Hunting Marines’ heads
I’m sure you’re all familiar with the story of the Marines who were court martialed for urinating on the corpses of their enemies. I’m petty sure that most of us were upset that the incident wasn’t dealt with as Non-judicial Punishment (NJP). Well, it turns out that was the recommendation of the original convening authority, Lt. Gen. Thomas Waldhauser, according to Business Insider;
Over the course of his investigation as convening authority, Waldhauser determined that the most suitable punishment for the Marines involved was nonjudicial punishment, which is less serious than court-martial.
But a recent statement by Waldhauser to the Department of Defense inspector general obtained by CNN details how Amos tried to influence Waldhauser’s ruling during a meeting in February 2012.
“I do not necessarily remember the exact words or sequence of what was said, but the [Commandant] did make a comment to the effect that the Marines involved needed to be ‘crushed,'” Waldhauser said, according to the statement. “The CMC went on to say that he wanted these Marines to be discharged from the Marine Corps when this was all over.”
After Waldhauser pushed back against the Commandant, he was removed as convening authority by the Commandant. So the conversation has become the basis for an appeal;
Capt. James Clement, has filed a motion for dismissal in the case, contending that Amos violated Article 37 and improperly influenced the case.
What’s more, Amos and his legal team allegedly sought to have documents classified that would have revealed his attempted unlawful influence over Waldhauser.
The Pentagon’s inspector general’s office is investigating so there might end up being some justice in this story after all. It was clearly an over-reaction to faux outrage in the media and the commandant complying with the misbegotten wishes of his political masters.
Thanks to Doug for the link.
Category: Marine Corps
Setting Marines to go after Marines for the sake of politics, whether it’s domestic politics or international, is just plain sickening. This wasn’t a case of justice, it’s revenge. They should have no problem getting it thrown out.
Let me see if I understand this correctly: GEN Amos is embarrassed that he got caught with HIS pants down because of his overreacting to Marines who were caught with THEIR pants down.
Is this correct?
The following is merely my person opinion:
1 – GEN Amos should stop being such an ass. (SHould I call him and tell him so?) If he thinks it’s something new, I refute that by saying I’m sure it’s happened before.
2 – ALL military personal should be told to refrain from doing AND recording AND releasing to the public such childish/vengeful behavior, period.
3 – These Marines should be NJPd and all Marines told if this happens again, they’ll be transferred to permanent latrine duty.
Yeah, bust ’em down a rank, but court martial, when the AQ and Taliban have done far worse things and put them on the internet? I don’t think so.
When, oh when will the higher ranks in our military learn the leader essential art of SHUTTING THEIR MOUTHS.
Jesus. I’m only a captain, and when we’ve had disciplinary actions we’ve undertaken I’ve known (without *having* to be told) that you can’t talk about it!!!
Yeah, command influence usually doesn’t work out very well. Atta boy, General. Way to fuck up the entire process. Granted, their careers are still pretty well fucked, which is what you wanted, but now you look like a total douchetool too.
Then again, maybe justice IS being served.
Yes, the prospect for some semblance of justice is good now. I am happy to hear it. As for Amos, if the allegations of influence, interference, and attempted coercion are true, I sincerely hope that someone, somewhere places his scrotum in a waffle iron.
“The dust-up was kept secret. Marine Corps Times reported that it had been misled by Marine headquarters: When a reporter asked in 2012 why Gen. Waldhauser was replaced, the response was that he was preparing for his job with the defense secretary.” (Washington Times)
The cover-up always gets them. Why? Because reporters then get personally pissed, start digging, and don’t stop until the lying liar is gift-wrapped for the shit pile.
This is an example of unlawful command influence upon a court martial. 20 years ago, the (then) Court of Military Appeals would have reversed the convictions. These days? I don’t know what the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Armed Forces would do.
Amos was doing his master’s bidding. Panetta and Obama wanted scalps and Amos was tasked with making it happen. He would, in the process, lose the respect of his peers and the Corps. Was it worth it, Gen. Amos?
