IVAW news
I had a voice mail message this morning which reported that, to their credit, Carl Webb of the IVAW’s terrorist wing has finally been booted out of IVAW. I haven’t got any confirmation, yet, but I noticed his profile is gone.
In yesterday’s IVAW post, I reprinted Brandon Neely’s letter to IVAW asking them to put pressure on the board to remove Carl Webb. In that letter, Neely also mentioned Matthis Chiroux as a reason he quit the organization. Since we’re fair and balanced here at TAH (snicker), here’s Chiroux’ email to Neely in response;
You are so far out of reality. Your continued libelous and misleading statements serve only to alienate you. Rape is a pilar of war, and while I’m not guilty of it, our military is one million times over. I listened to an 18 year old Iraqi girl last weekend testify about her experience being systematically raped by U.S. Soldiers while detained in Baghdad along with the rest of the young women on her cell block. I highly doubt this was in isolated incident. I hope her story gets out, for her sake and for yours.
Of course, as is his method of operation, Chiroux changes the subject from his own malfeasance to something totally unrelated, unsubstantiated and unsupported by facts. Of course, Chiroux can’t speak to the facts of our mission in Iraq since he’s never been there.
Most of us would tend to give our troops the benefit of the doubt when it comes to testimony against them that’s not given in a court of law, but not Matthis because he’s experienced the nature of war fourth-hand. He knows the awful truth about our occupation of Germany for the last sixty years or so.
Expect more on this later as it develops.
Oh, and Carl, since we know you’ll be here later in the day when you wake up, please don’t get your tears and snot all over everything, OK?
Category: Antiwar crowd, Iraq Veterans Against the War, Phony soldiers, Usual Suspects
Let’s get Carl to do a guest blog. Now THAT would be a good time!
I can’t wait to see the reasoning IVAW puts forward for the dismissal.
I am glad we all agree that rape is wrong. How refreshing. I am also glad that we agree that claims of rape should be heard in a court.
I look forward to all of us making sure our servicemembers are either exonerated or found guilty of any rapes that were committed by US servicemembers against Iraqis.
lets hope she issues really do see their day in court.
They won’t, because Matthis is talking out his ass again. Prove me wrong Matthis, let’s hear the names and dates.
Didn’t Kuwait use a bunch of girls to make what later turned out to be false accusations of rape and pillage straight to Congress in the lead up to Desert Shield? Point is that accusations of rape are time tested as a tool to further political agendas. While it does obviously happen, particularly against our own female soldiers by males, “one million times over” in the context of US troops against foreign nationals is way over the top, invalid, insulting and I remain skeptical with any account that Chiroux sinks his teeth into as fact based on his proven lack of integrity or honor. If Chiroux truly believed these girls, he would find out the dates and location of these alleged incidents, and contact IG to look into it. But alas, the results of any investigation will never satisfy his political agenda and personal ego.
Jen, wtf?? Were you born stupid, or did you just grow into it? Your pre-conceived idiocy on what makes military people tick is mind numbing in its capacity.
When did you ever come to the conclusion that we thought rape was ok??? The reason I ask is your statement above “I am glad we all agree that rape is wrong. How refreshing”
What would be refreshing is if you pulled your head out of your ass and looked at the real world.
I would like to get some more info about the rape “testimony”. Was Matthis in another country last week? Was this testimony in a US court? Who paid for this rape victim’s trip to the US?
The masterminds at IVAW did not removed Webb because of his code of conduct violations. Webb was removed from the organization to stop the flow of resignations.
Why do I believe this? Because Selena Coppa (Army Sergeant) posted a comment last night on her facebook that read “I agree, I just hope this stems the tide of resignations.” This kind of made me think, did the board vote Webb out because of violations or was it because the organization was losing to many members? And why was Casey J Porter banned from the organization for life during the same vote? Was it because Casey J Porter started a movement pushing for members to resign?
IVAW doesn’t give a shit about the wars. Their latest actions have to do with “military sexual trauma” and gay rights. They’re just a bunch of silly hippies using their dubious status as “Iraq veterans” to lend their unrelated causes an air of legitimacy.
Hey Jeff, hope you enjoyed that quote from my facebook, because it’s the last one you’re going to get. My personal commentary on my facebook was not IVAW’s statement, and I have no idea why the individual board members voted the way they did. I just personally happened to hate seeing resignations of people I respected over Carl Webb.
AS: I’m still waiting on you to keep your word.
I said I would quit IF a certain Texas member was kicked out and Carl Webb remained. This hasn’t been the case.
