End game?
name = 2Generals3Wars1DVFamily email = trthseeker5@gmail.comcomments = We Love Orly Taitz and Our Patriot Maj Cook Learn your Constitution You Dumb Sh_t REMOTE_HOST: 98.212.16.246
On July 20, 1969, man landed on the moon. Or did we?
The Knights Templar were wiped out on Friday the 13th, on orders from the Pope. Or, they went underground, became the Masons and hid the holy blood of Jesus in the body of a young woman they spirited away to keep hidden.
JFK was assassinated by Lee Harvey Oswald. Or, a man on the Grassy Knoll did it.
Fire melts steel. Or, as Rosie O’Donnell would have you believe, it does not.
Someone for the love of God explain to me what this whole debate over the birth certificate gets us.
Look, I don’t know if Obama is a natural born citizen or not. I am mildly convinced by the evidence I have seen that he is. The newspaper clipping, the record of live birth etc. I don’t care to get into the evidence, because my argument against this entire debacle has absolutely NOTHING to do with the evidence, the merits of the case, the Supreme Courts rulings on standing or any other facet. My concern is that none of this gets us anything. Say tomorrow Obama goes on TV and says “Enough, here’s my birth certificate.” What percent of Birthers will accept this evidence? 10 percent? 20? You all will just claim it is a forgery.
Let’s say he admits he was born in Kenya, the love child of Margaret Sanger and Haile Selassie. Who is the President now? Biden? Pelosi? If it is McCain, how does that help the country? We’ll get a few more years of “Selected, not elected” and the moonbats will get some new recruits. My specific argument is attacking Obama in his role as Commander in Chief. What is to stop the IVAW lawyers of the world from having all their people refuse to deploy on the same basis as this Major who tried to manufacture a case? Do you really want to give them this added ammunition?
What would stop me from refusing an order from my Battalion Commander on the grounds that he has not proven to me that he was actually commissioned in the Army? How far do you people really want to take this? This has never been about personalities. It’s about politics and rule of law. I think the initial case should have moved forward. You know, the one started by Hillary Clinton disciples. But it didn’t. The Supremes ruled. And you guys want to resurrect this Zombie of a case by finding more and more people.
If there is one thing that history has proven about conspiracy theories is that they never die. Was my post about the lawyer rude? Yes. That was the intent. And judging from our emails this morning, it worked. Am I pissed at MG Childers? Yes I am. This is a ridiculous fight we have no possible way of winning. And everyone in the middle of the country is wondering why asshats on the right keep doing this.
Have you not noticed how you guys are echoing the EXACT PHRASEOLOGY of the Bush Derangement People? You didn’t even come up with new slogans. Selected not elected? That is so 2001. Remember when we called for Gore to give in for the good of the country? Well, physician heal thyself.
BTW- To the guy who said I failed out of law school, I did not. I was entirely marginal, but did graduate from an ABA Accredited law school ranked in the top tier. Your Dentist Lawyer got her degree online. And managed to misspell her own claimants name in her brief. Should that at least give you pause?
And the argument about DADT is too absurd to go into in great depth, but DADT is something that will be handled legislatively, ergo we should let our Reps know how we feel. The Birth Certificate issue is not a legislative issue, it is a Judicial one. If you want a redress of your grievance, then contact Congress to your hearts content. But stop trying to get out of deployment and thus screwing over the unit you were supposed to serve with.
Category: Politics
TSO:
Just to back you up here:
http://www.newshounds.us/2009/07/16/fox_continues_promoting_birther_lawsuit_while_ignoring_red_flags_indicating_its_a_hoax.php
In other words, it was a scam, planned from the beginning, so this guy could get publicity. The. end.
…and just so you know, the Templars are alive and well…at Area 51…where they and a clan of Sasquatch, on detached duty of course, are developing a mind control device that cannot be defeated by aluminum foil hats or unwashed “Ron Paul for President” t-shirts.
And once again, servicemembers regardless of political stripe are agreed on one thing–grandstanding and bluster have no place in ranks. He wasn’t thinking of his brothers and sisters in uniform–big no-no number one. For that reason alone I would have had serious reservations over serving with him.
Quit Soldiering because politicians are brain dead morons??? Sorry, does not compute!
This birth certificate thing is simply hogwash. It is on par with 9/11 truthers, and whoever peddles this nonsense deserves, rightly, our scorn.
President Obama’s mother is American — a natural-born citizen must have his/her citizenship conferred on them at birth, either by Jus soli (“right of soil”), or being born in the U.S., or by Jus sanguinis (“right of blood”), through your parents.
It matters little if he was born abroad — he has Jus sanguinis citizenship, as conferred on him by his mother.
Richard,
As an immigration attorney, I disagree with you.
If the person is born abroad then the parents citizenship and age are becoming an issue.
A USC mother (single or w/alien husband) may not be able to confer her citizenship on her born-abroad child if she does not meet very specific criteria.