Those who know and have worked with Gen Amos know he’s rather autocratic. His “Heritage Brief” a couple of years ago set the tone, and some people actually got up and quietly left the auditorium as he and SgtMaj Barrett were speaking. They saw it coming.
As for SgtMaj Barrett… I’m wondering where the senior enlisted leadership was in this whole process went. There’s nothing wrong with telling the boss when he’s fucking up.
Amos needs to go.
Clearly, LtGen Waldhauser is in need of reeducation.
@7–OT–I don’t think General Amos gives a shit. Like far too many careerists (both officer and NCO) they care only for their tickets being punched, the next assignment, and getting that cush job lined up for after retirement, not really caring who or how many they have to shit on to fulfill objectives 1-3.
Now I’ve been out of the Marine Corps for a very long time (ETS’s in 1988), but you’re all looking at this the wrong way. General Amos did this so all of the Marines could appeal and have the convictions/office hours punishments expunged.
Okay, I couldn’t even type that with a straight face.
And notice how Hagel defended him. The bowl welcoming the turd.
@10: I know he doesn’t give a shit, Sparky. That’s why I worded it that way. I should have put the “sarcasm” at the bottom. He’s a ticket puncher that was more than willing to do the deed for his limp wristed overlords, instead of being a leader.
I never liked GEN Amos, he always seemed like a self-righteous blowhard…not that I knew or heard much about him other than the occasional news and Birthday message, but still…
F this shit. Let’s focus on the real deal Marines.
Good read to you all.
F U Amos.
http://www.businessinsider.com/john-kellys-speech-about-marines-in-ramadi-2013-6
Time to get a Commandant with the 0302 background back in office. I’ll leave it at that.
I’ve done my time outside the wire in A-stan, and when I first heard about that video, all I could think was “There but for the Grace of God go I.” . I’ve seen what animals our enemies there are, and I just thought they were stupid for recording and posting it. Their punishment should have been something like turd-burning detail for a couple of weeks!
@16–you’ve seen what they’re like now. Just imagine what they’ll be like after we’ve left that shithole and there’s nobody to hold them in check.
About time someone at the top gets smacked down for being a politically correct assmonkey, and then using their command influence to fry good Marines who got far more punishment than they deserved.
@15 How about an 0311. I know of one.
This reply probably deserves to be its own post, one written by a smarter, wiser, more articulate, and sexier individual than myself, but since the Hooters girls are all busy (and don’t have posting rights here anyway), I’ll take a stab at it. Yesterday there was a lot crap posted on the web about how horrible America is for having dropped Little Boy on Hiroshima, 68 years ago (and we’ll likely see another round of again on the 9th, when the anniversary of Fat Man and his date with Nagasaki comes by). The argument is that with two bombs, America killed over 150,000 sweet innocent civilians, who were on the verge of surrender. They were starved, out of materials, out of supplies, and their spirit was broken. All we had to do was wait them out, and we wouldn’t have even needed to invade. Instead us warmongering baby killing American’s dropped the two most powerful bombs every created on cities, just because we could. So what does that have to do with Marines pissing on some dead bodies? Hang on I’m getting there. I’m not going to argue the above point. I don’t care of the Japanese were on their last legs. I don’t care if we could have starved them, or won by a ground invasion, because in the end, the people who think we were wrong to drop the bombs would find fault with us no matter what decision was made. Its no win, and that drives my point home. If we invaded, millions may have died, including civilians. And the argument becomes “Anyone can see how stupid that was, so many millions dead because we invaded when we didn’t need too! What do you mean we had to bombs that if we’d dropped would have ended the war and spared these people? How could we not use them?!?!?!?” If we starved them out, then still hundreds of thousands would have died, slower lingering deaths. And so we’d be inhumane! Why didn’t we invade! Tear that bandaid off! Sure it hurts a bit more up front but its… Read more »
@19 – 0311 works, as long as there’s not too much dumbfuckery.
