s sake. There is plenty of money available for school, if you look for it.
http://www.petersons.com/college-search/scholarship-search.aspx
I don’t know if Peterson’s still publishes the hard copy versions, but they do have a bookstore available online, and anyone who doesn’t take advantage of something like this is not looking hard enough.
To say that ALL funding comes from tax money is incorrect. State colleges and universities get tax money from their respective states. Anyone attending from an out-of-state area is going to automatically be billed higher for tuition than a resident of the state in which his school is located. Private colleges and universities, on the other hand, do not get federal tax money for tution. They get money from research grants and students have to apply directly to a federally-funded program to get that money, AND they have to show results within the time period specified by the application. That is not the same thing as tuition. Any student at a private university or college can apply for a fellowship or other kind of grant.
Any responsible university or college should have plenty of information available to prospective students on tuition funding.
The idea that you have to go into debt up to your eyeballs to get an undergraduate degree is ludicrous, at the very least. There are scholarship funds that are literally going wanting for applicants because no one knows about them, but they should still be in Peterson’s Guide, if anyone wants to bother.
Scholarship money does not come anywhere near the rising cost of tuition that has quadrupled in some states in the last ten years.
It does if you are studious about applying for all that you are available and work hard to make sure you meet the criteria. If you sit around with your hand out then of course not….
So, taylor, you’re dimwitted enough to think that only one scholarship can be had per person? Think again.
How DO you manage to get up and get dressed in the morning without written instructions?
I checked the tuition and fees rates for 2015-2016 for students at the University of Illinois. This is for students who are residents of the state, non-residents of the state, and international students.
http://admissions.illinois.edu/cost/tuition.html
The chart clearly shows that international students pay only about $1,000 more per year than out-of-state students do.
Then I checked the same thing for Pepperdine University, a well-known, upper-level private university offering undergraduate, graduate and doctoral programs.
http://publicpolicy.pepperdine.edu/admission/financial-aid/cost-of-attendance/
Foreign students pay the same rates as all other students, but then, Pepperdine is a private school and does not get state tax money. It does, however, offer assistance in getting federal grant funding as well as assistance in getting tuition scholarships.
Then I checked the same thing for undergraduates only at Northwestern University.
http://www.northwestern.edu/sfs/tuition/undergrad_tuition.html
Frankly, all schools want to get tuition money and fees, because that’s what they run on, as well as donations from grateful alumni whose careers were enhanced by attending those schools. Since getting a degree as a liberal arts major is about as useless nowadays as making a coat of potato peelings, most universities are orienting themselves toward getting people into the work force, not promoting political agendas, and their academic programs are reflecting that more and more. The local community college offers a 2-year associate’s degree in a wide range of subjects as well as practical vocational education, and has made arrangements with an expanding list of 4-year colleges and universities for students to transfer their credits to the 4-year schools to finish a baccalaureate degree. This is a practical way to get an education at a lower cost by getting required subjects out of the way, and a start in electives, and then transferring those credits to a 4-year school.
I’ve also found that the state schools are running their graduate programs in the evening schools to allow working commuter students access to graduate level programs. This, again, is a practical way to advance one’s education. Traditional daytime only stuff seems to be waning.
And while I’m at it, here’s the breakdown of UCBerkeley’s charges to international students. Note that the charges are for two semesters.
http://internationaloffice.berkeley.edu/students/current/expenses
This is the per-semester breakdown for non-international students.
http://registrar.berkeley.edu/feesched.html
I do not agree that international students are paying a premium in tuition and fees at UCBerkeley. If they were not registered as international students, the supplemental fee would not apply and their tuition would, in fact, be lower than for non-international students.
What?
International students pay the additional $22,878 non-resident fee.
How do you “not agree that international students are paying a premium in tuition and fees”?
They are. Because they are non-residents. So they pay the non-resident fee.
And you comment about them paying less than residents if they were not registered as international students is nonsense. Because they are registered as international students, that is why they are called international students. 13% of UC Berkeley students are international students. That 13% is the percentage of students that are classified as international non-residents.
