West Chester, PA getting more bitter

| August 7, 2008

Some of you may remember that TSO and I ventured into the hinterlands to West Chester, PA back on Flag Day to spend the day with the Sheepdogs and Skye.

I like this picture of Skye, so this gives me chance to post it again;

Since they can’t stop the pro-victory movement from showing up against their “peace vigil” every Saturday, Skye writes in the Free Republic that the aged hippies are trying to use legal (or extra-legal means) to silence them. Below is the letter that  Rich Davis, the founder of the movement in West Chester, received (you can click the letter to make it larger, if you need to);

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Skye writes;

The same tactic was employed by a VFP’er Sandy Kelson in Erie, Pa and it failed magnificently. As will this latest stunt by the ‘peace’ movement. The CCPM is the same group that can boast of having a convicted ‘peace slapper’ in their midst.

Personally, I fail to see what getting lawyers involved at this point would gain. The war’s damn near over. Both candidates for president have admitted that they’ll keep troops in Iraq – especially because the war is winding down. It sounds to me like there are a couple of mental defectives who’ve taken their supposedly altruistic movement and turned it into some sort of personal vendetta against anyone who disagrees with them. But when your whole ideology is centered on emotional reactions, you’re bound to attract some sociopaths.

As Skye says, there’s only one side in this that’s had someone arrested for irrational behavior, and it ain’t the Sheepdogs.

Category: Antiwar crowd, Bloggers, Legal, Politics

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TSO

I like any and all pictures of Skye, except the one taken with me.

This one is my fav:
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rochester_veteran

Great pictures!

The CCPM is attempting to silence the the Chester County Victory Movement, plain and simple. This is a typical leftist ploy and it shows that it’s the lefties that are the fascists after all. On the national scale, we have Nancy Pelosi trying to revive and reinstate the so-called “Fairness Doctrine”, which isn’t fair at all, it’s an attempt to silence conservatives.

Skye and other “American Sheepdogs” have been documenting the Saturday Victory Rallies in West Chester and have the evidence of who’s been doing the harrassing!

509th Bob

Since he has been so kind as to send a copy of the letter to the Chief of Police, I’d send a reply, copied to the Chief of Police and the Federal Bureau of Investigation.

Thank you for your letter.

Your letter omits to provide any specific acts of illegal harassment or threats. Please provide the name(s) of your client.

It is a violation of federal law, specifically Title 18, United States Code, Section 241, to conspire to deprive any person in any State, or Commonwealth as in the case of Pennsylvania, “in the free exercise or enjoyment of any right or privilege secured to him by the Constitution or laws of the United States, or because of his having so exercised the same[.]”

Without facts to substantiate the claims set forth in your letter, and given the apparent threat on your part to engage in some type of unspecified civil action designed to silence the First Amendment rights of [insert name of the West Chester pro-troops group], there is reasonable grounds to believe that you, and your client(s), may be engaging in criminal activity.

If you have proof of an actual criminal act by a member of [Skye’s group], then that information should be forwarded to the police for appropriate action.

Thank you,

Scrapiron

The Hippies have been losing since Hanoi John (traitor) Kerry made fools of them but they keep coming back for more slap downs. What do they call freaks who enjoy pain? Isn’t it a ‘lock em up’ mental condition?

GI JANE

“….placed some of them in fear and distress”??? What a bunch of pussies, hypocritical ones, at that. They make a living out of harrassing and threatening anyone who refutes their bullshit and makes them look like the assclowns they are. That, no doubt, makes them shit their diapers in fear. That “lawyer” doesn’t have a legal leg to stand on.

USMCdaughter1

I’m sure it caused them great distress and fear when one of their own assaulted Skye not long ago!!!

I had the distinct pleasure of getting out to West Chester in April not long after that happened and I have no doubt that bunch of whoosies and wimps would be in distress and fear if their tricycle didn’t operate properly 😉

Stay tough American Sheepdogs!

509th Bob

I’m Serious about the reply letter. Make them Commit to a position! This isn’t really much different from the Canadian “Human Rights” Kangaroo courts. FORCE them into a declarative statement. Then, file criminal charges against them! This ISN’T Canada! If we fail to fight this now, we’ll fight it later. Make this a dead-letter issue NOW.

Please pass this, and my earlier post, to Skye, who should share it with Mr. Davis immediately. Make a “paper-trail,” this idiot (Samuel C. Strethon) is treading a VERY THIN line. He is putting his law license completely on the line. This is a “put up or shut up” moment. This is a CAIR-like form of “lawfare”! That is precisely why I recommended that the FBI be “cc’d” on the response. They are the responsible federal agency for investigating federal Civil Rights violations. If you need the Pennsylvania FBI HQ address for the appropriate federal judicial District, let me know. I’ll provide it. The FBI will not actually DO anything, but you need to build your own “paper-trail” NOW. Keep building it, DOCUMENT EVERYTHING! If Mr. Strethon pursues this, proceed immediately to a federal law enforcement agency and file a CRIMINAL complaint against him and his client.

On the balance, if there are people in Skye’s who make idiotic threats, they need to reigned-in. You cannot give these people legitimate grounds to support their claim. If people are merely calling them bad names, that is not a sufficient ground for Strethon’s threat. If Skye’s people make ACTUAL threats of bodily harm to the left-wing “peace movement” (not in response to threats BY the left-wing “peace movement” people, who have a now-documented history of assaults), then this is, as it is said in the legal profession, an “actionable” situation. If, on the other hand, this Strethon moron seeks to IMPOSE HIS personal “standards of decency” (in contravention of Supreme Court rulings), then HE, PERSONALLY and PROFESSIONALLY, is violating federal law. File a complaint with the Pennsylvania Bar.

