Student shooter’s parents charged with involuntary manslaughter
Ethan Crumbley is alleged to have killed four at a high school and injured seven others with a gun. (Oakland County Sheriff’s Office)
Ethan Crumbley is suspected of killing four students at a Michigan high school. His parents are being charged with involuntary manslaughter. One of the arguments advanced for providing these charges is that the firearm used in the shooting was “freely available”. The parents are being charged with four counts of involuntary manslaughter.
From Fox News:
“The parents were the only individuals in the position to know the access to weapons,” Oakland County prosecutor Karen McDonald said Thursday. The gun “seems to have been just freely available to that individual.”
“All I can say at this point is those actions on mom and dad’s behalf go far beyond negligence,” McDonald also told WJR-AM. “We obviously are prosecuting the shooter to the fullest extent. … There are other individuals who should be held accountable.”
Meanwhile, Ethan Crumbley is facing one count of terrorism causing death, four counts of first-degree murder, seven counts of assault with intent to murder, and 12 counts of possession of a firearm in the commission of a felony.
The teen recorded videos the night before the shooting in which he “talked about shooting and killing students the next day at Oxford High School,” Oakland County Sheriff’s Office Lt. Tim Willis said Wednesday.
The sophomore’s behavior was concerning enough that school officials called Crumbley’s parents to the school for a meeting on Tuesday just a few hours before the shooting, but Superintendent of Oxford Community Schools Tim Throne said that discipline wasn’t warranted.
Crumbley met with school officials on Monday as well due to behavioral issues in the classroom, Oakland County Sheriff Michael Bouchard said.
Fox News has the rest of the story here.
Category: Crime
Shannon Watts and her QRF must’ve seen the videos the night before, because just hours after Crumbley’s attack she and her Moms Demand Action minions began fundraising, as they danced in the blood of the victims.
SOP with those people. They (Moms Demand Hot Action/Everytown, etc) got the kid gloves at the CT capitol during the ‘debate’ on the illegal emergency certification of bill PA 13-3 on/about 04APR13. Process is no lobbying is allowed in the state house… but those idiots had free range, went behind the doors to specifically address the Dem Cabal.
I guess it all worked out, Malloy’s re-election got gobs of dough from Giffords’ PAC. Birds of a feather [crap all over the Constitution] together.
“The gun “seems to have been just freely available to that individual.”” -A Karen (YCMTSU)
Lemme channel my inner KoB: “Can someone loan me a string of pearls to clutch?”
Hide yo [keys], hide yo [guns], hide yo [kitchen knives]. Over-zealous persecutioners are overchargin’ everybody up in here!
Democrats call for banning AR-15s and Black Friday gun sales…
So if a Political party, (Damn it crats) allow a criminal illegal alien into the country and they kill someone we should charge said party with manslaughter as well.
Or, like certain prosecutor in Waukesha, let a maniac who ran over his baby mama out on $1000 bail and gave him his keys back…
Good. They should be charged. Dad clearly did not have the weapon and its ammo secured. People with untrustworthy minors in the home should have their firearms and ammo secured. Also, convicted felons found in possession of firearms should be sent to prison. But what should happen frequently doesn’t.
^Word^ Plenty of blame to go around here. Including the school system. However, at the end of the day, the kid pulled the trigger and the failure of the parents to give proper home training goes way back. Sometimes the adult is supposed to be the adult.
Sympathies to the families of all of the innocent victims.
Educators, as usual, don’t care about kids, only that the little rotters are “orderly” so that lunch and after-school plans don’t get interrupted.
I’m not seeing how the kid’s acts are terrorism.
MI Terrorism Statute
“Act of terrorism” means a willful and deliberate act that is all of the following:
(i) An act that would be a violent felony under the laws of this state, whether or not committed in this state.
(ii) An act that the person knows or has reason to know is dangerous to human life.
(iii) An act that is intended to intimidate or coerce a civilian population or influence or affect the conduct of government or a unit of government through intimidation or coercion.
The rest of the kid’s charges are solid. He should be put down, but Michigan is a no death penalty state. He’ll be a guest of the state’s until he dies of natural causes.
As for charging the parents? That seems highly politically motivated to me. I’ll await the charges and the probable cause statement or indictment, but I’m thinking this is overreach.
I questioned the terrorism charge too. In my non-legally trained mind, terrorism is a tactic, not exactly an action. YMMV. Also agree with you on overreach. The parents ARE responsible for the safe storage of the gun, but involuntary manslaughter seems like a stretch. Again I’m no lawer.
