Brandon Bryant: Drones gave me PTSD
Y’all have been sending us this link all day from NBC about Brandon Bryant, the former drone operator from 2006 until 2011 when he left the service to be a media darling, apparently. He says that he killed 1,626 people from his desk chair in Nevada. I wonder if anyone, besides me, has bothered to do the math – that’s 325 people a year. Almost one a day for the entire time he was in the service, from day one at Basic Training. If it were true, and I doubt it, I’d say the drone program is doing a great job.
But we discussed Bryant in December and some of the folks who worked with him said that he was full of shit. His favorite story, he repeats in the NBC article – that he saw a child going into a goat shed just as he was blowing it up (because the US war machine hates goat sheds, for some reason) and he was wracked by the guilt of not aborting the Hellfire before impact. His mates said that there’s a delay in the video image, ya know, after going halfway around the world and all, so the missile had actually impacted on the goat shed by the time he saw the child on the video screen, if the story is even true.
His mates said that Bryant was actually a drone operator, but that none of the things he is telling the media is true. Besides, in the same character as Breanna Manning, Bryant isn’t supposed to be talking about anything he does, so it stands to reason that he’d tell the media stuff like this because none of it is true and he can’t get in trouble with his chain of command (he’s still in the IRR).
In the original post he told the Daily Mail that he “accidentally” joined the Air Force after the Army recruiter said he should join the Air Force. Yeah, I’m sure. I’m going to trust his mates on this one and file him under shitbag.
When he told a woman he was seeing that he’d been a drone operator, and contributed to the deaths of a large number of people, she cut him off. “She looked at me like I was a monster,” he said. “And she never wanted to touch me again.”
So why did he feel that he needed to tell this unknown woman that story? She probably knew he was lying, and a fan of TAH.
@49 That how it was in the Drone community. We were mostly threatened with clearance revocation.
Whoa, tiger. I’m glad you are here but you seem to be obfuscating. First, what do you mean the american people need a reminder? Do you consider it a patriotic duty or exercise to tell people that war results in suffering and death? Is that it?
Second, what do you mean that you didn’t “catch that NBC said I didn’t shoot anything”? you’re a detail guy. You are attuned to details through your experience and training. Are you really going to stand by that and maintain that NBC says you didn’t fire a single missile and yet here you claim to have done that–presumably on more than one occasion?
@50 Well, the USAF considers us flight crew. We go to flight medicine, have a class 3 physical, and wear flight suits. I was what I was told to be, for the most part.
I was really fine with the stress (i got to see a therapist, after my drone stint), until I got physically injured. I always had a release, a method to endure, a way to carry the burden. I just lost that when the accident happened. Everything crumbled.
“(T)rying to explain what a Sensor Operator is, and that they are different than pilots, is difficult for people to understand.” Oh, I think you’d be amazed, but most folks who post here fully understand what a “Sensor Operator” is, compared to a pilot. But, that was a nice bit of condescension on your part.
@52 I’m actually looking at the article and the interview. It doesn’t say that I didn’t fire any shots. I, in fact, describe my first hellfire shot in the interview.
I consider it a duty to tell the truth of a matter. Especially when leadership is blatantly lying.
@54 I wasn’t talking about here. People here are not civilians. Everyone else is.
@52 actually I found it. NBC messed that one up
anon in jax, i am out now, yes. i broke my back in 3 places on a jump and was told take a desk job or go home. i hold the same attitude now as i did when i was the team leader and you will not find one of my joes that didnt worship me. i am hard and demanding, but i also didnt lose a single man in my squad and only had 1 serious injury (and that was in alpha team, not mine). i dont pamper the little weaklings that have no bussiness in the army in the first place, and i dont buy in to this new kinder gentler army bull shit either. i pushed my men to be the best they could be and then farther. out of the first team i was ever leader of, every last one of those joes got their Ranger tab. if you arent man enough to do the job you signed up for, go home, i dont want you and the army doesnt need you. if you will not push yourself to be everything that is with in your potential, you are in the wrong place. if my attitude scares you, my older brother isnt as nice as i am and hes a drill sergent at ft leonard wood.
i am not claiming that some things arent hard to deal with or that i never had issues. but you deal with it, move on, and get on with your life. you want PTSD, look at a violent rape victim, but i see many of them that dont seem near as traumatized as the pogs that missed a steak and lobster monday at camp liberty.
i work as a cop now, and every little punk that you arrest has to be treated with kid gloves, reminds me of pogs.