Jonn wrote: I emailed Skye about your comment. Thanks, Bob.

Skye

509th Bob:

Rich has permission to use your letter? I’ve counseled Rich to contact a trusted lawyer as well.

The sheepdogs have NEVER physically threatened or attempted to harm any of the peaceniks.

509th Bob, please email me to discuss this further, we are seeking legal advice in this matter.

Thanks Jonn and Bob for your help in this matter!

Gramps

509th Bob:
I’m not a lawyer, but that sounds like darn good advice. I’m a firm beleiver in building a paper trail when things may turn nasty.

Skye, keep hitting them, when they fall kick’em in the head. Good job!

509th Bob

Skye, I am prohibited by law from providing “legal advice” to people. On the other hand, I do occasionally, get calls from citizens who seek information. In situations where the legal jurisdictional issue lies within the sphere of the FBI (like this does), I tell them to call the FBI. Which is why I’ve recommended that you copy the FBI in any response that is sent. Yes, Rich has permission to use the language I have suggested. The language is merely my opinion, not my legal recommendation. Please note that I stated that Strethon “may be engaging” (as opposed to accusing him of actually engaging) in criminal behavior. In law, every word has meaning. Which is why he stressed your First Amendment rights in his letter, while attempting to undercut them. There was a Supreme Court opinion about a Vietnam War protester who wore a “Fuck the War” emblem, which basically ruled that anybody can express their opinion about anything, and by implication, anybody, no matter how profane, on any given issue. If Strethon wants a “pure First Amendment” fight, he’ll lose, but he’s counting on driving you, and your group, into financial ruin by trying to defend against it. This is the Canadian Human Rights Commission/CAIR tactic. The counter-tactic to defend against this is to kick the ball right back into his face. If your group has a friendly lawyer, use him/her. Not all lawyers are equal in their skills, but there should be some quality-lawyer who would volunteer his/her skills on a “contingency” basis (where they take, on average, 30% or so of any recovered damages) to represent you. I know that the blog “Classical Values” is a PA-based blog. I would solicit support from that blog, in addition to here. (Although not yet an American issue, you might want to see the “Small Dead Animals,” “Five Feet of Fury,” “Ezra Levant,” and “Blazing Cat Fur” websites to see what has happened to attacks on Canadian Free Speech rights, and the financial support that went to them to finance their defenses.) The more you (and Jonn) expose their… Read more »

ArmySergeant

Or, you know, everyone could just act with decency and respect everyone’s right to free speech.

Free speech doesn’t mean shouting at others that they should burn in hell. It is not constitutionally protected speech to call someone else an asshole. Your right to petition the government for redress of grievances does not somehow transmute into a right to call anyone whatever you want, and not have them respond.

People could and should grow up before trying to take everything to the courts.

Jonn wrote: You should save that lecture for your own side. Have you seen the videos I shot the other day?

rochester_veteran

Skye,

You may want to contact the Alliance Defense Fund and see if they may be willing to help and recommend an attorney in the Philly area that would be an expert in what you’re facing with CCPM. Although the ADF’s focus is primarily religious freedom, they may know of somebody that can help with your particular situation.

Raoul

Selena, you’re an ass. I have a right to say that because Elvis Kokesh sit behind Petreas as hold a sign calling him a liar and you’re still IVAW.

“It is not constitutionally protected speech to call someone else an asshole.”

Actually it is. Nobody is going to jail or a concentration camp for calling Bush an asshole.

GI JANE

Army Sergeant,

Like the IVAW? Pot, meet Kettle.

509th Bob

Raoul is correct. It is Constitutionally protected freedom of speech to call someone an asshole. We all have one, right? The metaphor is clearly understood. This is a protected right to express your opinion about someone, whether they find it personally insulting or not. It is NOT “freedom of speech” to slander someone. For example, if I called someone a pedophile, and that person was not a pedophile, and it damaged that person’s personal or professional standing in some way, then that speech would be illegal, and I very well might stand the chance of being found guilty of the offense of being a slanderer. There is NO Constitutional right NOT to be insulted – no matter what extremist zealots of any political persuasion WANT to believe. As the Supreme Court has previously said, the answer to free speech is MORE free speech. Canada is now, legally, trying to come to grips with this (for Americans) fundamental truth. To the degree that I “hear” IVAW bullshit claims, I simply demand PROOF. If atrocities were committed, and were witnessed, then bring the charges forth! Don’t sit back and FABRICATE crap to slander American soldiers. If you, Army Sergeant, or any member of the IVAW, have ACTUAL proof of military “crimes,” then I can certainly direct you to the appropriate U.S. Government officials who are responsible for investigating those offenses. If you have PROOF, you or your colleagues will not be ignored. But, so far, all I’ve heard out your group is pure shit. It is NOT a violation of federal law to call someone “Hadji”/”Haji.” It IS a violation of federal law to counsel others to mutiny. The Government, even under the sooper-dooper evil of the “Bushitler” regime, has generally declined to prosecute misguided assholes of the IVAW for the DEMONSTRABLE crimes committed by them. This is a replay of the post-Vietnam War. I didn’t like it then, and I don’t like it now. I, personally, object to the coddling given to leftist bastards, but I’m not in control. Which is a GOOD thing for you. PROOF, Army Sergeant, PROOF! Whining… Read more »

Rich Schiffer

As a veteran myself, and as a Friend, I can sympathize with people on both sides of this issue. I think my personal belif can best be summed up like this:

“If you can’t stand behind our troops, feel free to stand in front of them.”