School shooting in Broward County
A nineteen-year-old discipline problem went into Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in Broward County, Florida yesterday armed with an AR-style rifle and several magazines of ammunition. According to witnesses, he pulled the fire alarm and opened fire as students headed for the exits, killing at least 17, including Aaron Feis, the football coach/security guard (pictured above), who, according to students, shielded potential victims from bullets with his own body. He leaves behind a wife and daughter.
The cowardly shooter then blended in with students as they exited the school and he was arrested a few blocks away.
His lawyer, Jim Lewis, says that the gunman owned the gun, according to Fox News. The gunman had previously been in a mental treatment facility, but somehow he was able to buy a firearm without popping hot on the NICS background check.
His adoptive mother, Lynda Cruz, died recently and he was living with another family;
“I know she had been having some issues with them, especially the older one. He was being a problem. I know he did have some issues and he may have been taking medication. (He) did have some kind of emotional or difficulties,” [Barbara] Kumbatovich told the newspaper. “(Lynda) kept a really close handle on both boys. They were not major issues, as far as I know, just things teenagers do like not coming home on time, maybe being disrespectful.”
From another Fox News link;
[The shooter] was also described as having an “obsessive interest in weapons,” according to the Miami Herald. One teacher said [the shooter] was banned from entering campus with a backpack, the newspaper reported.
“All he would talk about is guns, knives and hunting,” Joshua Charo, 16, a former classmate, told the Herald. “I can’t say I was shocked. From past experiences, he seemed like the kind of kid who would do something like this.”
Another unidentified student told WJXT-TV that “everyone predicted” the shooting.
“Honestly, a lot of people were saying it was gonna be him,” the unnamed student told the news station. He said kids joked around that the student would be the one to “shoot up the school.”
Of course, gun grabbers were quick to take advantage of the shooting to advance their gun control agenda, as if murder and bringing firearms in school property aren’t illegal already.
Republicans should pray for forgiveness, for not only their complacency and dereliction of duty, but in contrition for the men, women and children we continue to lay to rest because of senseless gun violence and the cowardly inaction from Congress.
— Bonnie WatsonColeman (@RepBonnie) February 14, 2018
Category: Crime
My heart goes out to the families of those who lost their lives in this tragedy.
And my contempt goes out to those who would politicize the event for their own gain. Bonnie Watson Coleman, you madame, are a fucking cunt.
Oh, trust me, it ain’t just her.
Senator Murphy (D-CT) couldn’t plant his face in front of a camera fast enough.
And CBS? Asking parents and kids how they’re feeling when bodies are still being removed from the school? Fuck you. Just fuck you.
would this be just too much:
“How do I feel?” (punches reporter in face three times) “Kinda like someone just sucker-punched me. Now, you understand.”
+1
Sometimes the red mist gets to me and that means I parse your post as:
“How do I feel?” (Grabs the parents/children of the reporter shoots them) “Kinda like you do right now.”
Then the mist recedes and I start worrying about where the line between rights and mental health is.
A very short talking head once tried to interview me about a neighborhood brush fire. This was after he said to his cameraman “dammit! I told you to have the asshole stand in that ditch” (se we would be the same height)
When directed, I stood in the dry ditch. After the first question, I stepped out of the ditch, loomed over the asshole, and said (as near as I can remember) “You are a sawed off little cocksucker.” And smiled.
Cameraman was -heaving- with suppressed laughter. Talking head was turning purple.
“Was that live? No? I guess I made your Christmas party blooper reel. Bye.”
Best
Interview
Ever
Someone said Sucker Punch?
Great movie.
It was an awesome movie and all of the basement dwelling, cheezy puff eating, zit faced keyboard warriors used their access to IMDB to trash it.
On a related note, I think most of the media, democrats, soros/bloomberg shills and mindless libtards should be repatriated to the old asylums.
Bonnie Watson Coleman didn’t blame the person that pulled the trigger. This dingle berry blamed others instead.
She ha to, it’s in the demonrat playbook!
You bet! she is the lowest form of scum,,,if any party is to blame its the dumocraps and every stinking politician that had a hand in taking prayer out of schools, the workplace and anywhere else, leaving kids with no higher power to answer to! She is part of the same trash that said “if it feels good do it!” Well this felt good to the dirty little bastard!
John 15:13 “Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.” Aaron Feis, was a football coach and also the school security officer. Even though he was unarmed, he still ran towards the gunfire and gave his life trying to protect others. RIP Sheepdog.
Why is the coach and security officer unarmed?
He would be far more effective against a rifle if he had a six shooter
This hits close to home as my 16 year old daughter is scheduled to play lacrossse against them
I want any school employees who wish to carry a firearm get some training and be allowed to have a concealed weapon at school
That is against the law now in Commiefornia. Moonbeam signed into law a bill barring school security officers from being armed.
I live in the epicenter of the Cesspool of Human Ignorance™, Sacramento, CA.
Ironically, we have an excellent Sheriff, I have my CCW and although it took 7 months (super high demand) and about $700 between course and background fees, I wasn’t required to be raped while being shot and my family tied to a train track to get it.
Our county is informally Shall Issue.
