Purple Hearts for Fort Hood Shooting Victims? Maybe.
Well, that could be the result if the latest Defense Authorization Act (DAA) passes and is signed.
Per the Army Times, 2015 DAA being considered by Congress
. . . stipulates that Purple Heart medals will be awarded to “members of the armed forces killed or wounded in domestic attacks inspired by foreign terrorist organizations.”
The Army Times article has more details. IMO, it’s worth a read.
IIMO it’s way past freaking time for this to have happened. Better late than never, I guess.
Category: Military issues, Terror War, Veterans Issues
It didn’t say…..but this will be retroactive??
And will Barry “its only workplace violence” Obama sign off on it?
Of course he won’t sign it. The Glorious Leader has no free time for such trivial matters! He only just got back from his twice-a-week multimillion-dollar vacation and he’s got a tee time this morning! Like everything else, any signature will be stamped by the professional yes-men he calls a staff.
But. . . but. . . that means TPTB would have to change the status of the Ft Hood shooting from”workplace violence” to an OFFICIAL terrorist act. (which would also mean that the military could official execute ex-Maj Hasan?)
Ditto for the several recruiting stations shootings and killings by the local homegrown jihadists.
I ain’t holding my breath.
ARE YOU SERIOUS? I am surprised by what I am reading here. Usually, y’all are really logical and grounded, well more or less.
Giving PHs to Hassan’s victims would elevate his actions from a cowardly crime into an act of war. It would make him a member of a declared hostile force and thus be covered by Common Article III of the GCs instead of a simple criminal.
I understand the impulse to give those brave men and women the PH, but it would be wildly inappropriate.
JAGO, your opinion, like mine, is our own. Personally I could care less about “elevating his actions”. He murdered his fellow servicemen/women in the name of the enemy. He had turned traitor, joined the Jihadists, and attacked our troops. He was no different than any other Jihadists POS and our troops shouldn’t be treated any different at Ft. Hood then they would in Iraq or Afghanistan. In Vietnam we had Viet Cong who would work on the bases as civilians. They killed and wounded our troops. Should we take away any Purple Hearts awarded because it happened on a main base? I respect your opinion but just have to disagree.
JAGO: so? There is no prohibition in the Geneva Convention on executing POWs for crimes (as opposed to acts of war) they commit. And his crimes still qualify as murder under the UCMJ – he was a member of the US military at the time, whether a clandestine traitor or not.
I just wish we could hang the bastard vice giving him the needle. Traitors don’t deserve the military dignity of a firing squad, and lethal injection is too . . . clinical for my taste to be used on a turncoat.
I would like to resubmit my earlier proposal: four Abrams, opposite directions, signal the drivers to creep forward.
I’d have no problem with that, Other Whitey – but I’m guessing the SCOTUS would.
So far as I know the SCOTUS is OK with hanging, the firing squad, and lethal injection. So any of those will do the trick.
I’d just prefer to see him hang. The other two methods seem inappropriate for a traitor.
This is correct. Hassan’s guilty verdict would get tossed. The JAG that served as his defense counsel and the prosecutor both stated this.
SGT Akbar’s guilty verdict would also get overturned once the precident was set. Who knows how many others.
Kinda doubt that. Remember, tool: lawyers make many claims that appeals courts don’t buy. Especially when they’re grasping at straws trying to save their client’s butt.
As I recall, Hassan admitted in open court to committing murder under the UCMJ while serving as a member of the US military. The fact that he was disloyal at the time is irrelevant to his crime.
Further, one of his victims was a civilian not serving with the US military in a combat zone – and thus not a legitimate military target. So even if a court bought that bogus argument regarding uniformed personnel, they’d not be likely to buy it for the murder of a civilian.
Had he resigned, then done something like this, that argument would have more merit. But in that case, he’d have been tried under Federal statutes concerning murder committed during a terrorist act.
Besides, in the end it doesn’t much matter. If Hassan conviction is somehow invalidated, he can be tried for murder in a civilian Federal court – or retried under the UCMJ for aiding the enemy and murder. Both crimes have the death penalty as a maximum. After the public statements I seem to remember Hassan making on the record at his Court-Martial, conviction on those charges would seem to be fairly simple.
