Paul campaign refused to cooperate with Army’s investigation of Thorsen

| May 3, 2012

Sporkmaster sent us links to the Associated Press story that the Ron Paul campaign refused to cooperate with Army’s investigation of Jesse Thorsen who appeared at a Ron Paul campaign in his ACUs to endorse the candidate;

Documents obtained by the AP indicate that the investigation was hindered by the Paul camp’s refusal to participate with the Army. According to information in the AP story, the military investigator made “numerous calls,” left many “messages and voice mails” all of which went unanswered by Paul representatives in Iowa.

The investigator from Thorsen’s unit, the Dubuque, Iowa-based 389th Combat Engineer Battalion, Bradley Borgos, writes in a memo included in the cache of documents obtained by the AP: “Multiple attempts were made to contact the Ron Paul campaign. Further time was requested to seek out a response. Despite multiple attempts, no one from the campaign responded to my inquiries.”

Another AP report in the Washington Post hints that this wasn’t the only incident that provoked his commander to punish Thorsen;

The documents show Borgos recommended Thorsen be reprimanded, and that his commanders bar him from re-enlisting when his contract expires because of the violation and criminal history. Battalion Commander Lt. Col. Matthew Baker agreed to the reprimand but rejected further discipline.

So, I’m guessing that Ron Paul only supports some of the troops, because the investigator is certainly one of the troops and executing his official duties. The Paul campaign says they’re “looking into” the situation. Yeah, no abated breath here.

Category: Ron Paul

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Hondo

I wonder if the Paul campaign was reluctant to cooperate because they had encouraged or solicited Thorsen to make the endorsement in uniform?

Just wondering hypothetically, of course.

trent

What an ethical campaign Mr. Paul has going for him there. But I’m guessing after this denial by his campaign staff, there will be counter-accusations and then, instead of coming clean…nothing.

Paul Bot

Really, The guy who killed a shitpile of people at Ft Hood, Texas is eating three squares a day between visits from his lawyer…..and the Army wants to go after a guy who takes his Individual Freedom and Personal Liberty serious….give me a break, enough of the PC crap!

Dave Thul

Congressman Paul is a former military man, and has been running for office almost continuously since Jimmy Carter was elected, so there is no possible way he didn’t know what he did was wrong.

I want to see Paul reprimanded at least as harshly as the dumb corporal.

Hondo

Paul Bot: just when did you say you ever served in uniform, exactly?

Overt political activity – like endorsing or speaking publicly on behalf of a candidate – while in uniform has been unlawful under the UCMJ and it’s predecessors for literally decades. See the current DoDD 1344.10 and it’s predecessor documents. The prohibition has been in place since at least 1990, and likely much longer (the oldest version I’ve been able to find of DoDD 1344.10 is from 1990).

Since it’s a DoD Directive, that means the prohibition also applies to members of the Army Reserve 24/7/365 – whether or not they are currently serving on active duty. Thorsen is a member of the USAR. Violations are punishable as violations of Article 92 of the UCMJ (Failure to Obey Order or Regulation). He’s lucky his command let him off with a reprimand.

Much the same is true regarding Federal civilian employees. They’re not allowed to endorse political candidates in any official capacity or to engage in overt political activities while on duty, either. The Hatch Act has banned this since 1939.

You really should make an effort to know what you’re talking about before commenting on a subject.

Dave Thul

Actually Hondo, the DOD directive specifies the reserve soldiers can do stuff while not in uniform. We can even be on active duty for up to 269 days before the bulk of the restrictions kick in.

Anyway you look at it, wearing the uniform at a political event is so boneheaded wrong that I have to assume the Paul campaign was in on the stunt.

Claymore

Isn’t this about the time some Ronulan dipshit shows up to tell us all to go read a book?

SIGO

Bar to re-enlistments also have to be approved by the BDE Commander too.

Yat Yas 1833

@3 Paul Bot. Obviously you’ve had a ‘paulbotomy’, I served in the ’70s and we couldn’t speak to the media without contacting a “PAO” first. We sure as hell couldn’t speak to anyone, media wise, while in uniform! If Rupaul…I mean ron paul had served in the military or Marine Corps, instead of as a twat doc in the air farce, he would know these things. Please admit to yourself, your boy is a nut job.

Hondo

Dave Thul: You are correct in that there are essentially two things that someone in the Reserve Components (RC) can do that someone serving in the Active Component (AC) cannot. These two things are (1) run for office (or lobby for a partisan political appointment) while not serving on active duty, and (2) run for office or seek partisan appointment (or continue to serve in an elective or appointive civil office) when serving on a TTAD of <270 days, provided they can do so without interfering with the performance of their military duties. These specific differences are found in para 4.2 through 4.5 of DoDD 1344.10.

However, these additional permissions affect at best a relative handful of RC personnel (the vast majority of RC personnel are neither elected officials or partisan political appointees). The remaining restrictions imposed by DoDD 1344.10 – which boil down to “do nothing that would lend the appearance of an official DoD endorsement of a political party or position” – found in DoD 1344.10 are equally applicable to both AC and RC personnel. Neither AC nor RC personnel can show up, in uniform, at a partisan political rally and participate, distribute campaign literature in uniform, or otherwise use their military affiliation to further a political party or partisan political candidate.

Hondo

Addendum: looks like I made one major omission above.

RC personnel not serving on active duty may also actively participate in political campaigns, provided they do not do so in uniform and do not in any way imply official DoD endorsement of their party or candidate. This authority is granted by para 4.1.4 of DoDD 1344.10. It terminates when the RC individual enters active duty.

OWB

Yat? I know y’all really enjoy ragging on the Air Force, but seriously – ronpaul brought his ignorance to the Air Force. He didn’t learn it there. As good as the Air Force is at teaching folks to fly right, it doesn’t always take. 😉

Dave Thul

Hondo-
I think we are on the same page. Never ever anything to do with politics in uniform.

I only know the subject well because I was involved in politics when I got called up for a 180 day order-that didn’t affect me, it was the same as being a weekend joe. But when my orders were extended 365, I was on long term active duty orders and all the rules kicked in, so I had to resign as congressional district chair, and I have to keep a low profile on everything else.

None of which changes the fact that Thorsen was wrong seven ways to Sunday.