They likely won’t get offered a plea, but I bet when this goes to trial it’ll be more a conviction on improper/insecure storage of a firearm.
https://www.fox2detroit.com/news/ethan-dont-do-it-parents-of-oxford-high-school-suspect-sent-messages-during-shooting
I’ve looked into this more. The video lays it all out. I now think the prosecutor is doing a good charge here. I think the dad’s gonna pay for this while the mom might skate.
Lots of warning signs here about this kid that they were willfully ignoring (and even perhaps encouraging with that “LOL” comment).
I feel really bad for that teacher that saw the kid’s cry for help that morning.
Yeahhhh after reading that, I wish to retract my last statement, your honor. Daddy’s in a world of hurt. Once again, the signs were there.
Overcharging to ensure getting some convictions.
The Christmas parade murders were terrorism but happened so long ago the news forgot about it.
And he’s also a Leftist-favored minority, so no “terrorism” and lots of “unknown motive” like w/ jihadists…
Was that the one “caused by an SUV?”
OK open debate here.
1. My kids are trained and being trained on the proper use, storage, handling of firearms. It’s been a year and and I’d say we started with a little 22LR Henry AR-7 survival rifle and have moved up to an AR-15 and (full 😀 ) Semi-Auto 12 gauge shotgun, and a variety of 9mm and 45 ACP firearms in the armory.
Part of that training is not only the proper handling, storage, mechanics, cleaning etc but RESPECT for what a firearm is and how it’s supposed to be treated.
My kids know better than Alec Baldwin, who, how, where, why, what for, firearms exist.
NOW that being said, they’re in a safe. They’re not just sitting around for anyone to pick up.
My kids also know that they’re not to touch them without my say so and they know it’s under penalty of death, not that I’d shoot them with said firearm, but probably pull off an appendage from their own body and beat them soundly with it. (OK, you know I’m kidding but I have to SAY I’m kidding, just in case) but the fear and respect of God has been put into them about weapons. Training classes, range visits, repetition and review. ALSO discussion about LIFE, nothing is permanent but death. No do overs, no respawning etc. It’s also about psychology as much as mental health. Those are very important as well so yeah, it’s the whole ball of way here.
If the parents were as engaged with their child as many unfortunately, are NOT, then this is not as much of a surprise. NOW, as to the charges against them, I certainly believe they hold *some* level of accountability here but what level outside parental and ownership of a weapon, we’ll have to see what the courts and such bring to bear.
Also, for the pearl clutchers and debaters, I also have an axe and a machete and lots of knives at home too. Anything can be a weapon. So maybe put down that box of pencils, OK buddy??
https://www.quora.com/Can-you-kill-someone-with-a-pencil-like-it-is-portrayed-in-John-Wick
“A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep* and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.”
*this asterisk doesn’t exist
Proper parenting solves a lot of these problems.
I knew where Dad’s guns were. Dad demystified them for us from an early age. And was not afraid to use a belt, paddle, switch, et al on our tails. Or to hug us.
Ask long-time school teachers – parents as a rule do not parent now, and the kids without parenting are legion.
GB,
My kids know they can be Legion too….if they fuck up, they’re going to be getting shipped to the French Foreign Legion. 😀 😀
One Way.
Better learn “Lâche la bombe enculé” pretty quick, like
Not all school $hooters stay locked up or in the news?
The adult child Timothy Simpkins was bullied, that’s an affirmative defense now!
What don’t you understand here, Sapper?
Someone made him feel bad, so he just had to get froggy…
The parents appear to be on the lamb.
https://www.newsmax.com/us/guns/2021/12/03/id/1047272/
Lovely…
“Their attorney had assured us that if a decision was made to charge them, she would produce them for arrest,” Oakland County Undersheriff Mike McCabe.
Yeah, apparently that ain’t happening…
A fugitive team is now reportedly hunting for the parents after they did not surrender at 2pm, as they were scheduled to. They were also set to be arraigned at 4pm.
Sheriff Michael Bouchard said: “If they think they’re gonna get away, they’re not.”
Fucking DIRTBALLS….
Greasy fuckbuckets.
