The tar baby at home

| September 6, 2013

So, it seems that Syria is becoming a tar baby here at home in the US for some politicians. John McCain heard from his constituents in Arizona last night who are pretty upset that he’s so hawkish on military action in Syria. Wrote CNN;

McCain has long advocated a more muscular American approach toward Syria, calling for a plan to oust President Bashar al-Assad from power. But on Thursday many people who showed up to a town hall in Phoenix said that getting more involved in the civil war would lead to unintended consequences.

“We didn’t send you to make war for us. We sent you to stop the war,” one man said to applause.

The real enemy that six presidents have refused to deal with, Iran, has become a wild card in the discussion since they will more than likely target US embassies and our presence in countless countries around the world. The Wall Street Journal reports that some threats have already been uncovered;

The U.S. has intercepted an order from Iran to militants in Iraq to attack the U.S. Embassy and other American interests in Baghdad in the event of a strike on Syria, officials said, amid an expanding array of reprisal threats across the region.

Military officials have been trying to predict the range of possible responses from Syria, Iran and their allies. U.S. officials said they are on alert for Iran’s fleet of small, fast boats in the Persian Gulf, where American warships are positioned. U.S. officials also fear Hezbollah could attack the U.S. Embassy in Beirut.

Russia has moved war ships in to the Mediterranean according to AFP;

The SSV-201 intelligence ship Priazovye, accompanied by the two landing ships Minsk and Novocherkassk passed through the Bosphorus known as the Istanbul strait that separates Asia from Europe, an AFP photographer reported.

The Priazovye on Sunday started its voyage from its home port of Sevastopol in Ukraine “to the appointed region of military service in the eastern Mediterranean”, a military official told the Interfax news agency.

Russia, a key ally of Damascus, has kept a constant presence of around four warships in the eastern Mediterranean in the Syrian crisis, rotating them every few months.

It also has a naval base in the Syrian port of Tartus whose origins date back to Moscow’s close relationship with Damascus under the Soviet Union.

Unconfirmed sources report that China is moving ships into the Mediterranean as well.

According to the Russian news outlet Telegrafist.org, the People’s Liberation Army dispatched the Jinggangshan amphibious dock landing ship and the vessel was seen passing through the Red Sea towards the Suez Canal, the waterway in Egypt that leads to the Mediterranean Sea and waters off the coast of Israel, Lebanon and Syria.

According to the report, the ship has not been sent to engage in any aggressive actions but is merely there to “observe” the actions of Russian and US warships. However, the Jinggangshan is equipped for combat and was utilized as part of a “show of force” in maneuvers aimed at defending the South China Sea earlier this year.

Putin and Obama met yesterday – their meeting lasted 15 seconds. Hardly seems enough time to resolve the myriad issues that face the two figureheads of their countries. From the Associated Press;

With tensions mounting over issues including Syria, National Security Agency leaker Edward Snowden, and human rights, Obama and Putin did not plan to hold a formal bilateral meeting on the sidelines of the G-20 gathering. A formal greeting outside St. Petersburg’s Constantine Palace was their only planned one-on-one public appearance.

Parsing the body language between Obama and Putin has become something of a geopolitical parlor game every time the two leaders meet. But there wasn’t much to work with this time: Their exchange lasted 15 seconds.

On the cost of the war, Joe Bite Me hinted yesterday that US military action would be funded by the Gulf States, which is a nice thought, except that it sort of makes our troops the mercenaries of the rich Arabs who get to outsource their war fighting. The Christian Science Monitor reports that the wording of the Senate resolution for Syria, although it forbids the use of US “boots on the ground”, it really doesn’t;

“It might appear to a casual reader to be some significant prohibitions – preventing combat forces,” says retired Lt. Gen. David Barno, the former commander of US forces in Afghanistan. “We define ‘combat’ in lots of different ways.”

Without being “combat” forces, US troops could still be brought in for peacekeeping, search and rescue, and to secure chemical weapons plants should the need arise, adds Mr. Barno, who is now a senior fellow at the Center for a New American Security, a think tank in Washington.

“Despite the fact that the ban on combat troops looks pretty severe and restrictive,” he adds, “it’s not.”

Still, no one has articulated why we need to involve ourselves in a civil war beyond the appearance of chemical weapons in the conflict. No one has told me why it’s a national security issue that requires American lives to be at risk and no one has provided any real proof that it was Assad’s forces who used chemical weapons against the Syrian rebels and not the al Qaeda manipulators who used the weapons on their own people to make it appear as if Assad had used the weapons. The Obama Administration has dismissed the importance of the findings of the UN inspection team before they’ve even concluded sifting through the research they collected on the ground in Syria.

So why the rush to war?

