David R. Ziegel – Phony Soldier

| June 27, 2019

The folks at Military Phony send us their work on David R. Ziegel who is 64 y/o and lives in Beaver Dam, WI.

Dave claims… uh, well… he claims just about everything:

AH1 Cobra Pilot and Gunner, 101st Airborne, 7th Cavalry, Army LT (see above photo), U.S. Army Recon Scout Team “Mamba,” 17th Light Infantry Brigade, Long Range Reconnaissance Patrol (LRRP) and Jungle Expert serving on US Army Counter-Narcotics Teams down in Central America.

First, there is the AH1 Cobra Gunner/Pilot where he teases us with the term “Hot and Black” which only those on the “inside” would know what it means…

Then, as a pilot…

Then, the landing…

There’s a pattern here – most of the photos are scratchy, out of focus and the photographers are often deceased.

Let’s move on to ground operations…

Then there is Team “Mamba” of the 17th Light Infantry Brigade / LRRP / 101st Airborne Division…

Then, his team.  He labels them for clarity…

Most of them are now dead though…  but his point here is they were the “real deal” before Hollywood came along and cheapened things…

Oddly enough, this photo is readily available on the internet and each member is identified.  The one on the left is not Ziegel as he labeled, but another soldier.

Ziegel would often tell these stories in bars and other places around town, but people that knew him well recall that he was around town when he said he was in Central America.

This, of course, does not stop David from reliving the glory days of the past…

When filing a FOIA for the NPRC and the Wisconsin National Guard, they kept referring to each other in an endless loop.  Six FOIAs were filed with the same result…

Then, he had records of another kind…


Looks like David spent some time in the pokey.

We don’t suspect these charges would be compatible with serving recently in a US Army Counter-Narcotics unit.

What is ironic is that the Wisconsin National Guard does in fact have a Counter-Narcotics unit.

I’m going to cut this short, but many of these photos Dave has on his Facebook page are taken from the internet.

Have fun identifying where they came from and who’s in them.

HINT: They don’t seem to be of the warrior we all know from Beaver Dam.

The sadest part about all of this is we may never know what ‘going in “Black and Hot”‘ means.

Category: "Teh Stoopid", Army Poser, National Guard

Comments (137)

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  1. 3/10/MED/b says:

    I love the smell of napalm in the morning.

  2. Keepin' It Real says:

    I skim read this rather quickly, but think I got the gist of it.

    If you find yourself in Beaver Dam and need to deploy your assets quickly, consider inserting your Mamba team and go in hot and black.

    Is that what you all got out of it?

    • UpNorth says:

      I got that it was a warm evening and the light in the entry to the bar was burned out.

    • RGR 4-78 says:

      “Hot and Black” was what he was thinking until she started complaining about her Haitian, bi-sexual, IV drug abusing ex boyfriend.

  3. Claw says:

    “going in Black and Hot” is same/same for “Left Skid Low”

    Going to let our own commenter 100E handle this one./smile

    • Berliner says:

      Could be a reference to Bubba or Tiny “going in black and hot” (meaning no protection) on him, which is how he likes it.

    • GDContractor says:

      I saw a black and hot centerfold onetime. “Sweet Naomi”. It’s all pink on the inside.

      Claw. NSN Request:HEAT SEEKING SCOPE

      • Claw says:

        Okay. But since Ziegel talks all about “Black and Hot” which nobody knows what the Hell it is, we’re just gonna go old school on his ass with an FSN and not a modern NSN.


        Google-Fu it up for a Noun Nomenclature at your leisure./smile

      • Jay says:

        5855-01-565-0880, Sight, Night Vision Sniper Scope.

        Dammit….why yall gotta make me Supply today? I left that shit behind a long time ago. I tell you…there was boxes…boxes EVERYWHERE.

  4. Tallywhagger says:

    Wonder where he got the hat.

    • Claw says:

      If by the hat, you mean the Stetson, that may be the spark that brings either 2/17 Air Cav or 3/17 Air Cav back to life here on TAH.