I hope they don’t get any bail and maybe they get welcomed with open arms into the jailhouse brother and sisterhood….with open cheeks.
https://www.the-sun.com/news/4200954/fugitive-team-ethan-crumbley-jennifer-james/
I wouldn’t turn myself in either. No habeo law-o:
“Involuntary manslaughter is the killing of another without malice and unintentionally, but in doing some unlawful act not amounting to a felony nor naturally tending to cause death or great bodily harm, or in negligently doing some act lawful in itself, or by the negligent omission to perform a legal duty.” People v Ryczek
“…Unlike murder, involuntary manslaughter contemplates an unintended result…” – https://www.michbar.org/file/opinions/appeals/2005/031005/26548.pdf
Simply in Michigan law, for there to be a charge there must be an action that causes a death that is not immediately foreseeable as casing death.
If the lawer (sic) was worth a shit they’d petition for a writ (or some other legal sounding bs)
Based on the reasons given by the prosecutor this seems like thin case so far.
The parents acted irresponsible. They had pretty substantial reason to believe their kid was a threat and dismissed and downplayed the concerns. And allowed him access to a firearm and ammunition.
When the reports of an shooter at the school surface they both responded with the assumption it was their child…strong evidence they knew he was a risk.
There has been dozens of cases of high school age children killing classmates with their parent’s firearms. Charging the parents seems to be pretty rare.
Usually parents are only charged when it is a very young child who took the firearm.
I just hope the parents’ decision not to allow their child to be questioned by police did not factor into the charging decision. The parent’s had that right. And the kid has the right to remain silent. And exercising those rights should not be weighed in charging considerations.
Two days in a row we’re in agreement?!
I don’t know about you but I could use a drink. Cheers to you, Mr T.
This right here…
“Willis said the gun was stored unlocked in the parents’ bedroom ”
I hope this is what they’re basing the charges on. Well that and the actions before/during and after…
“Oh Commissar, don’t shoot up the school…OMG Commissar, WTF, is that you shooting up the skool?LOL !! Oh man, Commissar, why’d you go and take my unlocked gun and ammo we just bought the other day?? You shouldn’t get caught doing that??? BOIIEEEYYYYYYY HA!
Also, apparently, the school wanted the son removed from the campus that morning and the parents refused.
He was on campus with the gun when the school made the request, though neither the parents nor the school was aware he was armed at the time of the request.
And after staff “being concerned” that the kid was looking up ammo on his phone and reporting said “concern” to the admin, the pri,nciple didn’t think enough of the threat to have the SRO in the office, when they interviewed the kid and his parents. They could have looked up little shitbird’s social media, for starters, before he was summoned to the office.
Seems that a couple of opportunities were missed to head this whole thing off.
They didn’t want to involve the police. That might result in this poor little psychopath being arrested! *clutches pearls* He might end up on the school to prison pipeline!
I hope the principal can rest easy knowing he did the woke thing instead of actually being concerned about his students’ safety.
Video taken by student sheltering in place in classroom with only a locked door between them and the shooter.
Someone is on the other side of the door claiming to be with the sheriff’s department, and telling the kids they can come out now.
The kids decide not to trust him and escape out the back.
(Turned out it actually was a sheriff department detective…but smart thinking by the kids anyway.)
https://www.reddit.com/r/nextfuckinglevel/comments/r6mfwk/students_quick_thinking_stops_school_shooter_who/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
Bro, I heard about this Bro, I mean, check my ID bro, I’m legit Bro, Bro, pretty smart thinking of the kids Bro, Bruh.
Learn not to trust authority early and learn often, get the jabs bro.
Let’s Bro Gandon.
Bro Jiden
😀 😀
😀
So much for being “hip” and trying to “relate” to the kids, maaan! (Didn’t the guy remember kids always know that’s fake?)
Kid looks off in the pic above.
Way off.
Difficult to look anything but “off,” given the circumstances.
Hypothetically, how do you respond when the police ask why you seem defensive during questioning? Defensiveness seems like a natural reaction.
Talking about the eyes, not the interrogation.
It seems the Sig pistol used in the shooting, was an early Christmas present to the kid from his parents. Since deleted fakebook photo and YouTube videos show the kid bragging about receiving it from his parents as a gift.
Yup. The Independent UK, updated an hour ago and the parents are still at large – with FBI warrants.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/crime/michigan-school-shooting-ethan-crumbley-latest-b1968386.html
And after reading the posted article, Mom might get gigged on a lesser charger-or skate/ht Mason- but Dad is so boned.
https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/oakland-county/2021/12/03/oakland-county-fugitive-team-searching-parents-jennifer-james-crumbley-oxford-high-suspect/8855814002/
The UK article states, “Police in Michigan, now officially aided by the FBI and the US Marshals Service, are on the hunt for Jennifer and James Crumbley.” with no mention of Federal charges. This is common for BOLOs within state borders as an assist to local PDs. (read: no FBI warrants)
Still wondering what evidence is offered that these parents are fleeing and what substantiates 4 charges of involuntary manslaughter. No crime, criminal flight won’t stick. ‘Poisonous fruit’ and all that.