Category: Barack Obama/Joe Biden, Terror War

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Seadog

Because it’s the fastest way to distract the populous from the rest of his disastrous presidency.

NHSparky

Why the rush? So Obumbles can pretend to be tough with other people’s lives and show he means business about that “red line” he talked about.

Or didn’t. I’m confused on that one. I mean, he did say that he never said such a thing, but lo and behold, I’ve got video that says he did. Meh–must be a fake, right?

Combat Historian

If attacking Syria involved REAL NATIONAL SECURITY INTERESTS, then we should attack Syria regardless of the terrorist threats to our embassies and other overseas structures, and deal with those threats as they come. But in this case, we are going to war against Syria because OBAMAO’S PERSONAL EGO GOT BRUISED; that’s a different calculation, and U.S. embassies getting bombed and U.S. personnel killed overseas just because of obamao’s personal whim AIN’T WORTH IT!!!

MAJMike

THE WON’s mouth tried to cash a check HIS ass couldn’t cover. Now we, as paid mercenaries for the Gulf oil states, are to rescue HIS prestige.

Do we truly deserve the Government we get?

NHSparky

Future historians will call this, “The War of the Butthurt One.”

If he doesn’t start WWIII in the process.

Ex-PH2

On WGN this morning there was a reporter who repeated the “Bush said there were WMDs in Iraq and there weren’t any” stuff. I would like to shove her face in the video of those people he tested nerve gas on back in — oh, when was that? Before she was born?

Is short-term memory loss a convenient excuse for repeating the psychobabble coming from the White House now? Is the ‘inconvenient truth’ – that Saddam Hussein was on a roll to engulf the entire Middle East – of no consequence?

And what about that super cannon Gerald Bull was building for him? That structure was 50% completed when it was found and the video was not withhed form public viewing. Does none of that matter if these people are so mesmerized by that moron in the White House that they can’t think for themselves any more?

Am I pounding my head on a brick wall?

NHSparky

PH2–the people who put Obumbles into office (twice–and I cringe each time I say that) are the same people who can tell you every winner of American Idol, but can’t tell you more than 1 of the Amendments in the Bill of Rights. They’re the same people who couldn’t tell you the name of their Senators and Congressman, but they know how much to the penny they’re entitled to in EBT, welfare, Section 8 vouchers, etc.

The Republic has fallen. It’s just taking a little longer to crumble than one would expect, but crumble it shall.

A Proud Infidel

B. Hussein 0bama & McCain will do whatever George Soros tells them to, and I’m sure that John “Lurch” Kerry is on his list of pols he owns. Anyone wanna be that Kerry stands to make another pile of money off of this thanks to his stocks in Defense Contractors?

Ex-PH2

So I pounding my head on the brick wall, then, Sparky? That explains my headache. 🙂

I’m concerned that China is showing up in that area for no reason at all.
Let’s look at the hard-core reality: The Big 3 from the Cold War (USA, Russia and China) all still have nukes. No, they were NOT all destroyed. We still have them. Don’t kid yourselves.
France still has nukes. India and Pakistan have nukes. Iran is working on them, and North Korea has primitive stuff, but is upgrading its missile base on its eastern coast.
Israel, of course, does not discuss its weapons, but it does have Iron Dome.

So what makes my worst nightmare from the Cold War NOT an episod of “The Twilight Zone” hosted by Rod Serling.

And just how hard would it be for any group in Syria to get its grubby paws on tactical nukes?

Yes, those do exist. The SEALs used to carry 60-pound nukes with them on deployments. They just never used them. It’s in the bio book written and recently released about them.

Sometimes, I wish the Cold War was still in force.

OWB

Maybe they could send some US forces to Jordon and call them advisors/trainers?

Oh, wait…

RM3(SS)

This is emblematic of the administration. “We have to DO SOMETHING” no matter if it helps or not as long as we DO SOMETHING.

2/17 Air Cav

You covered it all nicely. The administration is confused and the 0-22 free-throw shooter and siisy-armed, girlie jeans baseball tosser is, I believe, panicked. The world is against him on this he appears to be out of control and in denial. That’s a dangerous combo, a very dangerous combo. The lies aren’t being sucked up as in the past and even his apologists are finding it tough to make his case. What policy does this proposed action support other than the unwritten one of his fomenting rebellion and upheaval, undoing most everything his predecessors worked hard to establish; that is, some semblance of stability and predictability in the regions. He took his show on the road and it was a bust. The pentagonals are working and reworking proposed strike plans day and night. This is insanity.

Azygos

How about round up a bunch of these worthless ghettopotoamii who voted for this clown (multiple times) pry the twinkies from their hands and drop them into Syria and let them trash syria by becoming a burden on them.

2/17 Air Cav

@13. Well, some of those voters are here. I don’t think we have any who made the same mistake twice but we have a few who made the second term possible by putting him in 1600 the first time.