Given those same statements, I believe he could also now be tried and convicted for treason – which I believe also carries the death penalty.
Double jeopardy would apply. His old conviction would get throw out on an easy appeal (the circumstances presented by the prosecution for his original conviction were just legally changed by the government) and his petition to not get tried again would win.
Are you even forgetting that it took almost four years for the original conviction? I’m sure you’d be happy to watch that piece of shit go through the courts for another five years, making a mockery of our system, but I wouldn’t.
A conviction overturned on appeal has nothing to do with double jeopardy – in fact, appeals courts generally allow (and sometimes order) retrials when they overturn a conviction on a technicality.
A “changed circumstances” argument here is bogus and irrelevant, as the elements of murder/aiding the enemy during wartime under the UCMJ do not depend on the loyalty of the individual in question. His admissions in court actually would assist in trying him for murder incident to an act of terrorism. Ditto for trying him for treason, a conviction for which his courtroom admission now makes possible.
Further: don’t even try to put words in my mouth, dipstick. Rather than want to see this drag out, I want to see the guy dead yesterday. By your logic, your comments above must mean you’re OK with hiding terrorism and failing to acknowledge its victims, no? So – is that the case?
However, I also want to see terrorism recognized for what it is – even if/when it’s perpetrated by a turncoat insider. I also want to see those injured in the line of duty by terrorist actions properly recognized. Perhaps you don’t care about those latter two.
The great state of Texas could still try him. They have a very good record of actually executing the death penalty.
I believe that the Texas did not waive its right to try him at a later date.
I agree.
He wasn’t wearing a uniform and, therefore was in violation of Article IV of the Geneva Conventions. This would make him an unlawful combatant.
He was in uniform when he committed the shooting. He had like 20 or so fully loaded FNFiveSeven magazines still in his cargo pockets when they finally disabled him. He intended to shoot a lot more people.
As a Purple Heart recipient, I am totally in favor of this. My disappointment lies with my own group, The Military Order of the Purple Heart, who has stated that they are against this action. I just don’t understand that mentality. My local chapter is all for it and this includes a REAL POW from Vietnam, a Navy Fighter Pilot. But, since there are just about 6 to 9 of us that even show up at meetings and events, our voice doesn’t matter to National. I really hope this goes through for the brave men and women that were killed and wounded by this Moslem Terrorist piece of shit and I pray to my God that he become a martyr quickly and painfully.
I think the awards of Purple Hearts in the La Belle Disco bombing in Berlin in 1986 are the precedent here.
If I ever knew that, I had forgotten about it.
“In 1984, President Ronald Reagan signed an executive order expanding the award criteria of the Purple Heart to permit it to be given to U.S. personnel killed or wounded as a result of international terrorist attacks or while serving on peacekeeping missions such as Lebanon.” VFW Magazine September 2010
The article is brief but chocked-full of PH history. It’s worth a read.
http://digitaledition.qwinc.com/article/The+Purple+Heart/472068/0/article.html
Reagan was not alone in issuing an Executive Order regarding the Purple Heart. Truman and FDR both issued them too. It would appear that even if Congress does nothing or the Golfer in Mom Jeans says nyet, the NEXT President of the United States may be able to effect the change.
Jonn, I believe you are correct. I had mentioned the La Belle Disco bombings at our MOPH meetings as another precedent for the Ft. Hood wounded and dead receiving Purple Hearts. I have to be honest though, I just said the Disco bombings. Couldn’t remember La Belle. Heck, I’m old.
This too.
http://www.navycthistory.com/sabana_seca_bus_tragedy_1979_1.html
Sabana Seca attack in 1979. One of the recipients, CTT2 Edwards, worked for me in Japan in the 90s. That’s the first time I ever heard of this.
POTUS/SECDEF could have used this justification to award the PH. They just chose not to.
Mustang, thanks for posting this. I sent a copy of the link to my brother who was a CT.(Off shore South Vietnam and North Vietnam) He replied just now saying that one of the CT’s killed was a friend of his when he was in. He and I had both forgot about this incident. Again, thank you.
Not a problem. CT’s had a rough couple of decades. The EC-121 shootdown on 15 April 1969, USS Liberty, USS Pueblo, Sabana Seca, the EP-3E Hainan Incident and others people never have and never will hear of.
