Here Come the Lawsuits
The Navy Times is reporting President Trump’s intent to reverse the 10-month-old Pentagon policy that allows transgender troops to serve openly is likely to set the stage for a legal battle between the Defense Department and those troops at risk of involuntary separation, legal experts say.
‘“We’re going to raise all holy hell that this is intolerable and say we’re not going to go away quietly on this issue,” said Matt Thorn, executive director of OutServe-Servicemembers Legal Defense Network (SLDN), an organization that represents the transgender community in the U.S. military.’
Trump posted tweets Wednesday morning baring transgender people from serving in the military “in any capacity.” While having no legal bearing, Trump’s tweets may precede executive orders formalizing changes to the Pentagon’s policy.’
Thorn says his advocacy group has already identified several potential plaintiffs from among the estimated 7,000 transgender troops on active duty. The group would file a lawsuit almost immediately should a ban be enacted, he said.
‘However, a quick lawsuit might not lead to a quick decision, warns Greg Greiner, a partner at Tully Rinckey law firm and head of its Military and National Security Law Practice Group.
Like litigation regarding the “don’t ask, don’t tell” policy, Greiner says that a court case against a transgender military ban would likely drag on for years. But the process could begin soon.
“I get the impression that the Secretary of Defense [Jim Mattis] had been considering [the ban],” said Greiner. “If the president has it the way he wants, it will probably be sooner rather than later.”
Advocates would likely ask the courts to stay the policy change, which would effectively prohibit the Pentagon from implementing the ban until the litigation is resolved.
The ultimate outcome of a lawsuit is unclear. Traditionally the federal courts have given the military wide latitude to conduct its affairs. But there are instances where lawsuits have been effective: Advocates for gay and lesbian troops successfully blocked enforcement of the “don’t ask, don‘t tell“ rules in 2010.
According to Trump’s tweets, healthcare costs and internal disruption were the driving forces behind the decision.
Category: Politics
I wonder how many of those lawsuits will be funded by the military times papers….
You boys n’ girls better hurry up and go to the DEERS office and switch your gender back to what it is biologically….
The strategy of the Left – death by a thousand lawsuits.
And the lawers are probably well paid by a Soros-backed group to make it happen.
Isn’t it funny how they can gather up that many perverted uglies in one place?
Death by a thousand paper cuts.
Just like I told the interviewer when I was specially selected for an interview before DADT was repealed
“NONE of this BS is about “equality”. Not one goddamn but of it”
And you weren’t tagged for a trip to the re-education camps?!
Mrs. Atkron had a wonderful observation the other day. She said that there are people out there that are convinced that one of their limbs needs to be cut off…that that limb feels alien to them, like it is not part of their body; and then attempt to amputate it.
We, as a society view that as abnormal and crazy. We say that person needs to be treated for whatever is causing their brain to misfire.
But, we don’t apply the same standard to some crazy person that is convinced that the plumbing given to them in the womb.
Why is that? Why do we HAVE to accept a person’s mental illness that tells them that they should not have the genitalia assigned to them with the DNA that courses through every frigging cell in their body?
If this HAS to be the new normal for society, then just stop the planet and let me off.
I had a crazy uncle who thought that he was a crystal chandelier. He was always hanging upside down in the parlor. We knew he was nuts, but we never told him he was crazy because we needed the light.
Hahahahahahahahahahah …
That “we needed the light” caught me by surprise!
https://www.facebook.com/RealPoliticalCowboy/videos/1433259170102319/?hc_ref=ARR0AVXx9dspCwNxj2dK2OFECCijeBgzwb6Q213-ZBCTeE0ORS7tSvZILKh-_n0zJo0&pnref=story
As usual, the only winners will be lawyers.
You may not be qualified to join the United States Armed Forces for the following wiener related issues:
Male genitalia.
(1) Absence of both testicles, either congenital, or acquired, or unexplained absence of a testicle.
(2) Epispadias or Hypospadias, when accompanied by evidence of infection of the urinary tract, or if clothing is soiled when voiding.
(3) Undiagnosed enlargement or mass of testicle or epididymis.
(4) Undescended testicle(s).
(5) Orchitis, acute or chronic epididymitis.
(6) Penis, amputation of, if the resulting stump is insufficient to permit normal micturition.
(7) Penile infectious lesions, including herpes genitalis and condyloma acuminata, acute or chronic, not amenable to treatment. Such treatment must be given and demonstrated effective prior to accession.
(8) Prostatitis, acute or chronic.
(9) Hydrocele. Left varicocele, if painful, or any right varicocele.
c. Major abnormalities and defects of the genitalia, such as a change of sex, a history thereof, or dysfunctional residuals from surgical correction of these conditions.