And if they were residents than they would pay the resident tuition not some fantasy lower tuition you are completely fabricating to make a nonsensical argument.
And living in California for years not even enough to be counted as a resident for the UC system. It is much tougher than any other state in the country with respect to awarding in-state residency tuition. I had in state tuition for two years at a California community college. When I transfered to the UC system I lost my residency in state residency due to their more stringent requirements. I fought it for months before I got my residency re-instated. Ultimately I had to submit my entire banking records for the previous 366 days to prove I never left the state, as well as a few other things, life transfer the registration of a vehicle at my cousin’s house in Texas.
So, what you’re saying is – international students are being treated exactly the same as any other out-of-state student.
The reason isn’t that they’re “international students” – and are thus being charged a premium on that basis. The reason is that they do not qualify for in-state tuition. The same is true for US citizens who attend who are residents of any state other than CA who do not qualify for an exemption.
Your assertion that “international” students are paying “more than their fair share” is bull. The proper statement is “international students are being charged out-of-state tuition rates, just like any other out-of-state student.”
Yes, which is “more than their fair share.” because their tuition and fees are being used to cover the budget shortfall caused by reduced public funding for universities. The average operating costs per student is less than their tuition and fees. So they are subsidizing the cost of in state tuition.
So they deserve to be treated “equally” by their student representatives as residents. Hence why they do have a national flag on the student council wall.
A flag that was never on the wall in the first place until a student recently took it upon himself to hang it on the student council lobby wall.
Now if you issue is with the word “fair” I understand. I was making a economic evaluation in that their cost of tuition in fees is higher than their operating cost for their education so they are paying “more” and that money is being used to cover some of the costs of educating the state residents. That is not what I meant by “fair share.” I have no problem with charging out of state residents more. I do have a problem with charging them more then simultaneously claiming they do not deserve to be represented by the student council.
No, dipstick – out-of-state residents generally get charged higher tuition at state universities because their families (and/or they themselves) do not in general pay state taxes in that state. State tax revenue is used to subsidize the cost of the university (salaries, etc . . . ). That money comes from taxes paid by residents of the state in which the university is located. The state has made a public policy decision to subsidize the cost of higher education for the children of state residents.
Since out-of-state residents and their families don’t in general pay taxes to CA, allowing residents of other states to attend CA state-supported universities at in-state tuition rates would be using CA tax money to subsidize the education of non-CA residents. Most states don’t want to subsidize the higher education of those who are residents of other states – ergo, out-of-state tuition is much higher than the in-state rate.
Sheesh. And you say you’re studying governance theory?
Oh, now we see quite clearly that dumbster taylor can’t read simple charts or do simple arithmetic.
A – Those charts for international students are for TWO semesters, NOT for ONE. The information is supplied for that. Try dividing the actual tuition by 2. The resident students’ tuition is PER SEMESTER.
B – It would be a real good idea for you to stop letting everyone know that your comprehension of simple English is lower than an amoeba’s ass in a quaking bog.
C – And I mean this sincerely: Stercorem pro cerebro habes, furcifer. Tu es stultissimus omnium. Antiquis temporibus, nati tibi similes in rupibus ventosissimis exponebantur ad necem. Futue te ipsum.
A. I never said otherwise you prick. I know first hand the cost of tuition at UC Berkeley. I paid it.
B. The only comprehension issues I see on this board is people thinking the student council voted to ban the flag from “campus” and thinking that a student council does not represent international students.
C. I am not impressed with your copy and paste of latin from a “latin insults” web page. It is psuedo-intellectual bullshit.
“pseudo-intellectual bullshit”.
The sum and substance of Lars “Fucking” Taylor.
+100!
Copy and paste?
Yeah, ego bulla Latin in schola pro duos annus. Ego persevero utor is pariter ut alius lingua.
You see, ego sum non postulo ut effingo ut quod alius populus narro.
Et vos es valde bardus vir.