This is AMERICA and we have the 2nd amendment, god given, constitution recognized….imho ALL PEOPLE SHOULD BE ARMED AT ALL TIMES! To lay down your life like Sgt Cashe, that is heroic and honorable, but for a man like the coach to have to lay down his life unarmed because a bunch of vote gathering , shyt eating, worthless phucking politians are afraid we will find out what they have done and go after them! is OUTRAGEOUS!
Could have done even more good had he had a weapon and training to engage with it. Otherwise he threw his life away by presenting another larger target.
This such a heartbreak, children should not have to deal with this. This young man was very disturbed and slipped through a very broken system.
Once again my weapons stayed secured and out of reach of people who would do harm. They have nothing to do with this Bonnie Watson Coleman.
This is not a Republican or Democrat issue. We need to remember that there are victims of all political stripes that get killed or hurt in these tragic events. This is a uniquely American issue that happens far too often. Look my thinking is no matter what side your on. If your first thought is let’s take away the guns , or don’t take my guns. When something like this happens Then I think your priorities are seriously I need of rethinking. There will be time for politics and blame. This ain’t the time nor the place. Hopefully we can address the issue about how do we keep ppl safer. Than playing politics.
t’s not just American. The only difference is that the stupid libidiots continue to demand “gun free zones” that are a magnet to every moron with a gun that know they are a free fire zone…
School security officer was unarmed…
And why ???
Oh, it has to be a gun free zone.
The moron was a registered demonrat and sported an antifa and resist t-shirt with a raised fist to show that he was down with the struggle…
None, and I repeat, NONE of these people were NRA members and none of them were conservatives, they were all angry spoiled brat liberal crybabies, every last one of them…
And, other countries have their own versions, the Middle East has ISIS, France has Muslim terrorists as does the rest of Europe. Germany has rape klans made up of Middle Eastern thugs that roam in gangs and rape women, the only difference is that they don’t talk about it so very few people know about it.
Gun violence in Australia has gone up since they outlawed and confiscated all guns in their country and the people were stupid enough to let it happen.
Typically it is a liberal phenomenon and the home of liberals is in where ??? The democrat party…
“School security officer was unarmed…”.
Let that sink in. “Security” officer, ready to dispense terse language. Not much “security” in the end.
Good grief, man. You replied to a post about not making it political by ranting about how evil liberals are.
The dead and the their loved ones surely fall across all party lines – we owe it to them to debate ways to better protect our kids, not rant about the ‘other side’… who, coincidentally, want the same damn thing.
I have to respectfully disagree.
One sub-set of folks wants to take away rights. No matter what happens, the answer is “further restrict the lawful, and make more helpless the innocent”.
A further subset of those folks are misguided and foolish, engaging in magical thinking.
Another parallel subset know darn well what they are doing, and dance in the blood of innocents to do so.
I do -not- agree to remain silent when the ghouls dance in the blood of innocents. Nor am I any longer willing to pretend they are anything but willful.
And expressing the notion that the vast majority of gun owners use theirs responsibly and taking away their rights is a bad thing is perfectly reasonable.
However, ranting about ‘stupid libidiots’ and claiming the guy was a ‘demonrat’, and that all ‘these people’ (note: I’m not sure who Thunderstixx is talking about here – victims? pundits?) are all ‘angry spoiled brat liberal crybabies’ is making this political. That’s what I object to.
And the more and more we say ‘they’ and try to pigeonhole a huge set of Americans as one single thing -willfully dancing in the blood of innocents, say?-, we’re not helping. Argue issues, not politics.
You want people to have the right to own guns. Guess what? I’m considered a pinko liberal commie here, and so do I. How does it help to turn this into an us-vs-them as opposed to, “Hey, here’s why I think doing X will help protect our kids..”?
(This applies equally to those on the Left pointing out the shooter wore a MAGA hat, as if finding a way to blame the President actually gets us any closer to a solution.)
“…ranting about ‘stupid libidiots’ and claiming the guy was a ‘demonrat’, and that all ‘these people’ (note: I’m not sure who Thunderstixx is talking about here – victims? pundits?) are all ‘angry spoiled brat liberal crybabies’ is making this political.”
Correctly identifying someone and labeling them appropriately is NOT “making this political.” It is the action of the one being inappropriately political who made it political. Those of us screaming “Enough of this nonsense” are not the problem. The problem is the problem.
And, LC? Your inability to determine just who “these people” are to which Thunderstixx refers undermines your case. Perhaps it would help you out to simply take the words he wrote and apply them to everyone who acts that way. It’s pretty clear to me that he is calling out the angry spoiled brats. As he said he was.
With regards to ‘these people’, I was being generous – it seems he was referring to the shooter, whom he claimed was a ‘registered democrat’ (no proof, InfoWars’ information was wrong), sported an Antifa shirt (nope, different guy, at least in the photo that’s circulating), and a resist t-shirt (haven’t seen that one, so I can’t comment). The implication being that ‘these people’ refers to Democrats / liberals. Never mind the fact that the latest report has him a member of a white nationalist party, and his instagram apparently had him wearing a MAGA hat. The reality is, this guy didn’t shoot up the place because of his politics, it’s because he’s pretty fuckin’ unwell, I imagine.