So, to be clear…the United States Government will not allow people to join the military if they have to knowingly provide prolonged medical care for a pre-existing condition.
I am fairly sure having your wiener wacked off is an elective surgery.
— sigh —
The wiener again.
It’s always the wiener.
Weiner Weiner Chicken Deiner….
Tallywhacker instead?
But, wait. There is THAT one guy up in Chicago…
Well, that will keep them busy for a while.
Next!
Funny how they want to sue to get in/stay in and no one mentions that Bradley Manning said his gender issues are what drove him to treason.
Last I saw, the contract with the service is essentially at-will – they can do damn near anything “for the good of the service” – including throwing your ass out.
Here is my take:
1. Implement a ban on enlisting Trans service members…done.
2. Allow those who identify as trans to remain. However, they must return to their birth gender for quarters, uniform, grooming & PT standards.
a. That way if a guy wants to wear heels and a skirt on liberty he can…if one is so inclined.
3. Allow those who identify as trans and do not wish to conform to these standards to receive an Honorable Discharge (if eligible) and the all the benefits they are entitled to receive.
4. This way the problem works itself out naturally. Anyone that is trans and ‘packs the gear’ to remain will do so in an acceptable fashion. Those that do not ‘pack the gear’ will either leave on their own or be weeded out thru non-compliance.
Also, stop inflating the numbers, okay. There aren’t 15K trans in the military. The Rand Corp estimates around 2K while the Williams Institute estimates 6K. The truth is somewhere in between. I’ve never seen so much to do about an infinitesimal amount of people in my life.
Rack me! I’m out.
I think your analysis of where DOD will end up is pretty close.
Trump’s “Policy” Tweet is just a method used to anchor the discussion and right out of “Art of the Deal”.
We’ll end up with the policy above (pretty reasonable and supportable to the vast majority of the country) through a combination of legal/Congressional action.
If the policy above was rolled out as is first, there would still be lawsuits and DOD wound up further to the left on the issue.
This same technique played out over the last few weeks in with the “Grandparent Visa Ban”. Administration pushes the hardest policy knowing they will be sued regardless, and are defending from the more favorable ground far forward. They end up gaining more overall than if they had rolled out a slightly more liberal definition of who is permitted to still enter the US.
I would add one thing – TG is a pre-existing condition and not covered by VA treatment.
There are an infinitesimal (good word!) amount of people killed by firearms in this country annually. ESPECIALLY if you don’t count Chicago, Baltimore, Camden, and St Louis.
But, every time more than two people are killed at a time (minus those killed in Chicago that the left doesn’t care about because they are black), they jump up and down whining about “gun control!”
If there is a minutia group of people, they will be getting protected because they have a right to be weird and do whatever they want! Even if it will harm/hinder others….
Said “infinitesimal” mount of people are your brothers and sisters in arms. They met the same standards you and I did to join. The only difference between us is last year they were told they could serve openly and now they’re being told to piss off.
How would you feel if they took the GI Bill away from currently serving troops? Its cost to the government is massive and college can most definitely be a distraction to stateside soldiers from the mission at hand.
This isn’t about recruiting Trans troops. Its about standing with men and women who already wear the same uniform you do and already swore the same oath you did.
If you still want to separate them for a medical condition after they served, then they should get to go through the same med board process as every other soldier. You can pay for their promised treatment at the VA instead.
The government has always been dicking with policies that affect the conditions necessary to serve, or to be retained. If the QRST community wasn’t considered a privileged caste with an inordinate amount of political power, then no one would care. Remember back in 85 when the DOD started their routine screening for HIV, and the subsequent separations? The QRST community didn’t have near the same influence then. I think it would have been impossible to introduce that same prolicy in 2016. IMO
HIV…another non-deployable category that needs to be treated with a drug cocktail that costs a shitload of money.
Here is my take:
1. Admin sep all of them. Every single one.
2. Get back to creating an exceptional military and winning wars/conflicts/actions/whatever they call them these days.
3. Ask forgiveness of the thousands they kicked out for any and every excuse to come back and fill the severe shortages we have in the military and let them get back to accomplishing the mission, fighting and winning our nation’s wars.
If the new policy is implemented I hope it will include sensible, case-by-case consideration for those who are already serving. I’m sure there are some who were serving well and honorably, under the radar, and only outed themselves after the Obama change in policy was announced. If those folks are willing to continue serving as they were, with no special accommodations, I’m all for letting them do it.
I like that line of thinking, Mr. Bill…
I’m guessing they will have something along these lines. SECDEF will add some considerations for those issues. But, letting them continue to “transform” won’t be one of them.