Yeah, I guess that the sainted Geoff Millard’s amplified threatening phone call to the individual and the fact that the Board wrote him a letter of reprimand before they even considered dismissing Webb doesn’t count, does it?
The fact that what he wrote on the IVAW website was nothing compared to what Webb wrote last year about IVAW being a bunch of pussies because they wouldn’t support al Qaeda’s right to kill our troops. Oh, and that Webb treatise was up for months – heck, it may still be on the website – I haven’t looked for it in awhile, but I have a screen capture somewhere.
That’s cool, AS, you keep living the fantasy and seeing only what you want. You’ve been kicked in the teeth by the “organization” before, so I guess if that’s what you want, it’s your call.
I must have missed something. IVAW banned a former member “for life” but merely kicked out Carl Webb? That seems vindictive, unprofessional,inferiority complex, and moonbatty in its own right.
You didn’t miss anything, Bob. SSDD.
Assmonkeys the lot of them, and Matthis is such a queen
Jonn, just in case you misplaced that screen capture go to http://ivaw.org/membersspeak/iraqis-and-afghans-right-fight-self-determination
Alas, I get:
Forbidden
You don’t have permission to access /index.php on this server.
——————————————————————————–
Apache/2.2 Server at ivaw.org Port 80
Oh well, Webb speaks, and the average IQ goes down yet again.
I rape my hand several times a day. lol Ok, that was a bit messed up. But rape is serious, no one is saying otherwise. But it has been used time and time again to get someone in trouble or push an agenda.
Oh gosh Old Trooper, I guess I am just an idiot (and a veteran too, odd that you would assume I am not…)
I must have become confused; in regards to Matthis many people have taken up the feminist theory that sex with a trafficked woman who is being prostituted against her will is rape, and that one’s admittance to this act (while not calling it rape) is grounds for calling him a rapist, BUT a woman claiming she was raped is in no way grounds for saying a rape could have happened.(I am not commenting on the veracity of either example but just that there seems to be a different standard for evaluation)
More so, anything Matthis did is committed by hundreds of servicemembers each year, but I don’t see any wide spread call for saying they are rapists, only Matthis. This leads me to think its about a dislike for Matthis, and not rape.
Maybe I have just missed the investigations into servicemembers sex with trafficked prostitutes because my head was in my ass. (Where are my keys….there they are!)
I don’t think anyone here is pro-rape, but our anti-rape views tend to wilt when it comes to accountability of rapists or lessening instances of it.
Maybe you are just unable to see my friendly jab at Jonn, and if you did I wonder where your head is….
Then again, if this is the same Jen, you also found it humorous, and an acceptible form of satire, to accuse Glenn Beck of rape, no?
So your basic problem is calling Matthis a rapist, which numerous IVAW refugees have done here, and not using the blanket statement of “rapists” every time we discuss military members? That logic of the argument escapes me.
Yes it is I, and you still owe me a beer. And it was Republican’s for Rape, not Beck. Or was it Beck too, I forget. We could have a long conversation on satire, but either way what we are refering to here is not based in satire.
I have no problem considering what Matthis did was rape, but I generally call him a rapist for the same reason you are unwilling to hands down say any servicemember in Baghram raped the Iraqi woman that was quoted by Matthis. That is what I am commenting on, the rush to call one rape and the hesitance for the other when all we have is statements claiming rape (or in his Matthis’s case describing rape).
I have agreed that what he did was rape, but I will concede our society teaches young men it is not and so high conviction rates may not be justice. I’d prefer education first.
That should say:
I have no problem considering what Matthis did was rape, but I generally don’t call him a rapist for the same reason you are unwilling to hands down say any servicemember in Baghram raped the Iraqi woman that was quoted by Matthis.
In Matthis’ own words;
We had defiled a beautiful act of creation and intimacy without ever having taken any responsibility for ourselves. I felt as though I had raped her.
Baghram…Iraqi woman.
Dude, what the hell are you talking about? Bagram is in Astan. And all we have from the “Iraqi woman” is an email from Matthis about it. But you’re right. They are all guilty. When a woman declares rape, and it turns out to be bullshit, the person most hurt by that is the person falsely identified, like the Duke guys. But a damn close second is the next woman who is actually raped and has to deal with people wondering if she also made it up. So, I tend to be a bit discerning over allegations when we don’t have any facts.
“Maybe I have just missed the investigations into servicemembers sex with trafficked prostitutes because my head was in my ass”
Based on a search using a search engine on that there intertubes, yes in fact it is.