NHSparky

@13–because you can’t trash a place that’s been bombed to the Stone Age already?

Ex-PH2

How about this idea? Anyone who supports interfering in Syria’s civil war gets called up first (that’s called ‘the draft’) and sent over there with basic equipment (gas mask, Kevlar stuff, ammo, weapons, etc.).

Leave the war-weary troops at home where they have time to recover from what they’ve already done. By the time they’re rested up, it should be all over.

Oh – did you guys see that video of Egyptian militants shooting rpgs at a container ship in the Suez Canal? That was priceless. I wondered how long it would take for that to happen. Here you go:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/09/05/egypt-protests-ship-idUSL6N0H13H020130905

Old Trooper

The key thing, that Jonn eludes to is; who will secure the WMDs if Assad falls? Someone would have to be there to take control of them before the “rebels” get ahold of them. That would mean “boots on the ground” before the war is over and would require our “boots on the ground” to be there during the war. Otherwise; you have Libya 2.0 and no complement to gather the bad weapons before they fall into the hands of the bad guys. Not to mention all the other players in the region who don’t give 2 shits about Obumbles reputation and would love to get their hands on some of them WMDs.

Iran is fucking nuts and while they don’t have a whole lot of capabilities, they can wreak havoc with what they have. And if anyone thinks that Israel is going to sit back with a coldie and watch this unfold; think again, especially with Iran warning us that if we strike Syria, they are going to strike Israel. Yeah, they will pull the Jericho missiles out of their igloos if they have to, they’ve done it before (1973 Yom Kippur War).

Also; Putin told Obumbles, yesterday in that 15 second meeting, that if he goes through with this, Russia will put up a missile shield in Syria. Now, they won’t be manned by Syrians and if Obumbles goes to take them out, he will be attacking Russians. Let that sink in.

This fucking farce will get out of control quickly and the Fraud-in-Chief won’t be able to stop it, once he starts it. The boy is out of his depth and is too narcissistic and stupid to know how stupid he is.

All this, and many more prizes to come, because the man-child is butthurt.

Hulkamaniac

@6 You are an idiot, Bush did say there were WMD in Iraq and there werent any.. I was there, I am sure you like most on this site had other priorities.

Hulkamaniac

And the fact that Lilyea keeps using the word tar baby is just more dog whistle racism that is so common on this site.

Arby

Mccain told a constituent that no military members would be harmed as a result of any attack on Syria. No one either thought the Pentagn would be attacked, and yet it was. Fuck you mccain.

Old Trooper

@18: You’re right. There weren’t any, because you travelled the entire country and saw for yourself that there weren’t any (Is your name Tommy Franks?). Could that be because Saddam had already sent them to Syria (there’s video footage of many trucks leaving suspected WMD sites and heading to Syria, just before the invasion)? Bush wasn’t the only one that thought they were there. The British and many other countries, also, thought they were there. Oh; and what about that 500 metric tons of yellowcake uranium that we removed from Iraq, did that just fall from the sky?

Veritas Omnia Vincit

@18 Thank you for your esoteric response, a brilliantly articulated viewpoint expressing your opinions that clearly advances your position.

I look forward to more of this exciting reparte, thank you so much for your contributions.

Ex-PH2

@Hulkamanaiac, it’s just a shame that you weren’t alive, meaning hatched out of your petri dish, back in the 1980s and 1990s when missile components destined for Iraq were stopped at the shipping docks in London, England.

And you missed that part about the UN inspectors being barred from entering Iraq to check weapons manufacturing plants, giving Saddam Hussein time to clear the chemicals for nerve gas out of those labs. The UN inspectors found laboratories and equipment, but all the chemicals and components had been hauled away, leaving only the remnants of their existence behind.

All of this was on the news, including videos of Saddam Hussein’s victims in the Kurdish village who died from his chemical warfare experiment. Yeah, he was a Kurd, not an Iraqi.

It would be REAL NICE if you’d bother to research things before you flap your useless yap. If you, and the Obama-addicted press, choose to ignore what happened in the past, that’s your curse and it will land on you with all four feet.

ByrdMan

(Homer Simpson Voice)

MMMMMMMM…..

Yellow Cake

Hulkamaniac

@22 I travelled most of Anbar province and we didn’t find any WMD.. Were you there?

Hulkamaniac

The rest of the US military searched the country inside and out and found nothing.. I really don’t care what they supposedly had in the 80s or 90s because it was obviously not there in 2003..

Never think that war now matter how neccesary or justified is not a crime.

Old Trooper

@26: I didn’t have to be there to see the evidence. We hauled out 500 metric tons of yellowcake uranium. The UN weapons inspectors were constantly delayed in their inspections while trucks rolled out of the facilities they were there to inspect.