      Seeing as how that unit crest (under the Bullwinkle Badge) on the Stetson is from the 17th Cav and not the 7th Cav.

      • Claw says:

        Oh, and did I fail to mention the acorns on the Stetson are for an enlisted soldier, not a commissioned officer or warrant. Mirror image of Left Low Ball Walls’ Stetson./smile

        Mea Culpa

      • Ret_25X says:

        don’t officers wear their rank on their stetson rather than the DUI?

        Asking for a friend who has been wearing one for almost 30 years now…


        • Anonymous says:

          Usually do… enlisted also. Rank goes over the cross sabers. Robert Duvall’s doing it right here:

    • ArmyATC says:

      The Stetson is a purchase item. The Army doesn’t issue Stetsons or leather flight jackets nor does any Cav unit require that a Soldier have one. In the case of the leather flight jacket, it hasn’t been issued to Army aviators since the end of WW2.

      “Hot and black?” In my thirty years in aviation, ten of which were in Army aviation units, I never heard that term used by anyone.

      Most if his helicopter pics are from units that served in Vietnam and the pics he posted of his “Team mamba” are actually photos taken by a few Army Rangers who served with H Co. in Vietnam.

      That clown is simply full of shit. It would appear obvious that he never served a single day in uniform. I would ask for the ‘Hemisphere of Insults’ to be deployed, but I wonder if that worm slime is really worth it.

      • OAE CPO USN Ret says:

        Maybe there should be something geared towards those not worthy of the HoI. We could call it the Toiletbowl of Taunts.

        • 5th/77th FA says:

          SECOND!!! We need an AYE!

          • UpNorth says:


            • ChipNASA says:

              OK Folks, I have caught up with you and have assembled a modest offering, some of which, as edited by myself, you may recognize.

              As with the The Hemisphere of Insults®™ , your contributions to the NEW, TAH Toiletbowl of Taunts are always welcome, but let’s remember, these are taunts not insults so remember that with your offerings.

              I now hereby, give to you….

              The TAH Toilet Bowl of Taunts

              You don’t frighten us, pig-dog! —Go and boil your bottoms, son of a silly person. I blow my nose at you, Thppppt!
              I don’t want to hear from you no more, you empty headed animal food trough wiper!…… I fart in your general direction! . Your mother was a hamster and your father smelt of elderberries!
              go away or I shall taunt you a second time-a!
              Fetchez la vache!
              You the brain of a duck
              I unclog my nose in your direction, son of a window-dresser
              You are a bedwetting type. I burst my pimples at you and you are a tiny-brained wipers of other people’s bottoms.
              We should make castanets out of your testicles
              You are an illegitimate faced buggerfolk

      • rgr769 says:

        My immediate reaction to that photo of “Team Mamba” was it looked like a photo of a six-man LRRP team in the RVN. Several of the team members are armed with XM-177 CARs, which were standard issue for recon teams. Also, the hooch behind them was standard construction for 1st Cav base camps. The camo berets were also common as the civilians made and sold them to LRRP units.

      • SFC D says:

        I occasionally wear a black Stetson, looks nothing at all like the cav version, except it’s black and it’s a Stetson. Had a very young, very inebriated PFC attempt to remove it from my head one night at the CP Humprey’s NCO club. He was still screaming “YOU AIN’T CAV!” when his forehead somehow slammed into the bar. I don’t know how that happened, maybe he slipped? I turned around and was face to face with the two biggest crew chiefs I have ever seen. Thought my night was over. Nope. They apologized for the error of their young Soldier’s ways and bought me a beer.

  5. HT '83-'87 says:

    He reminds of a guy that tells me he’s such a good bowler that he once “rolled” a 328…”beat that high score!!!”

  6. Ex-PH2 says:

    Going in “black and hot” is GySGT Apone pushing his Marines into the hellhole of LV246. (RIP Al Matthews.)

    • Jay says:

      Sgt Apone died? No shit? Damn…I just looked.

      Died in SPAIN. Wow. Always loved him in that movie, and loved the fact he was a LEGIT vet.

      • mr. sharkman says:

        More of the ‘marines’ in that movie were former mil than you might think.

