Surrender sounds so easy
I read this at ThreatsWatch earlier today, but it just sounded so incredible that I didn’t want to believe it, let alone write about it;
It comes to our attention that the MEMRI Blog highlights an article from the Saudi al-Watan in Arabic that – according to an Afghan source – the United States is talking to the Taliban seeking to trade control of 5 provinces in exchange for the cessation of attacks on US bases. MEMRI summarizes:
An Afghan source in Kabul reports that U.S. Ambassador in Afghanistan Karl Eikenberry is holding secret talks with Taliban elements headed by the movement’s foreign minister, Ahmad Mutawakil, at a secret location in Kabul. According to the source, the U.S. has offered the Taliban control of the Kandahar, Helmand, Oruzgan, Kunar and Nuristan provinces in return for a halt to the Taliban missile attacks on U.S. bases.
Kunar province borders the Khyber Pass region where the majority of US and NATO supplies pass enroute from Pakistan. And the remaining four provinces constitute fully the southern 25% of Afghanistan’s territory.
But the more I thought about it, the more credible it sounded. From Uncle Jimbo at Blackfive;
Like I said this is a sole source so far, but sadly it fits in with Eikenberry’s strategically leaked messages stabbing Gen. McChrystal in the back by calling for no reinforcements. It also offers President Obama the opportunity to start the exfil from the country and avoid having to attempt to win.
From Greyhawk;
The story defies logic and belief, but unfortunately if the US State Department (or the White House) hasn’t responded clearly and forcefully to unequivocally deny the allegations yet, now would be a good time to do that, too. The current administration has elected to conduct its Afghanistan business via leaks and rumors.
From Cassandra;
Can you imagine the reaction if George Bush were still in office? Would any sane person give a story like this the time of day? Sadly, Obama’s hands off (to put it mildly) leadership style and ineffectual waffling inspire confidence in neither his grasp of the situation nor his resolve:
I still don’t want to believe the article, but Obama has put his foreign policy on cruise control while he focuses on taking over the economy. He has Karl Eikenberry providing guidance and I’ve been warning you that Eikenberry was a dickhead, a dangerous dickhead, when he was my PL, and apparently he hasn’t changed in 35 years.
Like Jimbo pointed out, this is the same kind of deal that the Pakistanis tried to strike with the Taliban last year. Now the Pakistani Army is trying to dislodge the Taliban because they used their territories as a base from which to strike the rest of the country with suicide bombers. Not like they haven’t done that before.
All of this talk about diplomacy and give-and-take sounds dreamy, but for Pete’s sake, look who we’re talking about here.
Category: Barack Obama/Joe Biden, Military issues, Terror War
In all seriousness, what does a win in Afghanistan look like to you?
I don’t know guys, this just sounds too surreal for my tiny little brain to process. I guess I can’t think of this actually happening, but then again, I’m not one to accept letting my adversary off the hook and give him part of a country that I freed from their oppression.
If this is true, I really don’t have the words to describe how I feel about the loss of life and the wounding of troops for nothing. If it is true, I would like to go on record that this administration is full of a bunch of pussies, starting with the BPiC (Big Pussy in Charge).
When you find a rat in your kitchen you don’t make a deal with it to stick to one small area of the kitchen. You take out the broom and beat it to death.
If it is true, the POTUS and his administration are guilty of high crimes and misdemeanors, and need to be impeached and jailed for their actions.
This transcends the normal communiques of wartime between belligerents. It is actively entreating with the enemy in time of war, and deserves the highest punishment available, including death if allowed.
“Eff this shiite. This whole trading with the enemy meme needs to be halted right now, and those involved dealt with harshly, with the war prosecuted to absolute victory, regardless of the length of time required to attain it.
Guys – I hate to say it’s true, but it’s true. I just saw, not 30 minutes ago on TV, a clip of Hillary saying that we have entered talks with the Taliban. Now, she didn’t say what those talks were about, but a simple Google query confirms this. This admin is completely destroying everything that came before it.
I’m currently in Seoul and the news about Barry’s wild Asian ride is laughable. Even the Korean’s are starting to think he’s an empty suit. And I see his Japan visit was a success too, if by success you mean the Japanese pulling their refueling ships out of the Indian Ocean supporting us in Afghanistan.
Again, I ask, why is there an Advertising exec (Axelrod) advising this President on foreign policy? So many questions……so few answers…..
To whom it may concern:
There is no truth to reports that the U.S. Embassy is engaging in secret talks with elements of the Taliban. Our position on the inclusion of Taliban and other fighters into Afghan society remains unchanged: we support the efforts of the Government of the Islamic Republic of Afghan to reintegrate fighters and other disaffected individuals into society, under the Afghan constitution. This process must be Afghan-led.
Caitlin Hayden
U.S. Embassy Spokeswoman
1) I cant believe anyone with any real station in the government actually reads your blog Jonn.
