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That photo’s been around for awhile…but it’s damn accurate illustration of our society today.
CI
Where I live when the colors pass by during the Memorial Day Parade or any parade for that matter pretty much everybody stands. Small town America…
There’s probably a joke in there about the Bank of America in the background.
Same here in Fairfax, during Memorial Day, Veteran’s Day, and the 4th… The cheers this year were the loudest I have EVER seen when the VFW, Legion, Wounded Warrior Regiment, and the Colors marched past. I hate to admit it, but I was bawling my eyes out.
Vet or not, he is the only patriot in this bunch of blood sucking idiots.
I’ve been involved in youth sports since leaving the service in 1983, I volunteered in 1994 to chaperone one of my boys teams on a Washington DC trip. At the tomb of the unknown, without me asking, every kid in my program removed their hat and stood silently watching until one of them asked me loudly how come the other “men” standing there kept their hats on… the embarrassed adults immediately removed their hats.
The Barnes Air Guard Base is in our town, and we too take pride in saluting and honoring those who serve at the base and all across the world on our behalf, you won’t find folks sitting with their caps on when the honor guard passes by. You will find people clapping and cheering for the members of the military as they pass by on Memorial Day or the 4th of July in a very public display of affection for our service members. Makes me proud to live here, and I know my community is far from unique.
I also know a bunch of lazy slobs sitting around talking during the national anthem, leaving their caps on and being generally disrespectful is nothing new. It just points out who the ignorant turds are for the rest of us. Since we can’t make them wear signs at least this identifies them.
When the colors pass, practically everyone stands in my area. I’ve actually seen kids as young as 3 stop what they are doing and stand quietly. However, I have also witnessed asses at sporting events not stop what they were doing for the National Anthem or remove their hats. I agree with VOV, it identifies the idiots.
I was at a roller derby (don’t ask) at the DC Armory last year, and while everyone stood quietly with their hands on their hearts during the national anthem, one Ballduster McSoulpatch, Mr. Rogers sweater-wearing motherfucker actually started to boo loudly.
I started toward him, and Rob literally had to hold me back. I WOULD have been charged with assault!
I was at a ball game a couple of years ago in which a civilian saluted during the National Anthem. He is a Vet. I was at attention with hand over heart. Afterwards, I asked him about the salute and while I can’t recall his exact reply, he essentially said saluting was authorized. I let it go at that but have not adopted the salute. Any thoughts?
@9
It is now authorized for veterans to salute, I just can’t quite bring myself to do it…I still just place my hand over my heart.
I have no idea if a salute is authorized or not, but, any show of respect is warranted. A veteran rendering a salute is quite ok in my book, they have earned the right.
Thanks for the responses.
@9- At least he is showing his respect, altnough according to the US Flag Code:
§171. Conduct during playing
During rendition of the national anthem when the flag is displayed, all present except those in uniform should stand at attention facing the flag with the right hand over the heart. Men not in uniform should remove their headdress with their right hand and hold it at the left shoulder, the hand being over the heart. Persons in uniform should render the military salute at the first note of the anthem and retain this position until the last note. When the flag is not displayed, those present should face toward the music and act in the same manner they would if the flag were displayed there.
http://usmilitary.about.com/od/theorderlyroom/a/salutechange.htm
…but for now, I just do the hand-on-heart thing in civvies.
Well I stand corrected. I had a company commander two years ago who was very hard up on the US Flag Code, and made all of us read it and take a test on it. I wonder why, 4 years after this gets passed I am only just now hearing about it, means I have been teaching my Marines incorrectly.
I did not know about the change in the law, it’s been hand over the heart for me and I sing as well, much to the chagrin of those around me. Although lately I am not alone in singing as much as I used to be…not sure if they are trying to drown me out, or join in. I prefer to think the latter!
I thought that if you are still in and in civilian clothes that you stand at the position of attention. That’s what I do.
@1.
I hear you. Next time you go to a ball game (college or pro) count the number of folks who do not remove their hats our cover their hearts during the anthem.
Then take notice of the ones carring on conversations with each other or their cellhones, etc.
No respect.
Dealt with this when I used to go to Angels games back in CA. Asked one guy who was mutual friend of my ex about it afterwards and he claimed he was a Native American (he was pasty white) and was insulting to his “heritage.”
Was about all I could do not to knock the fat fuck on his ass. Needless to say he wasn’t a mutual or any other kind of friend after that.
The law was changed in the 2009 Defense Authorization Act. Legal authority is 4 USC 9 and 36 USC 301(b)(1)(B), which now prescribes that military personnel and veterans may render elect to render an appropriate salute in civilian clothing when the flag passes and/or during the playing of the National Anthem, respectively.