And yes, correctly labeling someone has some worth, but a) it’s often done incorrectly, and b) it’s also sometimes a negative. People get caught up in labels as opposed to ideas. If you’re a liberal who feels the countless numbers of responsible gun owners shouldn’t be punished for this, are you a ‘Demorat’ or a ‘libidiot’? If you argue that oh, no, that doesn’t refer to good Democrats / liberals who support the 2A, then why say it in the first place? And if it does apply, then again, how does using stupid names for half the goddamn country help get us to a point where people can entertain trying various notions, like arming teachers, better mental health checks, etc?
As soon as you pull out the labels, discussion becomes impossible with half the country, and unsurprisingly, you need at least a part of that half to make any headway.
I, for one, hardly think that half the country qualifies for the label “libidiot.” I don’t use the term, and had trouble spelling it just then.
I don’t even think that half the country is Democrat. I do believe that about half the country is somewhere right of center toward the conservative side, but many/most of those folks don’t even know that they are conservative; the term has been so demonized by lefties that they don’t want the label.
I do think that the last presidential election supports my opinion – plenty of folks know that things are broken, out of balance, moving in the wrong directon and that continuing to elect the same power brokers into office will continue to produce negative results for this country. That is not even a partisan position in my view.
I appreciate that you not only don’t use the term ‘libidiot’, but that you also wouldn’t apply that term to anyone slightly left of center even if you did. And, lest someone pounce on this as me being overly sensitive, it’s a practical matter – I’m equally against calling all conservatives racist, or sexist, or making up stupid names for President Trump. I just find the name-calling so counter-productive – it reinforces a less-than-human view of our fellow countrymen, and basically renders any discussion impossible.
As for the country’s demographics, I guess I was just going by election results. The real number is, of course, a bit of an unknown. I will say, though, that while ‘conservative’ is demonized, so is ‘liberal’. If I could dream for a brief moment, I’d love for us to get past that and vote on issues, not parties / ideologies.
That said, I think you’re half right and half wrong on the last presidential election – half right because, clearly, there are lots of people feeling things are broken, and since most of the times the politicians are the root cause of that, having a non-politician is indeed a rallying point. The reason I think you’re half wrong is that this election was so close that it’s hard to draw a conclusive narrative from it. Had it been held a week earlier or a week later, the results could easily have been different. I’ll be more inclined to agree with you if incumbents start getting voted out with great regularity, but we’ll have to wait and see if that happens.
Just one opinion here, but I will always believe that we will solve none of our problems until we figure out how to spend much more time finding and celebrating those things upon which we agree instead of the inordinate amount of time currently spent focused on our differences. Put another way – balance is good, in all things. So is gratitude.
LC,
The corpses were not yet cold and the blood dancing ghouls and magical thinkers were already flinging poo at folks like me.
-that- is why I am about out of tolerance and understanding for the blood-dancing ghouls and magical thinking fools.
Ignoring them has not helped. Tolerating them has not helped. Now, it’s shame them time, by properly labeling them.
I hear you, and the blood-dancing ghouls and magical thinkers on the right were doing the same with people on the Left.
Is it better to stoop to their level and accomplish nothing but stoke additional anger or, you know, be better than that, understand that both sides are seeking solutions to the same problem, and seek some sort of path forward?
I know the first is easier, but it sure as hell ain’t better.
Care to give an example of one of those “blood-dancing ghouls on the right”? And no, the above comments here at TAH do NOT qualify – those were reactions to some on the left using a tragedy as a political prop.
You might be able to find some White Supremacist Nutjob who’d celebrate this event; dunno, I haven’t tried. But I doubt that you’ll find anyone on the political right using this as an argument in support of less gun control. In contrast, many on the political left are indeed using this tragedy as a political prop – before the bodies are even cold, in some cases – vice placing blame where it belongs: on the shoulders of the low-life (and possibly mentally disturbed) bastard who chose a firearm as his tool for revenge on those who “slighted” him in the past.
Have long argued that white supremacists aren’t even on the right. They are so extreme that they wrap around behind sane folks and join up somewhere in the back with lefty extremists (like anarchists and whatsnutsmatter) to form their own category separate and apart from the continuum of left to right we see in the front.
Well, it seems we’ve got a few different definitions going on here. You say I might be able to find some nutjob on the right celebrating this event, but who on the Left is celebrating this? Nobody, because left or right, people just want to see their kids safe. No sane people are celebrating this.
And I’m not sure why comments from people here pushing an agenda -especially that he’s a liberal!- suddenly don’t ‘count’ as people on the right pushing an agenda in the wake of a tragedy. If people on the Left start talking about how he’s a conservative -and some are!- that counts, so why doesn’t the mirror image also count?
People are mourning dead kids; they want a solution. Because, yes, the blame rests on this kid… and when it happens again, it’ll rest on that kid, and then the next one, and the next one. At some point we need to stop the politics and start trying new ideas. It’s not a ‘solvable’ problem, but it’s probably something we can improve upon.
That whakadoodle was an -adult-. Nineteen is not a “kid”.
-this- is why some of us are not in a collegial mood for conversations with the Left.
Not. A. Kid.
Adult.
That sort of distortion is part of the problem. Th Left assuming that bad actors are somehow not responsible for their actions, or “just kids”.
You do now realize what you were doing, right? It wasn’t deliberate, right? But they have you dancing to that tune, I presume you were unaware.