2) If this topic has such weight that the US Embassy has spokespeople (man that just sounds like bad english) trolling the web to post statements denying the fact, you’d think something in the MSM would be out there as well….let me go check…
Nope
Yeah, I had trouble believing it, too, but the IP address tracked back to a State Department server. The only thing I’ve said differently than anyone else is that I have experience with Eikenberry being a dickhead…so you have to believe that State is worried that everyone will find out that Eikenberry is a dickhead.
Thank you, Caitlin, for coming on here and clearing this up. While I understand that diplomacy is a rather difficult thing, I don’t understand how you “integrate” taliban back into society in Afghanistan. Wasn’t that part of the problem before? The taliban didn’t control the entire country, but they controlled enough of it to make it one of the most backwards and oppressive countries on the planet. As a wise old gentleman (WWI Vet) once told me “you don’t make a deal with the devil and walk away with your soul”. Pakistan tried that and look what it got them; they almost lost their country to these bottom feeders.
You might imagine the same thing happening when the taliban is “integrated” back into Afghan society, which means that we will end up back a square one and in about 10 years, we will be back where we are right now with more soldiers maimed and dead for what; posturing by diplomats? Victory through unconditional surrender is the only way to lasting peace. If you think I’m lying, take a look at the last unconditional surrender (WWII) and look at “negotiated peace” (Korea/Iraq in the 1st GW) and tell me what works and what keeps people on edge for decades.
“There is no truth to reports that the U.S. Embassy is engaging in secret talks with elements of the Taliban.”
1) How about talks that aren’t secret?
2) And who the heck confirms secret talks thereby making them, um, no longer secret?
3) It would appear that someone in the Kabul government didn’t see the memo.
He’ll get to it as soon as he finishes that NEXT round of golf. Priorities, people. Priorities. [Oh, that that state dinner he is hosting for Indian Prime Minister Singh where he plans to ride into the tent on an elephant because he thinks it is a wedding or something equally as important and pressing.]
Yes, I have read reports from US officers(can’t remember their rank) on the ground that we are indeed paying the Taliban millions to buy them off from attacking our supply lines, money which they spend buying more weapons, presumably. The officer being interviewed hated the policy, but acknowledged that it was ongoing. Shades of the novel “Catch 22”, where the US was trading with the nazis to keep the fighting going. I do not know if this policy was in place during the Bush years or not. It kinds points to the near impossibility of controlling territory in a mountainous country the size of Texas. I sure don’t see it helping us in the long run…
And I’m sure you won’t hesitate to put up those links when you find them, right Joe?
I wasn’t buying this story from the beginning. The only source on it was the Saudi press, which along with the Saudi government, is probably as unreliable as they come.
I wonder if the Afghan source in Kabul even existed.
Sparky, it was a few days ago, but I will try and backtrack and dig the links up for you. Beleive me, my imagination is not fertile enough to make that stuff up….
Joe, hint, anything with NYT, LAT, byline, or any post from du, Kos or Puff Hos.
NHSparky, Here’s are some about contractors and Italian troops, not the US military, bribing the Taliban. Accusations and denials…. Can’t find the site that interviewed a US officier, but in the interview the officer stated that paying ribes to open up supply routes was common knowledge, although he detested the practice. Can’t attest to their veracity, but one gets the sense it might, repeat, might be the tip of the iceberg.
http://www.globalpost.com/dispatch/afghanistan/090902/usaid-taliban-funding
http://news.smh.com.au/breaking-news-world/italy-denies-taliban-bribe-report-20091015-gyt8.html
OK, we have Italians (maybe) bribing warlords and maybe the Taliban, we have USAID maybe paying off the Taliban, or maybe warlords.
So, Joey boy, enlighten us, the “tip of the iceberg”? Which iceberg would that be? And I noted your effort to lay this at the feet of the Bush administration, nicely done.
Another link, and an excerpt from the article:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/nov/13/us-trucks-security-taliban
It’s a big part of their income,” one of the top Afghan government security officials admits. In fact, US military officials in Kabul estimate that a minimum of 10% of the Pentagon’s logistics contracts – hundreds of millions of dollars – consists of payments to insurgents.
Well, UpNorth, when you get so many similar stories from so many different sources, either there is some grand conspiracy afoot, or there is a least a grain of truth to the reports. What emerges from all these different sources is that the Taliban are getting paid by a party or parties to let supplies through, and the money is all green, will buy plenty of RPG’s wherever it is coming from. After reading all this, a person doesn’t know what to think anymore…
[…] I reported that the Obama Administration was negotiating with the Taliban more than two years ago, Caitlin Hayden of the US Embassy in Afghanistan came on This Ain’t Hell and told us that they weren’t […]
[…] time that we were negotiating with the Taliban. Here at TAH we’ve been talking about it since November 2009. And we didn’t believe Eikenberry’s propaganda chief, Caitlan Hayden when she tried to […]