Bye-bye, Freedom Works
While it’s wrong that Stein will probably be discharged for his indiscretions against the current President, it’s also wrong that Freedom Works, Dick Armey’s group of activists with whom I’ve worked in the past have begun dabbling in the issue. Dick Armey even flirted with my wife one night and I let that pass. But this is outside their area of expertise.
This is not a first Amendment Issue, it’s an Article II, Section 2, issue. Obama is the commander-in-chief of the military and his subordinates aren’t allowed to decide which orders they will and will not obey. There are several layers of command structure above the sergeant who will protect him from having to execute illegal orders, so there is no need for him to pronounce his intentions publicly. The American public expect us to ignore illegal orders without making a federal case of it.
I remember General John Singlaub, arguably one of the greatest of his generation of soldiers, criticized Jimmy Carter’s ruminations about withdrawing US troops from Korea and was shit canned immediately. That’s just the way it goes with soldiers.
Like I said, Freedom Works is engaging targets outside of their lane and using a member of the military as a tool with which to fight a political battle in an election year, and the troops should not have been involved in the first place, and Freedom Works is compounding that error by waving Stein’s bloody shirt, so this terminates any relationship I had with Freedom Works.
Besides, I think Stein is one of those Oathkeeper/Ron Paul f*cks anyway.
Category: Oath Keepers, Ron Paul, Shitbags
Him being discharged seems a bit much, but I’m not surprised and being that he is the first to have this happen he is the example. That’s normally what it takes to get everybody else to straighten back up.
In the 60’s, and maybe later, could not go on an Army post in a vehicle that had campaign stickers of either kind. We understood why.
I had a similar reaction when I read that headline the other day….my head exploded…
I have said it here and on other sites; what Stein did is wrong, according to the UCMJ, and he will be held to account for it, as anyone should. The rules are the rules and he knew those rules. That he ignored the rules is what got his dick stepped on.
Absolutely concur, Jonn.
Maybe he should go join one of the “Occupy” groups. See how far that gets him.
Gotta agree with Jonn. There are too many layers between a Sgt and the C-i-C to allow an illegal order to make it that low. The young Sgt stepped on his dick on this one. Hell, I remember the brass telling us we couldn’t play Johnny Paycheck’s “Take This Job and Shove It” for goodness sakes!?
“Obama is the commander-in-chief of the military and his subordinates aren’t allowed to decide which orders they will and will not obey.”
Hate to play devil’s advocate here, but what ever happened to following “lawful” orders. Do we not have a duty to stand up to “unlawful” orders?
Just saying…
Yeah, Joshua, I explained that in the post. If you don’t have any confidence in your leadership to keep those illegal orders from reaching you, I can see how you might be wrapped around the ethics of orders. However, I think that the officers above Stein know what’s legal and illegal.
I agree that he knew the rules. I think we can all agree that we all, ok maybe just me, have said some disparaging things of our leaders while in uniform. But we/I knew my audience and knew that we/I could speak without harming our/my career.
Stein didn’t take that into consideration. And he’s paying for it.
I agree with the quote that one did not lay aside being a citizen, but there is a way to do this and a way not to do this.
Even as a DA Civilian I have to follow these same rules. It is not hard to excercise your rights while in the uniformed services and do it appropriately.
When I was an officer and assigned to conscientious objector (CO)cases the litmus test was always if they were willing to complete thier obligations in non combat roles such as medic duty in a hospital or some tech assignment. In most cases they just wanted out of service and were looking for a way to end it now. A true CO would understand thier obligation and wish to finish it. Same deal here. This dude should have sought a path to get off duty rather then a public scene that will result in the same deal but grander effect.
it’s all for the publicity.
Absolutely steadfast, I was in no way shape or form condoning this Marine’s actions.
If he truely wanted to discuss his philosophies he should have done so responsibly. The UCMJ is pretty clear on how you can.
Yes UCMJ is clear but what is not usually understood that the military is not to be used a political pawn. Even though the Pentagon is political in nature it is not part of the government process of politics.
Sadly while the media, the Executive, and Legislative branches don’t understand this and it falls on the military to maintain that professional distance.
Why would it be wrong to bust him out? He did the initial stupidity and was told to stop. He chose to disregard that order and continue to disrespect the president. Now, Obama is a scummy little windbag, but anyone who has ever been in the military, and Marines in particular, know you cannot just run your suck in high with your mind in neutral about him while you are in his employ. He is guilty and should be courtmartialled. Not just kicked out.
I’m with #14 on this one.
While we all are playing shithouse lawyer here and most of us are agreeing I want to point out a fundamental part that is important to currently serving members. More importantly for the non-military who have never served that will read this blog and our comments. First understand I am not a Lawyer. I was an officer in the Army. But we need to understand the difference is that we don’t actually work for the President. I get the reference but the military does not swear to the President. As you know we do so to the Constitution and these butt rangers like to use this as a shield. Where the dumbasses forget though, and as Jonn pointed out (or some one and I am too lazy to scroll up to find it) that there is a whole lot of chain of command. So the the unlawful order (or even lawful ones) are to be considered is for your chain right next to you, ala My Lai Masscre. when you get to the Presidential level you are questioning a whole lot of people in between. GOs will do the vetting and having seen that part of military life there is some high level dumbshit GOs protect from. Still there is a fine line between stupid orders and illegal ones. It is not illegal to give stupid orders. Ok so my point…the military doesn’t work for the president and you can say whatever you want about the President. What you can’t do…is do it in uniform, while on duty or use your rank/position in order to validate your opinion or support another party. Feel free to go about and frollick about but do it in civiies, off duty (or on leave ideally) but don’t say you are “SFC High Speed and you support this message” you can set up a blog even…just don’t waste military time, assets, or again…use your rank and position. I am agreeing with most here….I just felt it important to point out that there are some that read that don’t quite understand the delicate nature the military… Read more »
I’m not sure the oathkeeper crew is that bad (but I haven’t done a lot of looking, admittedly). But when you’re on active duty, you STFU. Shoot, we all know that.
Greatest name ever….dick…armey..
Gotta be a mr cock platoon out there somewhere …
Gentlemen .. The Constitution. Honour your oath to it!