It almost seems like the mentality in this country that it is out fault we are free.
And yes, you read that correctly.
@20 – Damn good essay, SGT Kane. Damn good.
Classic Blue Falcon Corps in action.
Whatever, as long as gays get benefits and .00000001% of female officers get theirs the plan is succeeding.
@20 – Well done, Sergeant.
Gen Amos: Do you wet your bed? I bet you do…
Bedwetter
@23 – Are the bacon waffles ready yet?
@21 First Applicant.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_F._Kelly_(Marine)
@22 Right on the money with that one, GT.
Friend of mine in the Marines said “Put a damn fly fly boy in and get shit on” when he heard Amos was the new Commandant. Today, he texted me saying “I knew it”.
Patrick Ferguson. Kings Mountain.
I think the answer is simple. We just need to stop electing Democrats to ANY government post, trim about 70% of government back into the private sector or just eliminate it, bust the chops of folks who use phrases like “for the children” (when they mean raise taxes and increase bureaucracy), and put blue falcons like GEN Amos on the first boat back to France or wherever his ancestors came from.
Put a REMF in command of the Corps and you turn the Corps into REMFlandia run by REMF Rules.
Sad but true, for some in the Corps, Semper Fi was never anything but a slogan.
Colonels and above pretty much have their testicles cut off on promotion by the politicos.
General Anus is just proving that. If he didn’t kow-tow to Princess Barry and his minions he’d be out of there quicker than a cat can lick its own ass.
I wish the Ghost of Chesty Puller were here to answer the wimps in Congress and the Press.
Reporter: General Puller “What are you going to do about those nasty Marines defiling the Bodies Of Taliban fighters.”
Chesty: ” I’m going to make sure they have plenty of water on hand to re-hydrate and resupply them with ammo to shoot more of those bastards, next stupid question”
Now we know why he got the Commandant slot.
What @20 SGT Kane and @33 Old Dog said. Chesty must be rolling over in his grave. I’m pretty sure Washington, Pershing, Patton and Bradley are, too, so he’s in good company.
Not to mention the hundreds of thousands of war dead since our founding.
When I first heard that SgtMaj Barrett was selected to be the SgtMaj of the Marine Corps, I was a little excited, I had served with him, years ago, and thought he was exactly what our Corps needed…
All I can say is, after all these years, he sold out.
Giving that “No Scout Sniper symbol tattoos” and such, and I’m fairly certain, he has the SS lightening bolts on his body somewhere…since he was a bad ass Sniper in his day.
This is what the Marine Corps gets when POG’s (Personnel Other-than Grunts) get put into the command billets…
@ 29 SGT Kane, Allied casualties for just the invasion of the Island of Honshu were predicted to be between 400,00 to one million. Japanese dead were projected at upwards of 25 million to take all of the Home Islands. As I understand it, the Purple Heart medals ordered for Operation Olympic are still being issued today. We were going to have to fight the entire Japanese nation. The battles for the pacific islands showed That these people did not surrender. Even the civilians chose death over capture. Had we not dropped the bombs it is possible that the whole nation would have been destroyed. Two Atomic Bombs saved more Japanese lives than they took, perhaps by a factor 1000 to one.
Roger in Republic, you beat me to it! I’ve read and seen footage of Japanese Civilians being trained and rallied to fight to the death for their homeland. I’ve also seen and read plenty of accounts that up to or over one million US casualties were predicted in the event of an invasion of Japan, hell yeah, those two bombs saved at least several hundred times more Japanese lives than they did American ones! But hey, WE’RE the bad guys, just ask any liberal. It’s odd how they always fail to mention things like the Bataan Death March, the Rape of Nanking, the Dutch West Indies, and manifold other atrocities the Japanese Imperial Army committed on civilians,….. (Maybe it’s because they can’t blame Bush?)
@33 You must be a medium, because that sounds exactly like something Chesty would say, and he’s rolling in his hallowed grave right now.