        One was a friendly acquaintance, he was also a former Royal Marine Commando (UK). He still hung out with the boys.

        Sadly, years ago I heard he died in a freefall/paragliding/hang gliding accident (I can’t recall which ATM).

        Also, I HEARD (never tried to check any official records/dbs/files/etc.) that Michael Biehn was USN, and a DOR from BUD/S (at least he put it on the line).

        Never figured out why Biehn’s career never ‘took off’. He seemed like one of the better ‘action’ actors set to become a star…

        • NHSparky says:

          Checked a few of the larger movie/fan sites including IMDB, and no record or claim of Mr. Biehn having served.

          He has acting roles going back to 1977, so gonna say pretty unlikely he served AND was acting at 21, considering he attended U of Arizona.

          But he was awesome as Hicks, to say nothing of Johnny Ringo.

  7. Comm Center Rat says:

    Hey poser – Evel Knievel wants his Number 1 patch removed ASAP from your vest of bling.

  8. Claw says:

    Re: The Gunner’s seat picture/narrative.

    Nope, the last Army Helicopter Pilot KIA in Vietnam occurred about two hours after the official cease-fire took effect on 28 Jan 73. That happened in a UH-1 Huey near Can Tho, RVN and not in a AH-1G Cobra somewhere over Laos.

    Oh, and Ziegel, you can take “Bongo” and shove it up your ass for dishonoring the memory of that pilot.

  9. Hack Stone says:

    “Black And Hot”? That sounds like the entertainers that performed at an illegal “gentlemen’s Club”!in Augusta Georgia.

  10. Daisy Cutter says:

    The US Army’s Guide for Field Operations, Army Post – Panama. I assume we’ll find the term ‘hot and black’ and its definition in this book, am I correct?

    No sir.

    No? LT Ziegler, I’m a soldier. Is there no book, no manual or pamphlet, no set of orders or regulations that let me know that, as a soldier, one of my duties is to perform insertions that are hot and black?

    No sir. No books, sir. You see, it’s just a term we use… down in Panama, sir.

    No further questions.

  11. 26Limabeans says:

    I thought Warrant Officers flew Hueys.

    • Dustoff says:

      I can’t speak for the crews that flew guns, or general support aviation,but in the MEDEVAC community we had a mix of Commissioned Medical Service Corps Aviators and Warrants when we had UH1-Vs (before Dustoff transitioned to Blackhawks).

      • 26Limabeans says:

        Tanks Dustoff. Never got close to gunships in Viet of the Nam, just UH-1 slicks.
        Figures there would be O types in the Medical Corps.

        I think Ziggy was flying a crack pipe.

      • Eden says:

        A close friend flew MEDEVAC as a warrant. Black Hawks.

    • rgr769 says:

      Many Hueys were flown by commissioned officers, but the majority of helo pilots in the RVN were warrants. Commissioned officers had to log a certain number of hours to receive their flight pay, so even aviation company commanders would be flying missions to stay current and qualify for their flight pay.

  12. Morgan Blake says:

    Loading patients onto a helicopter while the blades are whirling during a medevac is especially challenging.

    This is referred to as a “hot load.”

    • Skyjumper says:

      Gets a bit hairy too Morgan, being extracted on a jungle penetrator. (smile)

      Geeeeezz, going in hot & black…penetrator….we all may need to get a grip on ourselves soon. 😉

      MAN DOWN!!

      • rgr769 says:

        Maybe this douchebag means going in at night without lights to do an extraction from a hot LZ. But obviously he wouldn’t know anything about that because he never even served in the military, let alone climbed into any military helicopter as a pilot.

        • Skyjumper says:

          He’s was such a badass rgr769, he didn’t need no stinkin’ illumination. He just used the glow from the green tracers. 😉

          • rgr769 says:

            In reality he wouldn’t even know the enemy’s tracers were green. Nothing like watching the red ones going out and the green ones coming in at night.