“Though he didn’t fire missiles himself he took part in missions that he was told led to the deaths of an estimated 1,626 individuals.” That’s the last line in the 5th paragraph. So, what’s the answer now? It seems like plain English to me.
@59 I messaged Engle himself and told him about it. It should be fixed.
@49 Jax, all I can say is this. If you took that insufferable, holier-than-thou attitude with you to a meeting with an Artillery commander, you’re lucky they didn’t load you into a field piece and fire you at the enemy.
Part of psychiatric work is to be able to talk to people without royally pissing them off before you reach the end of your first sentence.
Oh, and Jax: I calls ’em like I sees ’em. If I like what you say, you’ll know that. If I don’t — you’ll know that, too. And I expect the same from you. 🙂
Brandon Bryant is a fucking clown.
You BB, you fucking Turd, what did you tell those people during “Peace Week” at UM? All 50 of them?
And what about some people that asked questions?
Can’t remember?
Or is it “the PTSD”?
You had no problem telling those people or “The Independent” that you were a killing machine.
Shitbag.
You make me sick.
And you looked like a fucking dirtbag.
Bringing credit to the AF and former airmen you were?
You and that tool Paul Chappell.
Weak sauce you are.
@63 I never told anyone that I was a “killing machine.”
For peace week I actually told the activists that were there that their methods were shit, and they need to find better ways of going about what they were doing instead of pissing people off. I told them that they needed to be more compassionate and instead of trying to protest outside of bases, they should protest the government officials that decide where and what actions are to take place.
Of course, I answered any question that had nothing to do with secret information.
@64 Paul is actually a good guy. I enjoyed talking to him. He is very very knowledgeable about warrior culture, war strategy, as well as peace.
Okay, Brandon. NBC messed that up and we should not believe anything in the Daily Mail. Those things aside, what is it that you think you are acomplishing with the publicity? What is it that you want the world to know? Right now, your marketability seems owing to the circumstances of your claim rather than borne of any genuine concern. To put it more crassly, the button pusher who isn’t at risk other than by paper cut but who claims to suffer the trauma of war is a like a freakshow character, an oddity. Combat photographers are at greater risk. And that conscience business is understandable, if what you did was illegal and aginst orders. Harry Truman made a decision that left him sleepling soundly at night. Eisenhower did too. So has every combat NCO. I do not understand what it is you are doing or trying to accomplish.
While I agree with that, the rest is bullshit.
Try that elsewhere, clown.
You did not correct anyone about who you were and what you did.
Plus you looked like a fucking sack of shit. Try cleaning up next time, you word and message (if you care) will go further.
Take some good advice from an old IN guy: look over your shoulder before you run your mouth. Never know who is listening.
Forget the “Kiamin” article? Did not challenge that one, did you? Much like “Independent” where you claimed you were recovering from all of those innocent kills and combat. Or just another news article that screwed up? Man, that makes like five and counting. Coincidence?
Like the spotlight, don’t you?
People will know, BB, people will know.
Clown.
Mr Bryant, despite your cordial attitude here, which is appreciated, your past actions and recorded words speak a much different version of yourself than you present. secret information has never seemed to matter much in the articles written about you and the stories you tell. you can deny you made all the claims that are attributed to you, but i am reminded of wise quote. “the first time someone calls you a horse, you punch him in the face, the second time someone calls you a horse, you call him a jerk, the third time someone calls you a horse it is time to go looking for a saddle”. how many different people are going to come out with “Mr Bryant tells this story” pieces and anyone will still believe that it didnt come from you? there is no conspiracy to make you look like rambo, just your own dillusions that came out at the wrong time. i do not care what your reasoning or justifications are, but for your own sake of honor you should admit your story telling, and renounce your prior claims.
Your 15 minutes of fame are up BB.
@67 I stated that my intention is to tell the truth of what goes on. I can understand how you would not see where I was coming from. I can also see why people would belittle my experiences. Telling people the truth of action and consequence is what I want. Drawing a light over the incompetence of the drone program is also what I want. I want my friends (and former friends) to not be scared to talk about their experiences and for people to see that the program isn’t a video game or an automated robot, but operated by real people.
The trauma of war is not purely physical and I don’t understand why so many people think that is the case. Trauma, just like coping, comes in many different shapes and forms. I challenge you to try to look at it in a different way. Or maybe read some science journals on the subject matter.