Personally, I too opt to cover my heart with my hand vice salute these days – as I did previously when not in uniform. Old habits die hard.
@16. A number of years ago, while my son was in Little League, the National Anthem would be played prior to each game. No one but a few fans sang. We remedied that. At the next practice, each player received a copy of the Star-Spangled Banner and a brief history lesson. At the conclusion of each practice that week, this was repeated. When the next game came, all players and coaches sang the Anthem and, with them, dozens of moms and dads in the stands. Some coaches and parents later asked for copies and, to this day, I hear, the folks at that particular field are still singing our National Anthem.
I do salute when not in uniform, and have been since the law was passed. I feel it’s more appropriate.
SandBag0369: I don’t think they were playing the national anthem when that photo was taken. 4 USC 9 prescribes rendering honors (e.g., saluting or covering the heart with one’s hand and/or hat) while the flag is passing. I was always taught that meant honors (hand-salute or covering the heart) were rendered “from 6 steps before to 6 steps after” the flag had passed my position.
The flag in that photo seems to be considerably farther from passing in front of the gentleman in question than 6 steps.
Depending upon the circumstances (and how well my memory is working) I will either salute or simply cover the heart. It’s difficult to change old habits, but in a way that cuts both ways. Spent so many years doing the salute that it feels unnatural to NOT do it.
It is great to have the option of a full-blown salute, especially at significant parades and such.
(Sorry my computer keeps saving my name as SandBag.)
Hondo: Yeah, I was responding to AC’s post. Even though it wasn’t 6 and 6, he is definitely the only one doing the right and honorable thing.
19 – Sparky, you should have asked if he knew what percentage of enrolled members of his “tribe” voluntarily joined the military. Members of native American tribes(i.e. they claim membership and the tribe claims them) enlisting in the military was significantly higher than for the population as a whole last I checked. Go to any reservation or area with large Native American presence (i.e. Oklahoma) and you will see a large number of non-pasty white veterans who are proud of their service and their country.
@21 sweet, that’s my experience if you tell these kids, they get it and understand.
@19 maybe he was from Elizabeth Warren’s tribe of pasty white Irish Indians?
I still stand at attention as was proscribed (USMC former here….a while ago). Even if “authorized” now, I don’t hink I can bring myself to salute accordingly.
I find it appalling that most Americans don’t sing the National Anthem. At international events, like the Olympics, you see and hear the crowd AND the athletes from other countries all singing their anthem. It’s especially noticeable at events like the NFL game played in London where they play both anthems. The entire crowd sings God Save the Queen while the Star Spangled Banner is just some celebrity performance.
I also hate when the crowd starts cheering before it’s over, very disrespectful.
standing outta a wheelchair,eh?
..probably scamming VA benefits.
😉
crucible,
Both methods are acceptable, I still can’t bring myself to salute either…
I have taken to saluting if wearing a cover. Otherwise, I’ll place my hand over my heart.
I do, though, always stand up and have taught my kids to do so. And even though I live in a small town, we still have a bunch of ignorant fucks who can’t bother to put down their cold drinks and get their fat greasey asses outta their lawn chairs for even 30 seconds while the color guard passes.
@30 Not necessarily; he could have a heart condition.
Once a Veteran always a Veteran!
I have a hard time going to ball games any more because I ALWAYS find the asshole who doesn’t give honors to the nation anthem is playing…and I don’t conduct myself in a proper manner.
I always salute, old habits are hard to break.
Indoors, no cover on, my hand goes over my heart. Outdoors, cover on, hand salute. I’ve had a few interlopers quiz me and be very mouthy doing it. I tend to point to the cross pistols, US Army logo and watch them turn red when they get it. Pretty fast actually…
Even Robin Williams gets it:
@22 My wife and I always salute. In or out of uniform, that is our right as vets and active duty. You’ll see most of the younger kids saluting in civvies too. The new law is widely known by the younger generation.
Yes, he’s a vet. The wheelchair just means his arthritis is bothering him, or he might have had a mild stroke.
Who among us would not stand for the colors?
I always have to consciously decide, hand over the heart or salute. It’s still weird for me. I think salute is edging out when I’m wearing some form of attire identifying me as part of a veteran group (even if it’s only a t-shirt or cap) but hand over heart the rest of the time. I know I /can/, but it doesn’t say I /have/ to…hand over the heart still an option.
@40- agreed
As a former AD Marine, I’m torn.
I don’t feel comfortable saluting with out something covering my head, but it seems silly to salute on the rare occasions that I’m actually wearing a hat of any kind.