“Every town for gun safety”, ban the guns by a more accurate name, lists eighteen “school shootings” in 2018.
Bull. Shit.
https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/no-there-havent-been-18-school-shootings-this-year-not-even-close/
Lies, damn lies, and bogus statistics. And the answer is always “ Liberty is bad. Turn them in. -you- folks need restraints.” Nihilism and helplessness are never questioned as breeding grounds for massacres.
Get folks in your general neighborhood to knock of that distorting/lying bullshit, and maybe we can talk.
-you- are too smart to be a stalking-horse for the Ghouls.
Not. A. Kid. At. -nineteen-.
Relax, I know he’s not a ‘kid’ and thus not responsible for his actions. I didn’t mean ‘kid’ any more literally than people who call President Trump a ‘cheeto’ mean he’s literally a snack. I call people ‘kids’ when they’re much younger than I am – that even goes up quite a bit higher than 18.
Yes, the guy was an adult, and yes, he’s responsible for his actions. And yes, I also agree with you that people distort gun statistics all the damn time, and I’ll even grant you that the most ridiculous distortions happen from far Left organizations.
My point is simply that people need to move past intractable positions so we can try something and learn from it. Banning guns wouldn’t stop the problem, though making them much harder to get might make it less common. Hell, making ‘big, scary black guns’ bright pink could help – it reduces the ‘cool’ factor, yet doesn’t change how the gun actually works one bit. Would that help? Maybe, I don’t know. And yes, putting armed guards in schools might help, though I’ve read somewhere this school had an armed guard – and, naturally, unless they’re in the right place at the right time, they don’t help all that much. And if too many people are armed, and aren’t adequately trained, once one defender starts shooting back, the lack of training on behalf of others might make them targets of fellow defenders. There are pros and cons to every idea put forward, but because each side remains convinced that they’re right, absent any conclusive evidence, .. we don’t do shit.
And people want shit done.
“…sported an antifa and resist t-shirt with a raised fist to show that he was down with the struggle…”
I know the picture you’re talking about, and it’s not shooter.
The moron was a registered demonrat
No, he wasn’t.
That is a different Cruz that was reported as being a Democrat.
A major part of the problem is students are being taught by their indoctrinators not to view people who disagree with them as people with differing opinions, but as enemies that need to be destroyed.
Bullshyt, this IS THE TIME to decide , these stinking rotten to the core politicians that have taken prayer out of schools, the workplace, and especially history (Bible Study) out of school need to be removed from office, by force if necessary! Kids have no knowledge of Almighty God and his desire to give them a good life and give them leadership that DOES NOT include murder, theft, lying….all things these worm politicians do not want to hear about!
As I told my extremely left wing daughter last night – what is needed is an honest investigation into what the root causes are. The Clinton and Australian bans did not work, so those are probably not effective. Is it entertainment desensitization? Lack of safety training? Gun-free zones? School bullying?
The 24-7 publicity the shooters get? Should HIPAA be modified to make the background check system work better? No one knows, because all the participants are pushing partisan agendas, not trying to find real causes and solutions.
I have two things to say about this shooting and the others: First, in nearly all cases, those who knew the shooter expected him to deal death. Second, at this late stage, any school that does not have armed security on its premises has dirty hands.
The school system should be sued out of existence for not allowing armed guards for student safety…
I beleive they are protected by civil penalty limits
Except for the fact that there were two armed guards there.
The FBI knew about this guy, apparently. He made a video bragging that he was going to be a “school shooter”, now we find out he’d been in a mental facility and he still had access to firearms, and was still in possession of at least one? The guy who shot the video that Cruz made called the Feebs on him!!!!
It’s not a failure of the laws already in place, it’s a failure of people to do the jobs they’re hired to do.
Amen!
When are they going to wise up and start letting the teachers conceal carry? I would suggest that any teacher that wants to should be allowed to conceal carry! Of course, there should be mandatory qualification and mandatory range time at least once a month. I can’t say this would have prevented this terrible tragedy, but at least it would have given them a chance to defend themselves? Remember, when seconds count, the police are minutes away! What do you folks thing about this?
Agree 1200%………
I would also include armed, uniformed security staff to the mix. Their very presence would be a deterrent to these melt-downs, who are insane but not stupid.
Concur, AW1Ed.
From my perspective, an additional deterrent to all of the would-be copycat school shooters out there who are now watching and taking notes in the aftermath would be when one of those armed, uniformed security staff members puts a .45 ACP 230gr jacketed hollow point Hydra-Shok round right between the eyes of the next melt-down who is observed approaching a school with a weapon.
No killing of innocents, no infamy, no media attention, no name in the news. Just insane, malfunctioning melt-down brain matter, blood, and skull fragments sprayed on the sidewalk that the school janitor can then hose off into the grass when the police are done with it.
Hanging the perpetrator from a scaffold in the town square would get the attention of a lot of scumbag wannabees! Also remove the scumbags name from all records, school records, all id. let his name and existance be striken from existance, hard to make yourself a hero or martyr if no one even knows you existed! imho starting with the newspapers and media!!!
Uniformed Security is nice , but teachers should be allowed to carry, as long as they are licensed and get some specialized training . And continuous training . Any uniform would likely be the first target . Just one good man / woman with a handgun could stop this crazy shit before it truly gets out of hand . Usually , any opposition causes the perp to off themselves . In this case , the perp tried to run off and hide like a little bitch . He needs to be put in the express lane for a ride in old sparky .