I hold truth at a higher value than I do anything else. The recent speeches by Obama on the subject that he can kill anyone he deems a terrorist with the program scares me. Because it is capable of just that. That is an indiscriminate use of power that needs to be held in check. The only way that things will change or get better is if people know what is happening.
Having taken a good look at the stories and the posts that Mr. Bryant has made, I’ve got a hell of an issue with you, sir.
Seems that shading the truth is second nature to you. Everyone else is full of shit but you’re the only one telling it like it is?
Um, yeah, not so much.
Well, I don’t know whether he is gone but I am seconds from that. If he does return, he should know that many regular commenters apparently exercised some difficult self discipline and stayed away from this thread. Not a boycott–more likely to keep from throwing their monitors into a wall after venting their spleens. I could be wrong. I doubt it. Enjoy life, Brandon. And remember the deaths and sufferings of all those airmen, sailors, Marines, and soldiers who made it possible. This is, after all, June 6th.
I would not give this clown a clearance to scrub toilets.
He might talk about it.
Top Secret and all.
However, I do not think he could last in the spotlight GI’ing shitters.
Trust me when I say I do not have a holier than thou attitude. I just know from working with tons of soldiers in Iraq and on the Inpatient Psych unit at Walter Reed that leadership is often one of the #1 stressors. It is the Army and I understand that, but we’re still dealing with people, not animals. They deserve to be treated as such. Training is different….Drill Sergeants in Basic Training & AIT aren’t expected to be nice and I defiinitely think the Army doesn’t do them any favors by treating them with kid gloves when they first get in. Just for the record, one of our Psychiatrists did the talking with 1SG Davis and the CO, and he didn’t take a holier than thou approach either. He approached them as a concerned medical provider who was hoping to address the issue and see if anything could be done. This isn’t an isolated incident either, and I think that’s part of the problem. But let’s be honest, PintoNag…there clearly is a problem, and it clearly needs to be addressed. I just don’t like the phrase “catching the PTSD” because it diminishes what’s really going on. I don’t know what kind of NCO Smitty actually was….perhaps he was an excellent one as he seems to think. Unit cohesion has been shown to be one of the biggest protectants, if you will, against PTSD and combat stress. If Smitty treated his squad like a family, then maybe none of them did get PTSD. But I can almost guarantee at least one or 2 people in his unit had some sort of combat stress reaction, because unfortunately, not every NCO is a great leader. I wish they were because I really really looked up to the good NCO’s I had when I was in. But I also met some totally shitty ones who didn’t deserve to call themselves NCO’s. So I do apologize for coming off as harsh in my initial comments. But I also hope you see where I am coming from, because it IS possible for anyone who kills… Read more »
@green thumb
are you talking about this?
His first mission was to follow an American Convoy, which exploded after hitting an IED. From then on, Bryant said he felt the need to save lives instead of take them.
“I think that was the turning point in my career,” Bryant said “I don’t know how much different I would have turned out if my first instance with death in the military would have involved me killing someone.”
or the fact that the Independent just reprinted the Der Spiegel article? I talked with the full intent that anyone could listen. You don’t seem like you’re an “in” guy, and if I am wrong, please accept my apologies.
@smitty
I’m not making anything up. If you want to go to the source the only people I’ve personally talked to and published are Der Spiegel, NPR, CBC, and NBC.
I don’t know what past actions you’re talking about. If somebody is going to debunk something that I’ve said, please come out and say it.
I’ve not lied, I’ve not cheated, I’ve not stolen anything. I’ve never said anything secret. I’ve stayed to the facts and my personal experience because those grounds are safe grounds.
Brandon! Can you at least claim responsibility for placing yourself in the media spotlight? I cannot feel sorry for anyone who does that and then complains about what someone else wrote and another someone likely edited to go along with whatever was their agenda for the day.
Here are a couple of clues:
1) The American public already knows that war is ugly. That is why 99.999999999+% of us are anti war either under all circumstances or except in defense of ourselves or our allies. Neither we (the military, active and retired) nor the civilian population needs schooling on that concept.
2) Most civilians do not want to hear about war or hear any war stories. If they say they do, they probably have an agenda and they will twist whatever you say to advance that agenda.
3) Using your military experience to make yourself feel better about yourself by running your mouth publicly is neither dignified nor honorable. As a retired USAF NCO, I can tell you that your attitude is quite disappointing to say the least.
@77 The original Der Spiegel article wasn’t supposed to use my name at all. That’s where everything blew up. And I’ve just sort of rolled with it.