“In regards to the case against Jennifer and James Crumbley, NBC legal analyst Danny Cevallos told the outlet: “They have a clear path to a conviction, if they have the evidence.” Sums that up. “If…”
“Other states and countries have tried numerous ways of reducing the risk of guns falling into the hands of young people, from safe storage rules to outright bans on firearms.” Implying not Michigan, which I couldn’t find a ‘storage law’ on the books, but thats a moot point. There would be no factual evidence to prove that the child had access even if there were such a law without the parents violating their own rights.
I really wish these parents the best here. Hopefully, in a perfect world, barring any stupid lawfare nonsense they’ll remain free.
That civil suit tho… that’ll make ’em wish for jail.
“They have a clear path to a conviction, if they have the evidence.”
If only the grass weren’t so dry, I’d have a green lawn.
I wouldn’t be a cuckold, were it not for Jody.
Joe Biden would be a good President, if not for that damn pandemic that got him elected in the first place.
“If wishes were horses, we’d all be eating steak.”
Thanks Roh, I appreciate the focus-pull on this one. First-read this morning said the Mom(Jennifer) had texted “Lol, I’m not mad at you. You have to learn not to get caught,” And ‘As news alerts went out about an active shooter at the school, James Crumbley “went straight to his home to look for his gun,” McDonald said. Jennifer Crumbley texted her son, “Ethan, don’t do it.” -‘James(husband) then called 911 to report that his gun was missing and that “his son could be the shooter,”
Wow… As you say and with present circumstances as they are – both parents are really up to their neck(s) in it and while the criminality of their actions/lack thereof has yet to be adjudicated, the Crumbley’s do have an entirely rocky road ahead of them. One of my top questions is – what RESPONSIBLE adult would give a fifteen year old child a SIG Sauer SP 2022 pistol?!
Last read, the Crumbleys’ were arrested at their studio, are still in jail and their arraignment is pending.
They make it sound like this has become as big as the Lindbergh baby with “now officially aided by the FBI and the US Marshals Service.”
This was still just a BOLO with some cell phone/ATM tracking. There was not some big The Fugitive-style manhunt going dog house to outhouse through Metro Detroit.
I saw the video of the Crumbleys’ arrest. Fed agents up the A.
Them Alphabeta Bois are asking to be part of the depravation of rights lawsuit.
If I was a lawer (sic) I’d be asking for them Grand Jury transcripts like a mo’fo. The timeline doesn’t add up at all and I’d be willing to bet the school was offering ‘psychological treatment’ to this kid in accordance with Section 330.1707, which not only means the school/state owns this problem, if the state was treating this kid with medication that caused this rapid decompression, especially against the parents wishes… those parents are going to have one hell of a payday on top of this gross over-charging.
I want to know the relationship between the persecutioner and the school med-passer/APRN/Doc before I look at these charges with ANYDAMNTHING approaching seriousness.
Firstly, this Karen McDonald is a fking monster in retard’s clothing:
https://www.oakgov.com/prosecutor/about/Pages/karen-mcdonald.aspx
But *IF* she puts her money where her mouth is (which, given her SJWedness, I DOUBT) McDonald will be seeking a term of incarceration not up to life without the possibility…
watch this space!
https://mcdonaldforprosecutor.com/supreme-court/
And the parents are in custody.
I’m as pro-gun as it gets, but I’m not seeing a problem with charging them. They knew this kid had more issues than National Geographic, but buy him a gun and/or leave it unsecured?
That’s borderline depraved indifference, which in many states (not sure about MI) is either voluntary manslaughter or second degree murder.
YMMV.
NHSparky.
Good heads up. Yep. ARRESTED.
[James and Jennifer Crumbley caught, arrested after vehicle is found in Detroit]
https://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/detroit/2021/12/04/james-jennifer-crumbley-oxford-school-shooting-suspect/8865574002/
Different strokes for different folks.
Ft. Worth, Texas high school shooter, Timothy Simpkins released from the Tarrant County jail the day after shooting classmates. Parents not arrested.