LRRP2-A few years ago there was a push in a college by students who were of age to carry concealed while in class. The local PD had a fire arms instructor come down to the College and those interested to try the program. A female student who wanted to do this was fitted with a holster on her waist which was put in a position where she could not reach it so when the drill started and the LEO came into the room as an active shooter, she lost a few seconds but got off a round which hit the officers arm. This was set up by the school/PD to fail. The student was familiar with fire arms and had a lot of range time under her belt. I believe those training rounds were used in this made to fail drill.
Okay, hang on just one second there.
Why are you NOT addressing things like a large enough closet or sideroom with a bulletproof door and glass for kids to get into it and hide from a shooter?
Why not have drills for safety, like we used to have fire drills in school? Has that gone down the drain?
I’m not interested in throwing the fear of what MIGHT happen into anyone under the age of 18, but things like this are necessary now, whether we like it or not.
Schools do have drills for this scenario, Ex. The common theme is ‘shelter in place’, and if need be, fight back. They don’t even advocate escape for those in classrooms on the ground floor with windows that open.
There are locks for doors, to be used in active shooter scenarios, just one shown here.
https://nightlock.com/classroom-workplace-emergency-lockdown/
Some school districts have gone there. Teachers with training (supplied) may carry in some schools.
I would not allow my child to attend a public school without a body guard. If the schools won’t provide armed guards then the parents should.
Get a chair and plant yourself on the public turf in front of the school. Right in front of the “gun free zone” sign. Do it legally. Get a lawyer to join you. See if that doesn’t catch on and make liberal heads explode.
With more than 90K public schools and a very small percentage suffering such incidents, I think a lot of schools balk at such an expenditure.
Of course, allowing permitted school personnel to carry would cost them nothing.
A couple of uniformed, as deterrant and primary defense.
A handful of staff, concealed arms, as terminal defense and surprise.
No budget? Start with group 2 and some coaching from the local sherrif’s department.
Custodian and a secretary/admin is a nice and discreet start. Or two others who are willing and able.
you’re preaching to the choir…tell them and the loony parents that will resist such measures.
Wilco
Almost any of the folks on this thread who own and use guns, could have stopped that twisted freak with an ordinary pocket pistol.
But guess which sort of person is ruthlessly excluded from ever being in a position to stop twisted killer freaks?
It is almost as if some folks don’t -want- to know how to solve the problem, because it might force them to re-evaluate their beliefs.
No more mindlessly naïve ‘Gun Free Zones’.
Enough is enough.
If Gun Control Laws were the answer, places like Chicago, LA, NJ and Mexico would be crime-free Utopias.
The ONLY thing that can stop a bad man with a gun, is a good man with a gun.
This is what happens when you dont allow the good guys to carry.
If a teacher or School security officer were allowed to be properly equipped, they could have dropped the freak before everything unfolded.
At the VERY least, they should have quick access to a TASER or DOC strength OC spray. Not a gun, but better than throwing chalk.
Yeh, except people walk away from that shyt unscathed! damned hard to walk away from a bullet in the head! Armed personnel don’t have to be advertized, we have a number of people in our church armed in case….I doubt 90% of parishioners know about or even thought about it….but its there, and you can bet your bippy, any attack won’t include exhorbiant numbers like 17 killed….just the scumbag….!!
The idea that government can “solve” this issue presupposes that the government doesn’t routinely do stuff like this:
“The Internal Revenue Service sent 23,994 tax refunds worth a combined $46,378,040 to “unauthorized” alien workers who all used the same address in Atlanta, Ga., in 2011, according to the Treasury Inspector General for Tax Administration (TIGTA”
Yeah. When it comes to the safety and welfare of myself and my family, thanks, but I’d just prefer to retain the means to do it myself. Particularly when the FBI is busy investigating Russian collusion links and playing CYA.
You got that right!!
“All he would talk about is guns, knives and hunting,”…
Me and friends and Family talk about this all the time too.Our whole lives as a matter of fact.
WTF does that have to do with murderous mental illness?
How many kids will turn 12 this year, get hunting licenses and shoot nobody at all? Of course, the MSM will never talk about that either.
My middle school had mandatory hunter safety/gun safety classes, 1 week taught by Idaho Fish & Game personnel. 1975. Included 25 .22 rounds fired in the gym. My high school was heavily armed, nearly every vehicle in the parking lot had a deer rifle and/or shotgun in it during hunting season, to include the teachers and staff. Never a shooting. Never would have been considered. We kicked each others asses behind the band room and settled it there.
I miss those days. I had a history teacher bring in his P08 for a WW1 lesson. We thought it was the coolest thing ever!!
) and fights are inevitable.
I really miss when boys settled their issues with just fists, and would often end up becoming friends. Anyone who would have pulled a weapon would have been instantly delared a cowardly pussy.
I think that the ‘zero tolerance’ to violence at school has made the problem exponentially worse.
Boys will always be boy(hopefully
Better to have fistfights than firefights.
Not a damned thing….only if he talked in a threatening manner…!