This is the best I can do to translate ‘a dickless wonder’: specialissimus vir per haud penis.
Just so you know, lars the dumbuttsky. Keep it up, stercus.
Bubulum stercus tu es.
Fornicarius sartor.
Dammit! No spew alert!
There goes the keyboard!
😉
Lars,
You do not have to quit working balls, per se; it is your right.
But damn, man, use some mouthwash before you write.
Sounds odd, but speaks volumes.
UC Irvine, which this “controversy” is about. Has the same tuition and fee schedule as UC Berkeley.
And their tuition/fee schedule (which I’ve linked to above) appears to show that international students pay exactly the same tuition as US residents from outside CA. They’re not in any way “singled out” or charged extra because they’re international students. They’re treated exactly like any other out-of-state resident attending a UC university. The only difference is a slightly higher admission fee – $10 higher for undergraduate admissions, and $20 higher for graduate admissions.
Did you have a point in making that last comment, or are you simply trying to be annoying?
Oh, it’s the same thing as sneering at nbcguy54. There IS no point.
He’s just being larstaylor, the world’s biggest asshole and jerk combined.
Maybe we should provide a fanfare so that it’s announced every time he posts something.
So you guys post and get angry about students “banning the flag from campus” (which never happened.)
And then scream that we need to defund public education and deny students financial aid for “banning the flag from campus” (which never happened).
And I am the asshole?
How much was tuition when you went to school? These students are going to spend the rest of their lives paying off the debts of YOUR GENERATION.
And you think we should make them pay even more than the $14500 they are paying now. Despite the fact that when you were their age tuition and fees in the UC system $0.
Who is the asshole?
Your entire generation is full of assholes as far as I am concerned. And you are definitely one of them.
Overall the biggest freeloaders of any generation in US history. And you sit back after an entire generation of greed, avarice, and irresponsibility racking up national debt while collecting social security and other benefits unfunded for their generation and claim “THEY SHOULD PAY MORE!!”
And as a final “fuck you” to them when they point out impact on the environment and climate and try to get policies in place to slow and mitigate the damage you politically block them while ignoring the science.
You are not the “Baby Boom” generation. You are “Generation toxic”.
Avarice? Someone knows how to use their computers thesaurus.
The tuition and fees in the UC system have never been of concern to me, Lars. I’ve never attended a CA school in my life. I’ve also never lived in CA. Those are CA issues, for those in CA to deal with as they see fit. I trust you’re familiar with the concept of Federalism?
I’m guessing that’s true about many if not most of the commenters here.
Blaming CA tuition changes on those who are not CA residents is not only illogical, it is completely nonsensical.
From you, of course, illogical and nonsensical is not a surprise.
Oh, and if you’re going to rail about “baby boomers collecting Social Security” – you might want to do your homework first. Most of the “baby boom” generation (those born during the period 1946-1964 is the commonly-accepted definition) are not yet eligible to receive Social Security. Only roughly the first 1/3 of those in that generation are Social Security eligible at present.
Yeah, and those are also the first group who will receive less in return than they paid (note that spelling, Lars?) in to the system. Most retires prior to that collected well more than they had paid.
I am not sure which group you ate claiming will be paid more than they paid into the system. If you are referring to baby boomers, I agree.
You have it exactly backwards – till now, most retirees were drawing more than they had paid in. Recent retirees, and most going forward, will get less than they paid in. Give you an example – I started work when I was 11 or so cutting grass, working for other people when I was 16, so I have been paying into the system for over 46 years. You also might look at the makup of the spending authority – Congress – during the time when the government was doing the deficit spending – it was overwhelmingly Democrat during the majority of those years. So blame the Dem boomers.
Correct, David. The transitionof Social Security from net gain (in terms of present day value of contributions) to net loss for those beginning to receive same occurred within the past 2 years. People who began drawing Social Security within the past 2 years are now estimated to receive less value on average than the present-day value of their accumulated contributions had same been invested.