        • The Stranger says:

          As long as he had Visconti sitting on the skid with his trusty M-60, all would be well. I wonder what ever became of old “Forgin’ Frank?” Ah, the Golden Age of Phonies…

  13. GDContractor says:

    How in the hell did Patricia Ann get killed in the front seat of an AH1 over Laos? OVER

    • Martinjmpr says:

      I was just going to ask the same thing. His fiancé was killed over Laos?

    • rgr769 says:

      Good point, in my 15 months in the Viet of the Nam, I never saw a female flight crew member, pilot or gunner. For some reason they were all males. However, I understand there were some AF nurses on medical evac C-141’s used to transport wounded to Japan. Maybe Patricia Ann was a Doughnut Dollie taken for a joy ride over Laos. Those NVA anti-aircraft batteries defending the trail likely didn’t know there was a female in the front seat of that Cobra.

      • Skyjumper says:

        GDC, Martinjmpr and rgr769.

        Geeeez. The previous gunner was killed in Laos and the bird had been named for his fiance, “Patricia Ann”.

        C’mon guys, RUCK UP!! (smile)

        • Martinjmpr says:

          That might have been what he MEANT but it’s not what he WROTE. 😉

          • The Stranger says:

            To quote Old Man Daley’s chief of staff to the Chicago newspapers after a particularly unintelligible statement from the Boss: ”Don’t write down what Da Mare says, write down what he means!”

            And yes, those old school Chicago Irish politicians did (and probably still do) pronounce “mayor” that way.

  14. Hondo says:

    Looks like we have Ziegel’s follies playing today.

    In memory of a late WO friend who actually flew helicopters in Vietnam: GFY, you LSoS wannabe.

  15. A Proud Infidel®™️ says:


  16. Morgan Blake says:

    OK, I’m game for this…

    AH1 Over Vietnam – Wikipedia


  17. Morgan Blake says:

    Vietnam vs. Narcotics Patrol


    Found under Vietnam Photos on Pinterest

  18. Morgan Blake says:

    1st Cavalry Div


    Somebody else named all of these soldiers:

    Reed Cundiff, Gary Dolan, Larry Cole, Wilkie Wilkinson and Gary Linderer (All VN era Rangers) all served as LRRP’s.

    • A Proud Infidel®™️ says:

      Gary Linderer wrote a book about his time as a LRRP in Vietnam, “The Eyes of the Eagle”, good reading!

      • rgr769 says:

        I met him at a Ranger Company reunion at Ft. Campbell, KY. He was also involved in the magazine “Behind the Lines.”

  19. OldManchu says:

    The “my daughter’s stuffed animal” post he made really creeps me out considering it isn’t true. wtf?

  20. 5th/77th FA says:

    Left the lying, embellishing, Valor Stealing Piece of Sh^t David R. Ziegler some love over to the MP Site. His book of the fake was still up just a little bit ago. They had a linkie thingie that went straight into it.

    To quote one of our beloved poster’s favorite insults… F^ck you ass hamster. (my apologies to pet rodents everywhere.)

  21. Okay, I have to say that there is a team Mamba. Here it goes.David was a team member/dance instructor of the Arthur Murray dance studio franchise and taught peeps how to dance the Mamba. Mamba is actually spelled Mambo but the letter A comes before the letter O so I typed in the letter A. Hope everyone got it, and I didn’t include any puns. Check out the Turbans on youtube “When You Dance”

  22. Ex-PH2 says:

    I’ve been out foraging and I come home to this crap – stealing pages out of history and claiming he went there and done that, only THERE was some place it wasn’t and HE DID NOTHING – NOTHING – to deserve anything but pure contempt.

    Pardon my distempered approach, but this asswipe sucks the bag BIG TIME!

    I’m going out again. When I get back, if ChipNASA has not deployed some more of his Colorful Collection of Castigation, I will be SOOOOO disappointed.