Multiple fucking assholes in this sad incident. First, the fucking nutless murdering cocksucker who did the shooting. I don’t care what issues he may have had. Fuck him straight to Hell. Second, there’s whoever the fat, lame, and lazy sacks of shit in the NICS pipeline may be who failed in their job and responsibility to file the goddamned paperwork that would have prevented him from obtaining a weapon through legal means. The system works just fine, if only those shitbags just do their motherfucking jobs!
Finally, there’s the leftist anti-gun lobby, who sure love them some appropriated martyrs. Except that this shit historically only became a thing after they got their way on other issues relating to education, discipline, and mental health (like making it nearly impossible for someone to be involuntarily committed even when they are obviously dangerous—go figure! ). Yet these fucking fascist hypocrites will blame anyone else for their own glaring failure. They’ll bleat about “the children,” the very same children who pay the price in so many ways, not limited to this one, for the predictable failure of the leftist agenda. They’ll wave that bloody shirt in our faces while ignoring the fact that it was perfectly clean until they put their hands on it.
By the way, I was a gun nerd in high school whose primary interests (besides naked girls) were shooting, hunting, and blowing stuff up. I started collecting firearms of my own at the age of 12. I started shooting at 8. To date, I have yet to murder anyone. I do possess several rifles that most likely have been utilized to take human life, all of them in three wars this country fought under democrat presidents. I don’t think it makes them any more “cool” to have been used for killing, I just enjoy shooting them and like them for their general historical value (I’m also a history nerd). Stop blaming this shit on the people who had nothing to do with it.
Fair winds and following seas, Mr. Feis.
No one’s going to fix this stuff. No one is going to change their minds about any of this.
Those who think taking all guns away will continue to think that’s the answer, those who think we have to act more quickly on mental illness and stop worrying about the guns themselves will also continue to think their way.
Meanwhile the continued stupidity of thinking that our children should be the center of the family instead of mom and dad at the center will continue to produce children who believe they are the center of the universe, not just their families. Those kids are being trained to believe they will always experience a positive outcome regardless of the effort they put in or their own personal ability. Those are not kids equipped to deal with a world that doesn’t much care whether or not they live or die.
Everyone I knew in my small Connecticut town brought a rifle to school during hunting season, the rifle was in their vehicle. No one stole those weapons, and no one shot anyone. Teachers would even show you their rifles and then we’d go hunting or fishing or whatever….no one got shot, not once.
Everyone also knew if you didn’t do your best at school you’d fail, if you mouthed off you might get popped upside your head and there were no trophies for second place because second place was the first loser.
Instead of worrying about everyone’s fucking self esteem perhaps we should once again start worrying about raising people to be responsible and accountable for their own personal actions.
Today everyone has “mitigating” factors…mommy didn’t hug them enough, they didn’t have money for a new bike for every kid at Christmas, their neighbors had a pool and they didn’t…bunch of entitled fucking whiners thinking murdering people is a solution for being an asshole and having to face the consequences.
Absolutely 100% right on
Amen.
I was thinking along very similar lines on my two hour commute to work today, VOV.
I truly feel that this is an insolvable problem, not because the proper steps could not be taken, but because we as American society have lost the ability to civilly debate, compromise, or even express ourselves in statements that exceed the 140-character Twitter limit.
We (as society) focus on the “things” because those are easy, knee jerk solutions. Take away guns, one side says. Mental health, the other says.
In the same vein, “things” are easy to target because they aren’t an indictment of the person. They shift blame from the person to the object. If you don’t own guns, it’s fairly easy to stomach taking away everyone else’s guns. If you haven’t had the nightmare of a family member or friend that struggles with mental health problems, it’s easy to just say “lock them all up.”
Don’t get me wrong. The blame for this incident lies solely with the shooter. But when you ask, what caused this? It’s not guns. It’s not mental health stigmas.
It’s shitty parenting and a shitty society that abhors personal responsibility. Parents either choose not to or aren’t allowed to discipline their children. Meaningful interaction between kids has been replaced with staring at a fucking screen. I can only imagine what bullying is like when virtually everything nowadays “goes viral”.
As for personal responsibility, this is prime example. There’s failure everywhere in this case, where rules were in place yet an identified troubled person was allowed to have a firearm. Yet, will heads roll? Will the people who bore either direct or supervisory responsibility be fired, sued, or held criminally liable?
Fuck nope. We’ll continue to Tweet our blame onto things instead.
Wow, there’s a lot here to think about, so I’ll get straight to the important stuff.
Mental illness is a real thing, and it is completely different from kids that are mad cause mommy didn’t hug them enough. Just like there are millions of gun owners (many of them teenagers) who never kill anyone, there are millions of depressed, sad, and maladjusted kids who’s parents ignore them that never kill anyone. There is a huge difference between schizophrenia or bipolar disorder and being mad at mommy.
this kid could have been schizophrenic, delusional, manic, or any number of things. He might just have been born an asshole that got meaner every time a parent died or a caregiver abondoned him. It doesn’t really matter.
What matters is that this kid should never have had access to a gun in the first place, and once he got one he should have never been allowed near- much less in- in a school. For Christ sake, he escaped by blending on with the evacuating kids, many of whom say they always expected him to shoot up the school!!
The people close to him knew he was dangerous, and no one did anything about it- in fact, they supported his interest in guns and didn’t prevent his access to them.