Unfortunately, it is not as simple as you want it to be.
Olga has it right. It isn’t a cut & dried issue, and there are a number of tests for citizenship when one parent isn’t a citizen, and the child is born overseas.
There are questions that POTUS needs to truthfully answer. Having said that, Major Cook is a scam artist and deserves whatever he gets for being a blue falcon.
respects,
I am not a Nirther. Having said that, you asked why the birth certificate is important. In my view, its important because being a “natural citizen” is a specific prerequisite for the job of President. Its important because, if indeed this is/was another violation of the Constitution, which is the source and justification of ALL federal law, then we have a real problem. Does that put the idiot Biden in charge? Perhaps yes. Can he do more damage than Obama? I doubt it. I’m rather more concerned about the current Congress, which acts in complete contravention of the limits imposed by Article I, Section 8 (the enumeration of Congressional legislative jurisdictional power). Do I believe that a Democratic Congress that is willing to openly violate the Constitution is also willing to conceal a potentially disqualifying fact about Obama’s legal qualification to be President? Yes, I do. Would such liars conspire to hide each other’s lies? Yes, they would.
In the end, however, assuming (as I do) that Obama is a “natural citizen,” would I surprised if he ignored the 22nd Amendment and tried to pull a President-for-Life Chavez scheme upon the United States? No, I wouldn’t. Would Congress try to support that? The current one certainly would try.
That is the level of distrust and discontent that underlies this Nirther conspiracy theory.
A USC mother (single or w/alien husband) may not be able to confer her citizenship on her born-abroad child if she does not meet very specific criteria.
Notice how tentative you are in this statement? You’re unwilling to commit to a position. Why?
Let me add to the discussion that Obama’s mother married Obama’s father while he was already married to a Kenyan woman. That marriage is thus invalidated by American law. Obama was born out of wedlock, in other words.
He has, as I’ve said, Jus sanguinis citizenship, as conferred on him by his mother, regardless if he was born abroad:
7 FAM 1133.4-3 Birth Out of Wedlock to American Mother
[TL:CON-68; 04-01-1998]
a. Claims Under Section 309(c) INA [Immigration and Naturalization Act]: A child born abroad out of wedlock or after December 24, 1952, to a U.S. citizen mother acquires U.S. citizenship if the mother was physically present continuously for 1 year the United States or its outlying possessions at any time prior to the child’s birth.
This is a losing issue — it is not something any self-respecting conservative should be parading in public.
For once I hate to disagree with you Richard. I don’t claim to know the issue well, but I generally trust Prof Volokh:
http://volokh.com/archives/archive_2008_11_30-2008_12_06.shtml#1227910730
So, as I now read 8 U.S.C. § 1401, “a person born outside the geographical limits of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is an alien, and the other a citizen of the United States” before Nov. 14, 1986 is a natural-born citizen only if the citizen parent “was physically present in the United States or its outlying possessions for a period or periods totaling not less than ten years, at least five of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years” — the same rule that was in place in the early 1960s. See also United States v. Flores-Villar, 497 F. Supp. 2d 1160, 1162-64 (S.D. Cal. 2007) (taking the same view and concluding the change from ten years/five years to five years/two years only applied to people born after 1986), aff’d, 536 F.3d 990 (9th Cir. 2008) (so assuming but not discussing it in detail); Rico-Ibarra v. Mukasey, 281 Fed. Appx. 694, 695 n.1 (9th Cir. 2008) (not precedential).
(Obama’s mom was like 3 weeks short of 19, ergo missed the 5 year requirement.)
Someone made the claim that because McCain was born outside the U.S. and he had to prove his citizenship. The circumstances between the two are entirely different. McCain’s father was in the Navy and McCain was born in the Panama Canal Zone which was, at the time, defacto American territory. There are still claims that Obama was born in two different hospitals and numerous claims he was born in Kenya. If the American people don’t have “standing” to know the truth, who does? I’m not for military rebellion and am troubled by what this latest case could mean, but the question needs an answer that will satisfy people who understand some logic. (You will never placate those who simply refuse to believe anything.) If it’s no big deal then Obama should have made this public a long time ago. What is he hiding?
For once I hate to disagree with you Richard. I don’t claim to know the issue well, but I generally trust Prof Volokh
No trouble — I appreciate the extra information and links. Prof. Volokh has an apt legal mind.
However, judging from that same link you provided, notice that Prof. Volokh DOES NOT support the “nirthers” as they’re called:
“I have no reason to doubt that President-Elect Obama was born in Hawaii, and is therefore a natural-born citizen.”
Oh no, Volokh thinks they are nuts, and I agree.
Just hated to disagree with you when we finally found some common ground.
See, TAH, bringing peeps together since (looks at watch) 3 minutes ago!
or being born in the U.S., or by Jus sanguinis (”right of blood”)
The important thing to remember in the case of President Obama is that he is, in fact, the Sang real the “Royal Blood” of the Merovingians. Yes, The One is of the Bloodline of Jesus Christ and Mary Magdalene, in accordance with prophecy. He is The One, come to lead us…the Lion (or “Simba”) promised who would follow the Lamb.