Here’s a citation for my point immediately above.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/08/07/new-retirees-receiving-less-in-social-security-than-paid-in-marking-historic/
Although the story appeared on the Fox News website, the original source was identified as being the AP news service. So it hardly qualifies as “propaganda from the ‘vast right-wing conspiracy'”. (smile)
Tuition when I went to school?
U of I $800/semester, not counting fees and insurance.
Private university $1,700 per semester, not counting fees and insurance.
I had a full 4-year scholarship. I think tuition costs from MY generation have long since been paid off. And in regard to your non sequitur re: social security, etc., I’ve paid into that since I was 14 years old. If anyone robbed it, it was YOUR political group, starting with Lyndon Johnson in 1965 and his ‘Great War on Poverty’ using my taxes to fund Medicare and medicaid, food stamps and welfare to get votes and nothing else. None of that existed before he did that. That all comes from LIBERALS.
Got that, sport?
“Overall the biggest freeloaders of any generation in US history. And you sit back after an entire generation of greed, avarice, and irresponsibility racking up national debt while collecting social security and other benefits unfunded for their generation and claim “THEY SHOULD PAY MORE!!””
The vast majority of the generation worked their entire lives, paid into social security, and did not take a entitlement dime.
What percentage of 18-25 year old adults that can work do? Less than half? How many are using disability benefits or bridge cards? You can’t apply the slacker mentality of your generation to previous generations.
While your vigor of youth is admirable in defending your generation, the statistics will not be on your side using your arguments.
Those rate, you incredible moron, are for 2014-2015. Is that simple enough for you? Most school have already published their 2015-2016 rates. I did not look for that.
What an asshole you are. Any more nitpicking? You’re not very good at this.
Who the fuck are you talking to?
Well, Lars – since she addressed that comment to an “asshole”, I think it’s clear she was talking to you.
She was also replying to your comment of 10:09PM above. I’d expect someone as “well educated and intelligent” as you to notice that fact – or at least be able to “walk back” the thread and figure that out.
Well I never nitpicked her financial aid figures.
I think it was fratricide and she was calling you an asshole because she thought your post was mine.
Sure, Lars. Uh-huh. Yep. Whatever you say.
I suspect the lady will let us know shortly precisely who she was talking to. And I don’t think you’ll particularly like the answer.
I could be wrong, but I’m reasonably sure I’m not.
I know she thinks I am an asshole. But I did not nitpick her figures. I was just pointing out that the UC Berkeley figures also apply to UC Irvine.
If anything it was being helpful because it made her figures directly relevant to the article.
Do you know what Asperger Syndrome is?
I’m guessing she’s not alone in her opinion.
You.
I’d rather read Chevy or any of the Dutch Rudder Gang’s BS than Lars’ BS. Any chance of banning him too so he can go home to Huff Post et al?
SJ, he needs to be encouraged to find some other place where he can wallow in his own glory. Banning is too easy. He’s just a pompous-assed, lazy, fucking prig who expects to have his ‘word’ taken for what he says but won’t back up anything.
I could start with the foreign languages, though. That would be fun.
Ah! Lars is a Troll. Quite talking to the troll. Maybe he will go away. Seems to not understand patriots hang out here. Stolen valor thieves get pissed on here. Other topics are discussed from that point of view. Trolls don’t get it, always trying to piss in somebody’s corn flakes with superior intelligence. Your a knob Lars. I don’t like you fuck nuts.
Troll my ass, I simply think that Commissar IS AN ATTENTION-WHORING IDIOT!
and an update, the school has smacked down the students reversing their vote, in closed doors meeting 4-1. wonder who the dumbass is that voted against? http://news.yahoo.com/california-student-group-vetoes-ban-flag-lobby-013116669.html
oh, and the d-bag student Guevara who had the idea of this? Turns out he’s part of the schools Social Ecology program. Social Ecology? WTF is that?
I believe it’s one of those new “degree programs” started during the past 20 years or so.
It – and other similar nonsensical degree programs – are also likely one of the reasons that college tuition has gone through the roof in the last 20 years. All those new programs require facilities, professors, and administrators. All also cost mucho dinero
they are cheap programs becauese they are sub-programs in established departments.
