“I didn’t tell. It didn’t matter”
I spent twenty years in the infantry, and although we played a lot of tricks on people, mostly of a sexual nature, I don’t think I ever saw anything that comes even close to the antics described in this morning’s Washington Post by Joseph Roche. Based on absolutely nothing but a gut feeling I’m calling Bullshit.
Shop talk in the unit revolved around sex, either the prostitute-filled parties of days past or the escapades my comrades looked forward to. They interpreted my silence and total lack of interest as an admission of homosexuality. My higher-ups seemed to think that gave them the right to bind me to chairs, ridicule me, hose me down and lock me in a feces-filled dog kennel.
Now, why would someone think that lack of participation in discussions about sex make someone queer? We had ordained ministers and the average “Holy Joes” who wouldn’t participate either. And we certainly didn’t spend our entire work day talking about that stuff – you run out after a while and actual work intercedes. But my NCOs certainly didn’t do any of that stuff Rocha describes.
I was the decoy, and I had to do just what Chief Petty Officer Michael Toussaint ordered.
In one corner of the classroom was a long sofa, turned away from the door. When you walked into the room, it appeared that one man was sitting on it, alone. But I was there too — the chief had decided that I would be down on my hands and knees, simulating oral sex. A kennel support staff member and I were supposed to pretend that we were in our bedroom and that the dogs were catching us having sex. Over and over, with each of the 32 dogs, I was forced to enact this scenario.
That makes no sense – are there sex-detection dogs in the Navy? Does the Navy use these sex-detection dogs to find Homos having sex? Can the dogs differentiate between homosexual and heterosexual sex? Do the dogs care if you’re having sex? Too many unanswered questions.
I told no one about what I was living through. I feared that reporting the abuse would lead to an investigation into my sexuality. My leaders and fellow sailors were punishing me for keeping my sexuality to myself, punishing me because I wouldn’t “tell.”
I was never in the Navy, but that just sounds ridiculous. I’m pretty sure the Navy has better things to do than try to get it’s members to out themselves. Rocha claims that the CNO is investigating this and I hope the results of the investigation are published because to me this sounds like a guy whose knees went weak during his Naval Academy years and bailed, now he’s looking for an excuse that makes him look good.
Category: Military issues
AS,you said, “I don’t think those integration problems are enough to turn away dedicated Americans who want to serve their country”. Again, what in the current DADT prevents “dedicated Americans”, who happen to be homosexual, from serving? If they’re dedicated, they can certainly serve all they want.
Apparently, the problem raises it’s head because they can’t serve “openly”? So, they’re dedicated, but not THAT dedicated?
AW1 Tim, If you aren’t able to do as I proposed with males, then there is something different between you and those who can. I’d argue it is who you are attracted to. You have the ability to be attracted to someone sexually and emotionally. So do gay men and women. That is not much of a mutation. The same type of logic has been applied to many relationships through “morality” based discrimination. Loving v. Virginia was the latest rebuke of such standards. You don’t define what you mean by “normal” behaviour. I don’t think many straight people will live by whatever you describe, but I’ll withhold judgement. I LOVE how Matt says talking about sex at work was inappropriate. Has he really ever been in the military? Good luck enforcing that one. Old Trooper has never been to Mardi Gras I guess. Or all those women lifting their shirts are just gay. I agree with you though, live and let live!! Just let gay people live, we SHOULD end limitations placed on their lives. Stop with the special protections against their freedom! (I still don’t get the logic that says ending discrimination is a special protection when ending it would simply put gay people on par with straight people). Ever heard of Nguyen v. Immigration and Naturalization Service? The child of a US citizen and non- citizen was only a US citizens if the mother was the US citizen. If it was the male no dice. Know what that does? Protects the sexual exploits of men in foreign countries. How is that for sexuality in your face and protected by law. UpNorth- I doubt many straight people would serve under the conditions gay people do. They wouldn’t be allowed to have their partners notified if they die while deployed. They would not receive the medical benefits for their partners and children. Upon return from deployment they would have to pretend their wife was only a friend. It seems most of these arguments completely disregard the actual implementation of the policy one ones daily life. In the end gay servicemembers… Read more »
AWESOME THREAD!
Jen, your analogies are making my brain hurt. Since you are soooo very smart; please tell me what the definition of discrimination is? I’ll give you the legal version: Based on gender, race, ethnic origins, etc.; correct? Well, why was I legally discriminated against based on my gender and skin color? If we are to be equal, then we have to be treated equal. Affirmative action and reverse discrimination makes that impossible and in many cases widens the divide. You can come in here with all your little cherry picked examples based on what you think the law should be, but that’s not reality, that’s something for your social engineering class. As for special protections against their freedom?? Where the fuck do you come up with that? If they weren’t required to reveal if they are gay, would anyone know, based on a piece of paper? When going for a job, shouldn’t the applicant be considered based on experience and work ethic, instead of whether they are a member of a certain protected class? Yet, if 2 people were going for the same job, both having identical experience, background, etc., yet one is a member of a certain protected class; they get the job because of affirmative action, not anything in the interview. Is that equal? Nope. Actual occurence: A person had a higher GPA than two other people in the graduating class. The director of a higher level program in the school approaches the two lower GPA graduates after graduation and talks to them about going on to the higher program. The higher GPA graduate happened to be standing with the other two when this takes place. The program director tells them they can start the next semester and looks straight in the eye of the higher GPA graduate and says “if you want to attend, you have a 2 year wait”, based on the fact of gender and skin color, due to federal law. That was me and it was the second time I was told that. I, also, was excluded from many scholarships and grants, being awarded… Read more »