Talking about this stuff doesn’t make me feel better about myself. It makes me feel worse, actually. Because I have to deal with negative attitudes and people with agendas as well as liars.
Well, unholy horse shit! Had I seen that bit above about Paul being a good guy, I would not have been nearly as kind in #77.
So, I will simplify things: Brandon, quit bringing discredit upon my beloved USAF! Cease and desist immediately. And apologize for dishonoring our service and everyone who has served before us and will serve after us.
Your feelings are yours and I resent your forcing them upon the rest of us.
By “in”, I assume you mean one of two things.
IN service currently, no.
Infantry, yes. I am surprised you do not remember me, but then it was raining and cold and you were “dirtbagging” out.
You are spinning the shit and people know. I would suspect even some of the peace folks as well. How you got on the agenda, I do not know.
Your game is over, clown.
While drones are a pivotal part of the fight and you have experience, I will make it a personal guarantee that you will never speak at a UM or Montana Vet forum in a public capacity again.
Your lies and embellishments for sympathy, credit and attention are through the fucking roof.
RLTW.
@79 I am forcing? I want you to think, really think, about what is happening.
hopefully I gave you somethings to think about.
@72 which issues? can you specify?
@81.
I need to go check on my tomatoes so I will take my leave.
You, sir, put the “Double D” in Dildo.
Mark my words.
To many men and women are fucked up to tolerate this unadulterated fantasy bullshit.
Goodbye.
@green thumb
Hey man, just because I was attempting to grow a beard doesn’t mean dirtbagging out. I don’t understand what you guys are saying about spinning shit or making things up. I’m here, answering questions more fully than any article or blog post could.
If anyone has any more questions/comments/concerns I’ll be on my G+ account.
Lastly, I value the services that each person here has provided. No matter what job you’ve done you have risen to a call that few people ever will. I’m not here to discredit the branches of military but question and bring to light the things I have talked about. And if I am the only one to do so, then so be it.
I wish you all peace and wellbeing
Drones gave him PTSD?
Better not order pizza from Domino’s.
I had a better chance of “contracting PTSD” in bars full of upstate New Yorkers who hated GIs in 1978 than today’s videogame pilots do…
Of course, that was the limit of my combat experience… No Purple hearts for scraped knuckles when the place was off-limits, even if it was my first week on base and a sergeant took me there so he could hustle some guys at pool…
There was a guy with a gun; but as far as I know he never shot at us… 😉
Just hold on there a minute, Buttercup. No one gets post traumatic stress disorder from watching a monitor. And I won’t make the ‘unless it’s whatever’ joke here. You have to have been physically present, participating directly in something, for that to happen. Ask a rape victim about post traumatic stress. That’ll give you an earful. A young woman was raped last month about two blocks from where I used to live in Chicago and she is dealing with it by actively working with police to put a stop to it in my old neighborhood. If anyone should have post traumatic stress, she should, and I’d bet hers is a hell of a lot worse than anything you can possibly imagine, because it happened to her at 2PM while she was waiting for the bus. As to being part of an operation in which a lot of people died affecting you emotionally, fine, but I doubt seriously that your experience can even remotely compare with the experiences of World War II bomber crews that participated in the firebombing of Dresden, in which 20,000 to 40,000 people died as a direct result of the incendiary bombing and the subsequent firestorm. The late John Schueler, a noted 20th century abstract-expressionist artist, was a navigator on one of those bombers for the Army Air Corps. He saw it firsthand. Yes, it affected him deeply, but he used the stress to become an artist. I’d listen to him before I’d listen to you. This is what happens in war. People die. They die on both sides. They are also severely physically wounded. But the majority of them pick their lives up and get on with them. They see and do things that are frequently horrifying, but when it’s over they don’t spend their time in whining and self-pity. If you expect me to believe that you have post traumatic stress from watching a monitor, you’ve got rocks in your head. People who work in slaughterhouses have it worse than you do. So do vet techs that have to euthanize dogs and cats that aren’t… Read more »
Brandon, you stupid, arrogant, worthless little self-centered nothing – I can assure you that you have done and said NOTHING which will give me a moment’s pause, much less add to my life experiences. You have also demonstrated, with a great deal of success, that you have nothing to teach me or something to say from which I would learn anything.
You are a loser in life’s lottery. Blaming it on others is a waste of time for you and everyone around you. Grow a pair and get on with life. But do NOT attempt to drag others into your gutter. That also would be a waste of your time because we simply will not aid you in your silly delusions.