Was your job to secure WMDs, while you were there? Did you visit sites where it was suspected there were WMDs? Were you there before the invasion, in Anbar province, to see the trucks for yourself? If not, it doesn’t matter, because neither of us was there when the weapons were hauled away.

Green Thumb

@27.

Clown.

Old Trooper

@27: The yellowcake uranium was there in 2003. You just weren’t where it was. Just because you didn’t see it doesn’t mean it wasn’t there.

ByrdMan

Hulkamaniac,

1. I seriously doubt you travelled “most of Al Anbar province” as it is 53,576 sq mi. That’s a lot of sand for someone to cover during the course of the deployment.

2. Do you think its possible that the other 82% of the area of Iraq (384,841 sq mi.) might have yeilded some weapons stores or possible labs? Maybe?

Maybe?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/08/13/AR2005081300530.html

Ex-PH2

@27 – The centrifuges for refining yellowcake into fissionable material were also found in 2003. That was all on the news, too.

PintoNag

“So why the rush to war?”

That’s a very good question, and one that is going to haunt us. If our president is going to war and not telling us the reason, it means there is a hidden agenda that the American people would not tolerate if they knew about it. We’re being dragged into this by our own government for reasons that will only become clear after we are suffering from them.

I don’t like the way the dots are connecting. We pull out of Iraq and Afghanistan, basically turning those countries back over to the Taliban and Al-Qaeda. Now we’re talking about warring with Syria, unseating the Assad regime, and the only thing that can come of that is an Al-Qaeda-backed rebel force will move in to take power after he’s gone.

Is our President blatantly supporting a militant Islamist push throughtout the Middle East? Or have I completely missed the boat here?

NHSparky

Ga-head, dude, tell everyone which unit you were with at that time you were supposedly all over Anbar province.

Any guy who takes the name of a guy who lost his wife to a 19-year old and turns around and tries to get freaky with his teenage daughter deserves all the pain he gets when he shows up and tries to troll.

Former 11B

I hate to say it, but if those WMD did come from Iraq then I think we need to go in there and get them out. Finish what we started in Iraq.

NHSparky

Problem is, 11B, that many of the materials have decayed over the past 10 years to the point they may well be useless, or close to it, and proving their origin would be nearly impossible, even if they did come from Iraq–after all, they WERE both Ba’athist countries.

What our little troll also forgets is that IED’s were used in Iraq that later showed to have trace amounts of Sarin and other agents in them, but fortunately they were so degraded no harm aside from the explosion resulted from their detonation.

Ex-PH2

OOooop!!! People, he’s starting to waffle. From ‘Breaking News’:

https://twitter.com/peterbakernyt/status/375990625667002368

Read the rather pithy comments.

Bit off more than he can chew again, but that doesn’t mean he won’t go ahead with it.

Ex-PH2

In case you missed it, ‘he’ refers to bodaprez.

Oh, yeah: @22 – Who is ‘we’? You got mouse in you pocket? Who were you with? What was your unit?

Former 11B

Once we finished toppling Saddam we should have pushed off into Syria and Iran, setting fire to anything and everything in sight like General Sherman. That’s what we should have done then because we wouldn’t be fighting them now.

2/17 Air Cav

“Never think that war now matter how neccesary or justified is not a crime.” Okay, that may be–just may be–the absolute stupidest statement I have ever read here at TAH.

2/17 Air Cav

So who was that guy from Seattle in the $494/month apartment? He liked to use “y’all” alot and pretend things, like he was a Christian–until he got angry. Anyway, the Rusted Hulk sounds like him. Same stupid ideas. Same stupid comments.

Green Thumb

@41.

Hart Viges.

Old Trooper

@39: We should have marched into Iraq in ’91 when we were there and then we wouldn’t have had to do it in ’03. Unfortunately, the situation wouldn’t allow us to finish the job in ’91.

2/17 Air Cav

GT. Yeah, that’s the boy. Thanks.

Hulkamaniac

@40 Hemingway said that, so you just called one of the greatest authors in the history of the world and a combat veteran an idiot.. Let me know when you write a masterpiece..

Hulkamaniac

@former11b anybody who thinks the chemical weapons used in Syria came from Iraq is a fool.. You sound like a war mongering scumbag.

Former 11B

Why don’t you back that up with some facts shitheel?

NHSparky

You know what else Hemingway said, dipshit?

“I wonder what this shotgun tastes like?”

Old Trooper

@46: How does he sound like a war monger? He’s actually one of us that don’t want the US to have anything to do with Syria.

NHSparky

Okay, numbnuts, I’ll play your game. If the gas, etc., didn’t come from Syria, and didn’t come from Iraq, then where the fuck DID they come from?