I don’t think I have to mention that now is the time we shoudl prepare for the Rapture. TSO-as I imagine you will be Left Behind whilst I will be Taken Up, I bequeath all my worldly possesions to you. To wit, my possessions consist of: the complete “Firefly” collection on Blue Ray disc, $33 in “Burrito Bucks” (gift certificates to a taco stand in Buena Vista, AZ wherein the image of the Virgin Mary has been recorded on not one, but three-TRINITY!?!-corn “flautas”) and a collection of “Mana Potions” I concocted for myself when it became apparent that the Babylon Working project started by Jack Parsons at the Jet Propulsion Labs was synonymous with the opening of the Dark Portal in the Black Morass…and also responsible for the Tunguska explosion.
Also…this obsession with “proving” we landed on the Moon is preposterous. We didn’t land on the Moon, the Moon landed on US as is well documented by the invasion craft recovered at Roswell, New Mexico.
Also, I was shocked to find that there is a NEW Mexico to begin with, and we should be looking into this to find out if it is some sort of insidious plot.
Bill R. wrote: “There are still claims that Obama was born in two different hospitals and numerous claims he was born in Kenya. ”
Yeah, well, I get emails claiming that there’s a million bucks waiting for me in Nigeria.
Whatever “claims” exist about hospitals today, there were birth announcements printed in Hawaii soon after his birth. The simplest explanation, per Ockham’s Razor, is that Obama was born in Hawaii as his COLB says.
Air travel being what it was in 1961, traveling back and forth to Kenya would not exactly be like hopping on Southwest Airlines for a day trip to Vegas. If I’m not mistaken, there were still a fair number of people crossing the Atlantic in ships rather than planes in 1961. (I recall a Munsters movie in 1966 had them taking a ship to England). And the crossing to Hawaii would be no small trip either. Finally, given the financial status of Obama’s parents, it would be unlikely that they’d be traveling by air, which was quite expensive. The idea of people popping back and forth is anachronistic.
Re: “numerous claims he was born in Kenya.”
They are all made up claims. ALL made up.
Obama was not born in Kenya. He was born in Hawaii.
There is legal and logical proof he was born in Hawaii. There absolutely no proof that he was born in Kenya.
His being born in Kenya is as unlikely as his being born on Mars. His mother would have had to go to Kenya while she was pregnant at a time when there were no direct flights and when you had to get a Yellow Fever shot to go to Africa (very bad during pregnancy).
Then, if she gave birth in Kenya, there would at least be be a record of her arriving in Kenya (no such record), a record of her giving birth in Kenya (nothing), and a record of the child being given a US visa to go from Kenya to Hawaii (nothing) or that his mother’s passport was amended in Kenya to include him (nothing). There are no documents showing that Obama’s mother went to Kenya or gave birth in Kenya. There are no photos (imagine a US tourist going to Kenya without taking photos and sending them to her relatives).
The Kenyan grandmother of Obama DID NOT say that he was born in Kenya. She said that he was born in Hawaii. Listen to the complete tape, particularly to the answer to the question “Whereabouts was he born?” Here is the complete tape on Bert’s website. http://www.obamacrimes.info/Telephone_Interview_with_Sarah_Hussein_Obama_10-16-08.mp3
If that is too difficult to listen to, here is a transcript. http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/obamatranscriptlulu109.pdf
There are Hawaii government records showing that Obama was born in Hawaii and they have been confirmed by the two officials who looked into the file and said that there was an original birth certificate in it, and a spokewoman for the Department of Health then said that the finding of an original birth certificate means that Obama was born in Hawaii. http://www.swamppolitics.com/news/politics/blog/2008/11/obama_hawaaianborn_citizen_for.html
And there is a woman who remembers Obama’s birth in Hawaii. http://www.buffalonews.com/494/story/554495.html
What you’re saying may be true. So why won’t the one put the controversy to rest once and for all. If McCain had to do it, and his citizenship was never actually in question, why won’t Obama? I was alive in 61 although I was a child, and I am aware of how people traveled in those days. Why did his granmother claim he was born in Kenya? And birth announcements are not legal proof of anything except the fact that someone put an ad in the paper. A year ago, I never would have believed that a clown like him, with all his baggage could get elected to the highest office in the land, but it happened.
Man, why put the conspiracy to rest? He gains nothing by laying the conspiracy to rest. By letting the conspiracy theorists go crazy, he gives them somethig completely useless to target at, while taking their energies away from productive activity.
It’s brilliant strategy. Why give it up and let you all take aim at places he may actually be vulnerable?
I hadn’t really thought about it much until both Kapiolani and that other hospital both said he was born there. How is one born in two places, even in the same state?
Sumbody is full o’ da shite.