Now get over your useless self and try focusing on something which has some expectation of a worthwhile outcome. You know that what you are now doing is not in the least productive. You know that we know it, but you come here to educate us? On what? How unnecessary you are to any of us? We already knew that, so once again, you failed.
Whatevers.
BB, Thanks for your service. I’m sure anyone who participates at any level in the military during a war can feel remorse. Many World War II vets said that The experience while neccessary was a huge waste of their youth and others lives etc…
Where you have erred ( in my opinion) is becoming a tool for those who would use your words to condemn not the simple fact that war is horrible, but that its all America’s fault.
If you want the least bit of respect from me go on “Al-Jizz” and criticize the actions of the Taliban and Insurgents. Playing the attention whore for the anti-war ( read Anti-American) crowd, intentionally or by being “misquoted” makes you a tool bag.
@86.
I did not know you had it in you.
Mad respect, my Lady.
Hooaahh!
Good job guy, you fooled the brainless reports and got your mug on the news. There, you had your 15 minutes of shame spouting your make believe story. Now go back to your sorry ass life.
Mr. Bryant, my issue with you is as I’ve stated before–everything is everyone else’s fault. You’ve been misrepresented, lied about, deceived, etc. You take none of the responsibility yourself.
Bottom line, you’ve got a LONG way to go before you grow up, and one of the hard lessons you’re going to have to learn and accept responsibility for your actions. I’ve yet to see you truly accept responsibility for any of he actions here. Der Spiegel wasn’t supposed to use your name. NBC got this wrong, so-and-so got that wrong. The bad men threatened me and made me feel bad so now I have teh PTSD. A girl doesn’t like me because I was in the Air Force.
Life’s hard. Wear a helmet.
Bryant: you might want to take another look at the wording on the SF312 you signed. You’re still bound by it (there’s no expiration date), and you appear to be skating dangerously close to the edge – if not over the edge – in what you say in your discussions about missions in which you (allegedly) participated.
You also might want to consider that many of the folks here have seen far worse than you have on your screen happening 10,000 miles away – and have seen it “up close and personal”. Until you’ve smelled the gunfire, lost friends/subordinates, and/or written some Purple Heart packets or supporting statements, I’m guessing you will find precious little sympathy here.
Anonymous in Jax: the term “catch the PTSD” is sometimes used derisively here at TAH for a very specific and IMO apropos reason. While many if not most PTSD claimants are legitimate, there is a significant minority who are not. It is such individuals to whom the phrase “catch the PTSD” is directed.
Those individuals are using a bogus PTSD “diagnosis” or claim as an excuse to malinger/avoid their responsibilities/escape punishment/get $$$ and other bennies from Uncle Sam. Like “lower back pain”, with a bit of study or coaching regarding the symptoms it’s damned difficult to refute.
From what little I’ve seen, I’d personally guess that maybe 25% of VA PTSD claims are either exaggerated or outright BS – and maybe more. For comparison, I’d guess the percentage of other types of VA claims that are exaggerated or fraudulent is a bit lower, but is at least 15-20%.
So here’s the thing….everyone is saying he can’t possibly have PTSD from being a drone operator. And I’d say you’re all right….part of the criteria for diagnosing PTSD is that the event or events in question that cause the PTSD have to give you a sense of fear for your life. I’d say that probably wasn’t the case. But a moral injury or a combat and operational stress reaction from being a drone operator are 100% plausible.
Thanks for clearing that up, Hondo. I understand now 🙂
I never knew a video game could give u PTSD. I guess that means everyone I know with an xboxlive account that plays call of duty have it to. I will be sure to tell them. NOT. my only award was a Purple Heart and I have PTSD but I sure as hell didn’t get it in an air conditioned building in the states…you are pathetic. You are a disgrace to the Air Force, the military, the USA, and the human race in general.
@93 – You’re missing the point, which is that Bryant is using that label as an excuse to be the center of attention, and almost all of the people here do not believe him or have any real sympathy for him. His arguments are weak, at the very best, because he can’t keep his story straight and blames the ‘mistakes’ on everyone but himself.
GT, thank you. I don’t see how I managed it without one naughty word, but somehow, it went smoothly.
Moral injury? Christ, now we’re at the Breanna defense.
Being a drone operator is not the same as playing a video game though. It’s real life.
Yeah, and if you have a bad day at the drone office, you might come home to a cold dinner.
Hey NHSparky, I’m sorry if you don’t like it, but it’s an actual term. Try out the term combat and operational stress reaction if you don’t like the alternative.