It’s Baghdad, you have the same info I do via the post. You know law school is a brain fryer.
Um, where did I say they are all guilty?
The only person who has been assigned guilt is Matthis. My point is rape should be investigated and that it seemed like a double standard was being used where one was guily and the other was put off as false. Shouldn’t the outcome be the same? Either both be false or both be labeled rape? I made no move to claim which it should be.
You said you “tend to be a bit discerning over allegations when we don’t have any facts” but testimony can be a fact. We don’t know if it is true, which is why I initailly said I agree with Jonn and hope there would be an investigation. Jonn said he didn’t belive testimony not given in the court of law, I was just hoping it would have the chance to given there.
I don’t think we should argue if false criminal allegations are worse than actully being a violent crime victim. They both suck.
BNG, some links?
I agree Jonn, I would say feeling like it denotes a high probability that you are, and at the very least provides some reason to consider it a crime.
I wish everyone who did so would just admit it, but back here in reality….
Yeah, so we have an admission of intercourse against a girl’s wishes, and a third person anecdote sent via email, with numerous individuals all unnamed. You seriously think one is the same as the other?
Discerning the differences in cases is the first thing you learn in Torts. So I just have to assume that you are being intentionally obtuse in this regard. I don’t think you are stupid, so I can come to no other possible opinion.
Wait a second…”Rape is a pillar of war?” Is he fucking serious??
Honest to God,how the hell can anyone believe anything this idiot says? Let alone support an organization long gone into the shit burning pit?.
AS, you are really reaching for something that isn’t there. Go find a better place to be anti-war. As we have said of The Pied Piper, you are who you associate with. Why stay and try to save these losers from themselves? Seriously. Save yourself.
Defend, been trying that very line of reasoning for 2 years now. I honestly hope you do better than I did.
If Matthis said it was raining out, I would give the validity of that statement only 49% chance of conforming to reality. He has zero credibility. Which is why I want him to name names here. Because I firmly believe he is talking ridiculous shit again. I am not impuning whoever this notional Iraqi woman is, what I am saying is that Matthis lies so damn much, how can anyone believe him if/when he tells the truth.
I am saying they both have the possibility of a rape having occured but neither have met the “in court” standard. Certianly they are not the same. It just made me snicker that Matthis’s statemente are facts in one instance and unfounded in the other.
I’d also like to know, with you 100%.
I am not saying I believe his story out of hand, just that it could be true as much as it could be lies.
She might have just been telling him about a past encounter with him (maybe it was in Astan!).
I don’t think we disagree, just have different goals. Guinness can unite anyone!
Who the hell takes Torts in the first semester, did you go to the John Edwards School of Law?
An admission against interest is the same as a third person heresay email to someone not connected?
Jen, there is one big difference between two instances. The first he implicates himself, the second is alleged hear say from an unnamed alleged victim.
Frankly I believe he is full of crap on both instances, but if he wants to attempt to explain a case of ED by hanging the “rapist” tag on himself I am going to get out of the way and let him.
I will however defend the soldiers that he paints with his broad brush of accusation.
Jen, is cash and a third person out of state check the same as well?
And yes, the analogy is apt.
In court neither statement (as is) would amount to much. His admission is “feeling as though”.
Dang you TSO and your law terms….
Your cash is being a John, not rapist (via the statement). I don’t feel as though it is a third party out of state check, but I don’t know too much about fancy DC checks.
I am going home, don’t take my silence as acceptance!
I was so proud of the John E. comment and you seem to have skimmed right by it… 🙁
From our old friend Wiki:
Declarations against interest are an exception to the rule on hearsay in which a person’s statement may be used, where generally the content of the statement is so prejudicial to the person making it that they would not have made the statement unless they believed the statement was true. The Federal Rules of evidence limit the bases of prejudices to the declarant to tort and criminal liability.
IE. He made the statements that he slept with the girl against her will etc etc etc.
In a court of law wouldn’t matter anyway, because it was in the Philipines, and I have no idea how their heresay law works, but come on Jen…You can do better that that.
That is just the admission of evidence, it still has to be proven against whatever laws are claimed to be crossed.
your point seems to depend on claims of actual rape.
I don’t think he used any words that would constitute a demonstrated lack of consent on her part or force on his. it would depend on the jurisdiction’s rape laws. and would need a rape claim on her part.
as a follow up: I wish!
I love that in your world, the two things are still equal. You’ve managed to argue me to a fatgued death. Congrats.
What exactly is Geoff Millard’s position in IVAW? Is he the chair of the board? He’s a fool , a joke , a fraud, etc