The “peace and conflict” major for instance is part of the International Area Studies department. It does not require more teachers or classes. It is just mostly a rebundling of classes already offered to give students more “choice” in majors.
Imagine a store that only sold “gift baskets” with predertimined fruits and snacks. THen they added the option to have more flexibility in choosing which fruits and snacks to put in the baskets without actually increasing the supply of fruits and snacks.
And since the next generation growth industry for jobs is abstract analysis and problem solving these degrees are actually better suited to the future economy than most of the “trade-skill” and “professional” programs. An increasing percentage of engineering jobs for instance are routine an repetitious “grunt work” and these jobs are being farmed out to foreign, lower cost, labor markets. An increasing number of legal jobs are similarly repetitious grunt work and low paid. The only thing keeping them in the US market is the bar system. Still, many are already being farmed overseas.
These “interdisciplinary” majors focus on analyzing complex issues in their historical and social context and reading all the contemporary theorists and philosophers in the era in question to try to understand the problems being faced, the theories being proposed, and the solution that were implemented.
They then analyze the consequences of these solutions and do the same analysis for the problems that subsequent era faced.
And so on.
So they are well suited to trying to tackle the problems being faced in the contemporary international socio-political-economy. The interdisciplinary approach allows them to analyze all aspect of the problem; historical context, economy, political structures, social structures, and human behavior.
Oh, by God, lars the dim does NOT know when to quite, does he?
Legal jobs are repetitious grunt work and low paid and being farmed out overseas, are they? That’s really interesting. Where do you get your information on this? I’d really like to know. I have A LOT of experience in that field and I can back up what I’m saying. I know what paralegals and A/Rs get, and the work is neither low paid nor repetitious grunt work. Neither is the legal research position. Docketing clerks make a whole lot more than you do, you imebecile. In fact, all the openings in the legal field a damned well-paid and are NOT repeititous grunt work. I do not know any reputable firm in this country that will farm out its non-attorney work to an overseas service. The ONLY way a law firm will use overseas employees is in an established overseas corporate office.
Is that simple enough for you? Or do I have to spell it for you? If you want to go on making idiotic statements like that, with no basis for what you are saying, you are in way over your head. You don’t get to wade out of this cesspool you’ve dug for yourself.
First, we are talking about the degrees themselves. While I did discuss the legal field I was discussing the FUTURE job market so you response about how good people have it now is nonsense. People had it great in the auto industry at one time. The current market is irrelevant to those people choosing to pursue a law degree right now. What matters how that market will change over the coming decades. And it looks terrible. The first decade is mediocre there is expected to slightly below average growth in the market in the coming decade and there continues to be more law school graduates than jobs. However, it gets worse from there. Right now there is massive investment in research to reduce legal costs in the marketplace. Much of this will be done through software development (additionally, much of the same research being used to improve language translation software can be applied to legal process automation development), and to some extent it already has started to effect the market. By 2030 legal process automation will hit the legal job market in a huge way, just as other forms of automation have impacted other markets. Besides the current Job market for law degree is not as great as you claim given the cost of the degree. While the “average mid career salary” is about $100,000-$120,000 (google numbers do not reflect the labor department figures) that is because the industry has exceedingly high income variance at the top end and those very well paid outliers strongly increase the average. Average starting salary is only in the $47,00-$60,000 range which is pathetic. The MEDIAN mid career income (which is what really matters because it controls for outliers is only $76,000. Which is also pretty mediocre considering the cost of education ($50,000 per year). And my claim that legal outsourcing is happening is true regardless of you anecdotal observations (do you even still work in the industry?). Legal process outsourcing to overseas was $1.39B in 2013 (I could not find the 2014 figures) and is expected to grow 500% by 2020. Sure, that… Read more »
“Average starting salary is only in the $47,00-$60,000 range which is pathetic.”
…pathetic? That’s a starting salary that is more than the median US salary for a family of four. That said, it guess it is pathetic if you only watch Kim K all day.