The schools security procedures are obviously lacking, but the fact is that physical security is your last line of defense. Personnel security is the first and most effective layer. Hoping that an armed security guard, cop, or teacher sees the shooter before they do ‘too much’ harm is a pretty bad method.
im all for keeping crazy and evil people with guns out of schools, and I am totally supportive of having a trained and ready good guy with a gun in the school, but I think the first step is to keep guns out of the hands of the evil and crazy in the first place
One quibble: not a kid. Nineteen years old.
We have to stop playing along with the Left’s assertion that adults are children subject to bad influences, versus people who -decide- to do evil and/or stupid.
Like college age students, for example. Not “kids”. Require adult behavior, reward it and sanction its absence, and wowserz they actually act like adults.
The Left is insidious in poisoning the conversation, by dumbing down terms to those compatible with their objectives.
So in this case it is essential:
Shooter is Not a kid. Adult.
Understand your point, but the fact is the human brain continues to develop into the mid-20s, and while legally an adult this kid was clearly not mentally healthy.
In particular, the areas that govern emotional maturity, self-image and judgement don’t fully develop until 25. MIT calls it the ‘executive suite of the brain’.
Now imagine what’s going on in there if the human in question is schizophrenic.
Rental car companies have figured this out- they place restrictions and extra fees on renters under 25 if they rent to them at all.
http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-24173194
Would he have been more mentally stable had he been 35? Who knows, and why should any of us care?
He committed heinous crimes. Things which could have mitigated the situation were either not implemented or ignored. Plenty of blame to go around for those ho could have dealt with it before it got this bad, but ultimately the criminality is squarely on the shoulders of the one who committed the crime, be he 9, 19, or 99.
I doubt it- you don’t really cure schizophrenia or bi-polar disorder, you just treat it. He might have been less dangerous, but who knows (well, aside from everyone that knew him).
I’m not arguing his guilt or innocence- it doesn’t really matter to the dead. He’s in custody, and he will be in custody for the rest of his life, however long that may be.
This was not a typical kid that made a bad decision, nor even an ‘evil’ person. This kid was a danger to himself and others, had been for years, and everyone around him knew it- some of them even tried to do something about it. Clearly, he should not have had access to a gun.
Yet, he was able to purchase one legally, and the idiots that lived with him didn’t do enough to keep it away from him.
On top of that, we just learned today that the FBI failed to follow up on reports that he planned some sort of shooting, and that the sheriff was at his house multiple times.
How do we prevent this from happening again? Are we going to depend entirely on a good guy with a gun being in the right place at the right time, or are we going to do the common sense things that would keep a gun out of the hands of a kid like this in the first place?
Homicide bombers blow people up, the lib’s blame the bomber but not the explosives, terr drives a vehicle and kills people, the lib’s blame the driver but not the vehicle, a person opens fire on people and the lib’s blame the firearm/NRA but not the shooter. When this shit comes up by my lib friends pool side, I’ll bring up last weeks I-95 incident down here in Palm Beach County Fl. and ask them to turn in their cars and use local transportation.
Hey, 1. Folk told authorities (who did nothing) about him, and 2. He was in the nuthouse (but properly put on the no-gun list) so allowed to buy his gat… and left/libtards want to blame evil guns.
“not properly” I mean, dang typos
When illegals kill Americans, demshits are all about constitutional rights about how they can’t be removed from the country, but shit like this suddenly it’s time to remove American civil rights because….
Fuck a liberal.
I saw some screenshots of his Facebook yesterday that showed he was part of a few Islamic Facebook groups, is it possible that he was radicalized?
I mean he wasn’t exactly stable to start with.
From what I read, it seemed he mocked Islamic groups:
https://heavy.com/news/2018/02/nicolas-nikolas-nick-cruz-florida-school-shooter-gunman-instagram/
Early information is always uncertain, but it seems most likely he was just a disturbed asshole.
“he was just a disturbed asshole.”
Perfect for his headstone.
Perfect for his -urinal-.
Fixed it for you.
Take the little bastard out to the swamp, zip-tie his hands and feet, and toss his ass in the water. The gators will handle the rest. That’s the advantage of being in Florida.
I approve. It’s economically sound, and ecologically friendly.
And if the gators don’t get him, the wild hogs will!
The school is a Gun-Free Zone thus the little shit knew he had a shooting gallery full of unarmed victims.
He was already prevented by law from owning or possessing firearms BUT did the system work? NOPE.
Liberals call for more restrictions on gun ownership which is akin to taking car ownership away from sober drivers because of drunk ones.
The NICS system would work just fine if they did their fucking jobs. Everyone who failed to report the asshole should go down as an accessory at the very least.
Would that stop him from a black market buy? Of course not, but at least it would have closed off one option and possibly put him on somebody’s radar as a prohibited individual trying to get his hands on a weapon.
The NICS system doesn’t make reporting of Psychological conditions by practitioners mandatory. It is voluntary and many states simply don’t report effectively.
How to fix that and what qualifies as a mental disorder of sufficient magnitude to report is not clear, so since reporting by the states is voluntary, many simply opt out to avoid repercussions.
Statements were made that he had been confined for mental health reasons. Assuming correct, if involuntary, I believe that is report-required, right?