And the link I posted is excellent. CTTCS Joe Glockner does a bang up job.
Regards to your brother, my fellow spook.
Mustang Spook…Bill was buds with CTO1 Ball but he’s confused as to what a CTO is. He said when he knew Ball he was a CTR. Is CTO a newer rating?
Oh, and just FYI, my buddy went to college with a CT who was on the Liberty. Met him, seemed like a nice guy. Not long ago I found a list of the crew members when they were attacked. His name was not on it. I had to break the news to my friend that the guy was a CT Wannabe. First I’ve ever heard of. Take care my friend.
Hasan Akbar wounded and killed several soldiers in his attack-did they get the Purple Heart?
Enough time has passed so, phonies with Purple Hearts who were at Ft. Hood that day in 3..2..1
It”l be like POW numbers. Example 30 people wounded 630 collecting VA benefits for the FT. Hood shooting.
However, phonies aside, it is way past time for those soldiers to received what they earned at the hands of a terrorist by his own admission.
I’m for it. It shouldn’t matter where the incident occurs, only that it was committed by an enemy force.
I hope this does go through, but don’t hold out much hope for it.
We are all aware what self-centered prig bodaprez is and what his crapweasel adviser will say he should do.
In regard to hasan,he can starve to death or be shot, for all I care. He’s on the same sociopathic level as the slugs that ‘inspired’ him, and if he hadn’t been stopped in his rampage he probably would have turned his gun on himself. Firing squad, throw him into the Pacific.
Blobfish have to eat, too, you know.
What’s’ next?
PTSD?
Not picking a fight here, but I can only imagine that it will be around the corner.
I can see there one day being a PH1 and PH2 to distinguish between physical injuries inflicted by an enemy and everything else.
Any bets as to how long before the first cyberwar medal for “valor” is presented?
Green Thumb, I fully understand your concern but what makes a psychiatric disability any less of a disability than a physical wound? My best friend from Vietnam got a Purple Heart from a small schrapnel wound from the Ah Shau Valley where he spent all 12 months as a 60 humper for the 327th of the 101st. Although he’s had a somewhat successful life, his PTSD has caused him more problems for over 40 years then his scar. Now, with the total relaxing of the criteria for PTSD, I would have to agree with you, but one of my patients before I retired was a Marine, Navy Cross recipient who suffered from PTSD big time. He also had a Purple Heart but had no residual effects from his wound but a ton from his PTSD. It’s just not that black and white. To me, after 30 years of working with REAL PTSD patients, I would say mental wounds can be even more serious than some physical wounds. Again, I hear what you’re saying and now people get rated for PTSD for hearing stories about combat, so in these cases I would have to agree with your opinion. It is sad to me how they have lowered the standards for what is a horrible disorder now being faked by thousands.
While I applaud Congress for a long overdue decision, the language appears to leave those attacked in the 2011 Frankfort airport shooting (and a few other less publicized incidents) out in the cold.
Someone else posted on Stolen Valor that the current thinking is that:
“Soldiers who were wounded in action whose injuries required the Soldier to be removed from the field of battle and could not sustain combat actions as a result”
Seeing as how the entire planet is considered a battlefield (IMO)and that enemies can strike any place and any where, a PH that causes duty removing injury is justified.
This language is not exact but a brief summary is here:
http://www.americanwarlibrary.com/theheart.htm
I don’t think it’s been mentioned here yet, but the military person killed and wounded at the Pentagon on 9/11 got Purple Hearts. What’s the difference between their deaths/injuries and those at Ft Hood other than the fact that we WEREN’T at war yet when the 9/11 attacks took place?
Not a damn thing except for politics.
So yeah – last few years during mandatory Anti-Terrorism training, the DoD training uses “Fort Hood” as an example of domestic terrorism…anyone else notice?
Domestic terrorism is common. Eric Frein, Timothy McVeigh, that guy that just shot up downtown Austin.
Lots of people hate the government and want to shoot everyone they can to prove their point.
I get that – but I’m saying in TRAINING at least, Fort Hood has been cited as Terrorism – always confused me because the official classification differed.