What Lars knows about making money can be fit inside of a matchbook while using bold print. That being said, the average business degree coming out of a reputable school with a bachelors degree will earn about 40k/year. IMO learning a skill is much better than going to college unless you’re going to be an engineer/doctor/accountant/ or any other legit specialized degree.
‘Pathetic’? Yes, but only if you have delusions of grandeur about yourself.
And note that his readng and comprehension skills are still sadly lacking. He assumes I was referring to a JD degree, which I was not.
In fact, I made no reference to any specific degree, at all. I made a general reference the to field of law, including paralegals, clerks and other support staffers.
Unfortunately for him, he chose to ignore what I said in his effort to make an ass of himself all over again.
It is pathetic given the average cost of law school including three year investment it requires.
Drinking ready, Lars?
Geezo pete, I went to bed like asensible person last night. But you can always count on lars the dumbuttsky to conjur up something out of hot air and moonbeams. Industry projections are based on current, not future, parameters. They are frequently proven to be wrong. Yes, I do know a good deal about outsourcing and remote or telecommuting, because I did that for two – count ’em – two offices of the MAJOR law firm where I worked for many years before I retired. They were and still are VERY tech-intense. What you imply is that every aspect of legal work, even that whidh requires a licensed attorney, goes over to some place like India. This is completely not true. The attorneys will spend some time with their foreign counterpart to ensure a smooth and correct flow of paperwork. But outsourcing does not necessarily mean work is done overseas. A lot of it is done locally by contracting with local services to do the support work. There are, however, some things such as docketing and filing and actual courtroom presence which can’t be farmed out. And since you know nothing about the field of law, you also know nothing about the ‘software’ in use, so don’t even go there. Describing my inhouse experience as ‘anecdotal’ is a weak and ignorant attempt to belittle the long hours I put in doing my job. I don’t have to be working now in a specific position to know something about a field of work. The wages have drastically improved since I started in 1991. I started at $19,000/yr and when I retired, my income was $62,000/yr, including bonuses. Not too bad for ‘grunt’ work. The outsourcing ‘industry’ is NOT going to perpetually expand in any line of work. The Chinese have been learning that the hard way. Everything that is a ‘boom’ also has a ‘bust’. So, lars the dim can make all the twists and turns he wants to, but he still knows nothing about anything unless he can find it from a source that someone else put together. He can’t… Read more »
But Ex-PH2 aren’t you a victim of men? So you can’t possibly know more facts than your “protector” who’s a liberal male.(Full on sarcasm)
*Lars this is what a strong intelligent woman is like.*
Me? A victim of men?
Not to my knowledge.
Real men don’t pick out women to make victims of them.
Exactly… I meant no insult towards you. Perhaps my true sentiment didn’t come across as correct but in the spirit of being anti-PC… ma’am may I have another? 😛
There was no insult in it. I knew what you meant.
Social ecology? I was wondering about that myself, because it sounds like hyperbole for ‘I want to be a permanent student and not have to work in the private sector’.
On the other hand, someone like that will be unlikely to get a job working for Zuckerberg at Facebook, or Microsoft or Apple.
Do you know what kind of job you can get with a degree in social ecology? Would you like fries with that?
I think you can get a job flinging garbage bags into big trucks….social ecological engineer.
I was also thinking someone with a degree in that could get a job at a gym explaining why there isn’t a separate locker room for TGs, when a female member complains about finding a man in women’s locker room.
Or maybe one could get a job driving a cab in Chicago, Philly, or New York City.
I belong to that place. My wife and I don’t ever use the bathrooms/showers. The zone seems to attract some pretty bizarre individuals, but we do have a good laugh on the way home. But, This would be the perfect place for a social ecologist to work…experimenting on the sexual habits of perverts and how long it takes for said business to file for bankruptcy. Corporate must have hired a social ecologist already, judging by there motto…no judgement zone.
Certain university’s are already looking into that.
Just read that UC-Ignorant has reversed the ban.