“If the new policy is implemented I hope it will include sensible, case-by-case consideration for those who are already serving. I’m sure there are some who were serving well and honorably, under the radar, and only outed themselves after the Obama change in policy was announced.”
So, you are saying we should let people who LIED when they raised their right hand and spoke the words, to keep lying?
Besides, the cat is out of the hat. You cannot put it back in.
So no. If you lied to join in, you should get kicked the hell out.
And there are less than 1000 of those people in the military.
MAMGA
Or……maybe there are 14,000 who were smart enough not to come forward initially because they thought the policy could change? Swings in policy never happen in uniform.
Lied? Did anyone ask you, when inprocessing, “Do you think you are the opposite sex?”
Did you conceal anything in your inprocessing? Was there a moment of “Wow. They never asked me about…”?
I suspect a great many people enter service, not exactly boasting of prior oddities. If subsequently the President says “Free pass if you come out”…
I think -anyone- currently servering deserves a case-by-case evaluation if someone wants to kick them out, for any reason. “Due process” may be somewhat restricted for service-folks, but it is not entirely absent.
We let people serve who are missing legs. I am prepared to listen to someone argue their case that they, too, can carry their weight. If proof is forthcoming, why not?
I’ll just leave this here.
The sad thing is, if Hillary were elected, I’m guessing the military would have special places for you to learn how to be different, gay, transgender, and the other 50 dopey considerations the they want us to give.
This might be of interest to the commenters here. Gender Studies and the Trans non-sense debunked. Gender is a social construct = False.
The seventh video is the key / free to watch.
—-
The Cassandra Complex Report :
The Nordic Council of Ministers (a regional inter-governmental co- operation consisting of Norway, Sweden, Finland, Denmark, and Iceland) has decided to close down the NIKK Nordic Gender Institute. The NIKK had been the flagship of “Gender Theory”, providing the “scientific” basis for social and educational policies that, from the 1970s onward, had transformed the Nordic countries to become the most “gender sensitive” societies in the world. The decision was made after the Norwegian State Television had broadcasted a television documentary called “Hjernevask” (the Norwegian word for “brainwash”) in which comedian Harald Eia exposed the hopelessly unscientific character of the NIKK.
#1
#2
#3
#4
#5
#6
(password:hjernevask)
#7
(password:hjernevask)
Let them in. It will boost end strength. Remember the stampede of patriotic gays when DADT was repealed. Everybody saw that right? They just wanted to serve their country and hundreds of thousands overwhelmed the recruiters.
Did I miss something?
The president “tweeted” something so it becomes policy?
(So using “Twitter” has replaced signing Executive Orders and triggers lawsuits).
🙂
Its a preemptive lawsuit.
Apparently Gen. Mattis, the Sec. of Defense was blindsided by the tweet; it is reported he was “appalled”.
I did not think a service member could sue the military?
Take them to court over a decision effecting them? Absolutely. Suing the military as a service member for monetary recompense is possible, but I would think that kind of thing takes so long someone who did would be out of the military by the time the decision was made.
Though, if it is because they were injured due to negligence, medical procedure gone wrong, etc., they cannot sue the military.
The can certainly go to court to try staying in uniform though. That happens a lot, and/or to be reinstated.
Yes.
But is it not within the realms of UCMJ?
And I must admit, I have never seen it.
Paving the way for the first blind Fighter Pilot…
and Deaf Sonar man.
Legless SEAL.
Trans soldiers have been serving openly and effectively in the following militaries for years if not decades.
Canada, France, Denmark, Germany, Britain, Sweden, New Zealand, Australia, Norway, Austria, Israel, Denmark, and Finland.
The idea that they take away from combat effectiveness is unfounded.
You do realize the “other militaries do it” argument is the same logic your mother used to use on you right? “If everybody else was jumping off a cliff would you do it?
So who gives a shit what “other militaries” doing?
If we did what other militaries do, we could have beards and unions and drink on deployment.
And Other militaries? When is the last time you heard of a Canadian/French/Danish/German/British/Swedish/Austrian/Australian/Finnish led coalition defeating anybody?
Yeah the French are real good at stomping on 3rd World rebels and the Commonwealth troops are great to have in a coalition. But in general, every one of the militaries you mention come with so many caveats and limits on their participation in operations they’re really not who we should be looking to for personnel policy ideas.
And I can already hear your “But Israel” rebuttal. Yeah Israel is fighting for their survival as a nation and will use any body they can put on the wall.