    • ChipNASA says:

      Well you may have scrolled by it but now, for those not worthy of The Hemisphere of Insults®™

      We now have the The TAH Toilet Bowl of Taunts®™

      I am certain that you, madam wordsmith, would contribute greatly

      The TAH Toilet Bowl of Taunts®™

      You don’t frighten us, pig-dog! —Go and boil your bottom, son of a silly person. I blow my nose at you, Thppppt!
      I don’t want to hear from you no more, you empty headed animal food trough wiper!…… I fart in your general direction! . Your mother was a hamster and your father smelt of elderberries!
      go away or I shall taunt you a second time-a!
      Fetchez la vache!
      You have the brain of a duck
      I unclog my nose in your direction, son of a window-dresser
      You are a bedwetting type. I burst my pimples at you and you are a tiny-brained wipers of other people’s bottoms.
      We should make castanets out of your testicles
      You are an illegitimate faced buggerfolk

      Remember all, you certainly are welcome to contribute but remember, these are taunts, not insults, so feel free to hit me up.

    • Skyjumper says:

      Ex, are you out foraging up in my area? Thought I heard some bushes “rustle” when I was outside earlier.

      Don’t forget to use “squeeter spray” and check for ticks when you get back. (smile)

      • Ex-PH2 says:

        Not unless you live next door to an Aldi store.

        Dragonflies are starting now.

        • A Proud Infidel®™ says:

          Nothing wrong with Dragonflies, they eat mosquitoes like a “Joe” chowing on a BK Whopper after a week of eating MRE’s in the field!

        • Skyjumper says:

          No dragonflies here yet, but plenty of Barn Swallows following me around when I’m mowing, dive bombing the insects that I scare up with the rider.

          They remind me of Navy Corsairs going after Japanese Zeros, like Pappy Boyington and the Black Sheep. Dunno why I make that connection, but it’s awesome to have them flitting around inches from you. Ahhhhhhh, nature. (smile)

  23. Skyjumper says:

    BTW, the photo of the gunners seat on the AH1 Cobra “Patricia Anne” he posted?

    He kindly stole it from this website …daughters “Bongo” stuffed animal included. Dumbass!!


    This dick lives around 45 minutes southwest of me.
    Will have to contact a few friends I know in that area.

    If he did serve with the Wisc. Nat’l. Guard (Red Arrow Division), I can almost guarantee that some of the former unit members will give him the “shaft” once they see this.

    • rgr769 says:

      Nice catch. What a maroon. One can’t even tell that is a stuffed animal in the pic. Being the fabulist he is, he even comes up with the heartwarming story of “Bongo” to go with the sad tale of the naming of “Patricia Ann.” All done just to give a patina of authenticity to his lies.

    • Ex-PH2 says:

      Looks like a fist to me, not a stuffed toy.

    • Anonymous says:

      Looks like a natural leather glove, not a stuffed toy, there. (So much for the stuffed gopher from Caddyshack… )

    • Morgan Blake says:

      I believe he purposely fudged up those photos and made them scratchy and hard to view.

  24. AO2(NAC) says:

    I was born and raised in the zone, specifically the AO he refers to: Ft Gulick and Ft Sherman, in the early mid 80’s he cites as when he was there.
    I can assure you there was no high speed shit going on. We surfed at Ft Sherman daily. Ft Gulick was where 3/7th SF was and they were certainly operating in El Sal and central America which was going on, but Panama was quiet AF.

  25. HMCS(FMF) ret says:

    DAVID R. ZIEGEL ain’t real deal unless he knows Jimmy “LEFT NUT LOW” Walls…

  26. JTB says:


  27. Mustang Major says:

    David Ziegel proves that you don’t have to be smart to be dumb.

    Could have been worse- he didn’t use WW II photos.

  28. Keepin' It Real says:

    David Ziegel dreamed of serving… it was just a lot later in life and it was only a dream.

  29. Green Thumb says:

    I want to hang out with TJ Fank.

  30. 3/10/MED/b says:

    I just hopped over to the Military Phonies site, and saw the picture/graphic/caricature/or however any one wants to address it. Just when I thought it can’t get any worse. As I wait for posers claiming to have served with the Mountain, I await those who wore the 1st Calvary patch to get busy with this POS.