Sorry Lard Taylor. You lose again.
Good to hear. Common sense prevails. Guevara apparently does not like this country as indicated by his quoted statements. He can go pound sand sideways.
I liked reading about the ROTC guys willing to stand guard over the flag. One thing I guess the ROTC students have over cpt Lard – pride in their National Standard.
Too bad none of the intelligence transferred with him while he was MI. BTW has anybody requested FOIA documents on our resident professor?
‘way back when, one of my fraternity brothers made the cover of Life magazine – had a campus protester in a headlock. Seeing as he was a weight-lifter, that particular protester was going no-where – and was unhappy.
David, protesting is protected speech.
How do you reconcile decades of pride in a frat boy friend of yours putting a protestor in a headlock and your sense of duty to protect the constitution for all Americans?
Because protestors sometimes have the idea that practicing ‘free speech’ allows them the right to get in your personal space. That’s when they end up in head-locks, or in other conditions that lend themselves to adjustment and refinement of attitude.
fair enough.
Said protester was attempting to burn the ROTC building, by the way. Said ‘frat boy’ was en route to commissioning via the USAROTC program. And actually I am really OK with attempted arsonists being headlocked.
First of all, who said I am not proud of our flag?
Second, FOIA away. I am sure John has already executed the request.
Third, as both a political symbol and a symbol of a nation displaying the flag, treating the flag dishonorably as a political act, or refusing to display the flag are all forms of protected speech.
I care about the flag, but I care a hell of a lot more about the 1st Amendment. Including the 1st Amendment rights of my fellow citizens.
I care about the flag, but I care a hell of a lot more about the 1st Amendment. Including the 1st Amendment rights of my fellow non-citizens.”
There Lars, I fixed it for you.
Hey a few of us exercised our First Amendment rights to conduct SCIENCE, and the consensus is you’re a douchebag. Therefore, we have scientifically proved you are a douchebag.
Yeah, no, I haven’t requested a FOIA on you, Lars. I have standards. If I did, someone might consider that intimidation and that’s not who I am.
UC Irvine did not really reverse anything since there was never a ban on flying the flag on campus.
The 6-4 vote was to not fly any national flag in the student government space in this picture. An area that looks to be less than 144 square feet.
http://www.ocregister.com/articles/flag-653323-students-ban.html
I have gotten a lot of hate and vitriol over this. But, the flag was never banned from campus. This really was a completely manufactured controversy. College kids experimenting with the “inclusiveness” debate in their tiny office space in the back of a building.
The fact that many on the right are using it as a reason to call for defunding public universities and stopping financial aid is despicable.
Good on the UCI student cabinet.
http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-uci-vote-to-ban-american-flag-others-misguided-20150307-story.html
The only place this had a remote chance of standing would be UC Berkeley. Most schools have enough sane and non-elitist students to overturn such a ridiculous proposal.
Regarding this disdainful group of overgrown children: it’s easy to despise what you’ve always had, and take for granted.
PLEASE JONN! Can we dump Lars, the attention whore? “Recent Comments” fill up with lightening speed whenever his BS appears thus obliterating references to stuff I really want to follow.
Naw, we don’t want to dump cpt Lard. He’s like our own version of America’s Funniest Videos. You know that every time he shows up he’s going to spout off something stupid that makes the rest of us point, laugh, and say WTF.
While I celebrate and support the right to protest, it always amazes me when idiots want to ban or disrespect one of the most important symbols of the country that gives them the right to protest in the first place. Imagine if students at the University of Moscow or Peking Polytechnic did this back in the late 70s or early 80s…
If I were a protesty type, I would honor the flag…and the sacrifices of those who gave me the right and ability to protest.
Students Do Stupid Student Stuff
Film at 11…
All I can say is come to my house and try to take down my flag.I WILL BRING SOME P ON YOUR ASS like you cant began to know.You make me sick you low life punks You know nothing about the love of our flag to stand and salute it.
you live here but you dont love our country.
You should be ashamed of your self