We seemed to be doing pretty good in the combat effectiveness department prior to the policy change. So will allowing them in some how enhance our combat effectiveness, either individually or as a group?
Please explain and cite sources.
There are several lessons to be learned from the Oblunder years. One of which is following the crowd will get us nowhere.
This shit is just a freakin hissy fit because “oh noes, not everyone thinks we are the cool kids anymore”. Nothing but a “pay attention to me, validate me” shit on steroids. So fucking sick of the lgbtqerty idiots trying to force the rest of us to accept their bullshit from men in women’s bathrooms to male military members wearing female uniforms. I DON’T CARE IF YOU ARE GAY and in the military. Do your damn job, meet requirements, and keep your sex life private. But I will be damned if I accept what is a mental illness as fucking normal. YOU CAN NOT CHANGE YOUR SEX UNTIL YOU CAN CHANGE YOUR DNA. Until that happens, your just an ugly chick in a dress or a chick with no dick in pants.
Wag the dog.
A deep dive into the numbers shows an interesting example of how the LGBT tribe can project larger transgender numbers than actually exist. For purposes of research support, the news media almost universally has based the military trans estimates on either a Rand Corporation study or a Williams Institute study from 2014.
What news pundits usually fail to mention is that both Rand and Williams where working from a primary source which likely had its own agenda. This was a 2011 transgender survey co-sponsored by the The National Gay and Lesbian Task Force and the National Center for Transgender Equality. The numbers generated were the result of a phone-online-paper survey of roughly 6500 transgender-only voluntary respondents.
One remarkable, to the point of being unbelievable, finding of the NTDS survey was that of those self-declared transgenders, fully 20 percent indicated they had served in the military. A metric that was apparently accepted without question or confirmation. As a matter of perspective, the demographics of military service among the general population have held steady at around 0.5 percent for the past couple of decades.
Adding further confusion is a finding by the Centers for Disease Control that the transgender population is now estimated at 1.4 million, according to the New York Times. Such a number would mean that transgenders amount to around 0.4 percent of the population. Such a percentage would mean about 6000 transgenders now on active duty.
Still, there are at least a couple of problems with such an estimate: 1) It assumes that transgenders are represented in the military at the same rate as the general population. Something unlikely given the atmosphere of military service which often has a tendency to eat the weak, and 2) That initial enlistment numbers by gender are going to be equally male/female. Currently, male members of the military outnumber females at a ratio of around 4:1.
You say that like they’re inflating statistics and numbers just to further their own purpose as if they are a bigger deal than they really are…..
It doesn’t matter how big or small a number they are. They already met the same standards you did. They wear the same uniform and swore the same oath. Whatever happened to not leaving a soldier behind? How about you be an actual NCO and stand up for your troopers instead of allowing your personal feelings to clout your judgement.
It seems to me the person who might be letting emotional feelings cloud judgement here is you. Or is your “whatever happened to not leaving a soldier behind” appeal to emotion just using a logical fallacy to win an argument? You might also want to re-think the implied false equivalence that leaving the wounded behind in a gunfight is at the same level as treating gender dysphoria.
Blah, blah, leftist propaganda bullshit, blah, blah, blah…the only people calling for this are those not in the military, and those that would never serve. Why risk the war-fighting capabilities to cater to an incredibly small number of outliers? Many, many people are DQ-ed for physical, mental, and health conditions. Are they going to sue now too? GMAFB
This whole non-sense that the needs of the 1 outweigh the needs of the many goes against all military principles. Barry from Honolulu is gone…let’s get this train back on the tracks before it’s too late.
Institute mandatory service now.
And make women eligible for the draft.
Curious to see how quick these folks put a sock in it…..
TG is a mental disorder 100% -You cannot change your DNA.
Scientists successfully edit DNA of human embryo for first time
http://www.smh.com.au/national/health/scientists-successfully-edit-dna-of-human-embryo-for-first-time-20170728-gxl8dp.html
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Depression is a mental disorder 100%. Lets kick out all the troops with that too while we at it.
If it’s pre-existing, then yes.
If it’s a result of military service then the military is responsible for treating it.
I’m pretty sure gender dysphoria is a pre-existing condition and NOT caused by military service.
It is also a disqualifying factor for accession.
We do. Nor are those with suicidal ideations or attempts allowed to enlist. Remember, no less an authority than Lady Gaga herself said nearly half of 18-24 TG’s had attempted suicude. Yeah, let’s give them a weapon! Great fucking idea!
I’ve only met two tg folks who are open about it. They both brought up that suicide statistic. Is that supposed to make me feel sorry for them or to afford them special treatment.
I say give them an appropriate length of fine hemp rope, and let nature take its course.
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