  31. J.R. Johnson says:

    I seem to recall some National Guard pilots talking about Black and Hot. They were just talking about gunnery at night with the lights off. Hot not referring to real action like VN or OIF/OEF but armed, as in keep your fingers off the “hot” trigger until we get over the range or I’m going to have a lot of extra paperwork to fill out!

    • PTBH says:

      That was actually my guess – going in with live ammo and armed to the teeth, along with it either being a nighttime operation or in stealth mode.

  32. Morgan Blake says:

    Ziegel “Mamba LRRP” Counter-Narcotics soldier is a lie.

    Bongo is a lie.

    The cake is a lie.

  33. Mick says:

    Uh oh. Some phony claims appear to be missing here. Maybe I can be of some assistance:

    – No phony ‘sniper’ claims, along with a corresponding world-record number of ‘confirmed kills’?

    – No phony claims that he was held as a POW in a ‘Tiger Cage’ with rats crawling on his head by drug-running insurgents in Central America, until one day he killed all of his captors (and a fellow POW whose screams of “don’t leave me behind” were putting our hero’s escape plans at risk) with his bare hands, and then walked barefoot and alone for 17 days through the jungle until he reached friendly forces?

    – No phony claims of being the sole survivor of a ‘Black Ops’ mission where his best friend died in his arms, and the records of the mission are now sealed forever by POTUS and stored in a vault beneath Fort Knox?

    — sigh —


  34. A Proud Infidel®™ says:

    David R. Ziegel never even served in the Military according to records found.
    David R. Ziegel claims everything BUT macho Grande.
    David R. Ziegel talks like some dysfunctional junior high school Janitor wanting to intimidate kids.
    David R. Ziegel looks like he blows winos behind bus stops for spare change.
    David R. Ziegel looks like he cruises highway rest areas in a windowless van in search of a date.
    David R. Ziegel is a reject Apprentice Towel Boy at Brucie’s Bath House (Entrance in Rear).
    David R. Ziegel couldn’t even get laid in a Women’s Prison with a $100 bill and an ounce of coke taped to his forehead.
    David R. Ziegel is more fucked up than a spotted Zebra crossbred with a striped Giraffe.
    David R. Ziegel is more ate up than a shit soup sandwich in downtown Mogadishu.
    David R. Ziegel’s lies stink worse than fresh puppy shit.
    David R. Ziegel probably can’t even sweep a floor without setting a fire alarm off.
    David R. Ziegel will now discover that you shouldn’t lie about Military Service while David R. Ziegel realizes that THE INTERNET IS FOREVER.


  35. Ex-PH2 says:

    And Capitaine Zero here hasn’t shown up protesting he innocence, has he?

    I know it’s hard to be a secret squirrel. Must be even harder when you’re found out!

  36. 26Limabeans says:

    Just because he didn’t say he flew with Jan Spann doesn’t mean he didn’t.
    I would like to see him show up here and deny it.

  37. M1Hound says:

    What a fool. We could just take a look at his Cav cap. A cav officer would ALWAYS have his rank on his hat, period. That did it for me. Then those Vietnam photos, WTF? He must think we are all as stupid as he is. To have been in ‘Nam he would have been maybe 8 or 10 years old.

    • Ex-PH2 says:

      He claims that was all Panama stuff… because one jungle just looks like all the other jungles, don’tcha know.

  38. Claw says:

    A small tidbit of good news. If you enter Fucktard David R. Ziegel’s name into any search engine, both TAH and MP show up as # 1 & 2 on the Hit Parade.

    But on to other things. After doing a bit of research, it has become evident that the closest David R. Ziegel ever came to going into any military service was when, on the 20th of March 1974, his birthday was pulled for the nationwide Draft Lottery and he would have gotten #XXX, which based on the numbers previously called, he may have actually been called for service.But as fate would have it, the actual authority to issue an induction notice had expired with the end of FY74 on 30 Jun 73.

    But I am confident that if David R. Ziegel had actually shown up at a Reception Station, we would have him listed as the #1 TAH Bedwetter with the least amount of service before being kicked to the curb, instead of Ron Etzig with his “16 Days of Service to this Nation.”/smile