If voluntary, is it still required report?
As far as I know state reporting to NICS is voluntary, period….it is asked of the applicant on the application, but if he lies and that state didn’t report it, he’ll pop clean.
I had a list somewhere of states that say they voluntarily report to NICS (State mandate to practitioners) …there was only a few on it and I never did find out precisely what they’re reporting criteria was, but apparently since I haven’t seen anyone complimenting any one state on its effective reporting to NICS, I doubt even those states are reporting consistently or have clear guidelines.
Oh, just great. So the only ones who will be consistently reported will be veterans. Looking forward to the meme about how more likely veterans are to blah, blah, blah now that they will become the most accurately reported group in the country. Just ducky.
Unfortunately, such obscure laws are a breeding ground for lawsuits. That’s one reason that practitioners aren’t going to say shit unless a law exists that will protect them when they do so.
And there we have the real issue that no one wants to talk about – because it is so hard to define.
Say someone has some mild depression issues (like most everyone), and they seek counseling. Do we place them on NICS because of that? (hopefully “NO”, although Bloomberg would)
The mental issues factors are not clearly delineated, and even then do we punish 1,000 people because 1 person may cause harm to someone?
Hopefully not.
The boy was reported to the FBI. Had he committed a crime yet, or talked about it? Do we want to start punishing folks who might do something wrong, who may commit a crime?
Again, hopefully not – not in America.
So – what are we faced with?
A world where, in order to enjoy the freedoms we do have, we have to risk some danger to ourselves and our loved ones.
I personally believe that history has shown that arming responsible adults (or more accurately, not disarming them) will provide a better level of protection while maintaining our freedoms.
Perhaps there is room for debate on the mental health issues – but we have to be very cautious. The anti-gun fanatics would be very glad to argue for “reasonable, common-sense” expansions on what counts as a mental-health DQ.
Blaming the NRA for school shootings is like blaming MADD for drunk drivers.
…dancing in the blood of innocents. Typical, predictable, and disgusting.
“Revoltingly shallow little shits they are” as Yoda would say.
Fear leads to anger.
Anger leads to hatred.
Hatred leads to progressivism.
Progressivism leads to -suffering-
For you Yoda, fixed it I have.
Has Richard “the dick” Blumenthal chimed in yet?
Fuck him, too.
With a rusty metal fence post.
wrapped in old barbed wire dipped in bull Shiite.
But what if we learn he likes it?
There’s always the chainsaw.
Only if it’s under-barrel mounted on an AR-15
FUCK HIM up the ass sideways with ten tons of rusty tangled barbed wire wrapped in asbestos soaked in diarrhea and Nuclear Waste.
I am confused. I know that you can retro your weapon left or right handed if needed.
However, I did not know that you can label a tragic and horrific mass murder, committed by a well armed and known loon, the fault of Republicans, Conservatives or the NRA.
I blame the citizens who had knowledge of this loon and or the local LEO’s who failed to act based on previous complaints and the loon’s expansive and digital footprint that by all accounts should have sounded a RED ALERT.
“However, I did not know that you can label..”
Because you have linear goal oriented thought that recognizes logical processes, such as cause and effect. They on the other hand, simply have an agenda.
They also have “feelings”.
“Feelings” always take precedence over logic.
Everyone knows that.
Well said Master Chief.
I grieve for the families of those who died and hope those injured recover soon.
I also hope each one who said they believed beforehand that this mentally bent shooter would commit such an act, carry an extra burden of guilt for not raising the alarm.
A kid builds a phony clock bomb and nation is in a uproar for weeks, but several kids believe a classmate is dangerous and say nothing are innocent when he acts on his promises. I don’t think so.
There is nothing new under the sun. We who hold our 2ND Amendment Rights sacred will continue to and those who want all weapons gone will continue to. Tragedy never brings clarity of thought to those who mislay responsibility. The left will continue to mislay the responsibility for these kinds of actions at the doorstep law abiding citizens because they will not control the non-law abiding, nor demand the existing, sensible laws long in effect be upheld without exception.
There are too many people in this nation not to have some fall through the cracks, even if we had a perfect system of control, which we never will. The shooter in this case, had he been flagged and unable to lawfully obtain his weapon, would have done as others before and stolen them or otherwise obtained them illegally.
No one can stop someone who is willing to give their life, from taking others. Sometimes the good guy or LEO is there and does. But so often, as in this case, they are not.
I probably made little sense here but, it’s my two cents.
Clear enough, Sparks. Your words explain exactly why the rest of us should be allowed to defend ourselves from the bad guys.
Odds are that I will never cross paths with anyone such as this lunatic. The major reason for that is that I avoid gun-free zones. But, in the event that I am exposed to one of these nuts, shouldn’t it be my decision to be armed or not? If others make a different decision, and either arm themselves or not, isn’t that a decision for them to make?
The position most of us take is that you should be able to decide for yourself whether to arm yourself or not, and most of us are willing to accept the responsibility that goes with either decision. That IS the compromise position on gun control.
The extremes are that either no one can be armed or that everyone must be armed. Far too few people understand that. Meanwhile almost no one advocates mandating all people be proficient with and own firearms. (I have never heard that, but am assuming there must be someone out there who does.) There are many who take the opposite position. The are the ones insisting that we must compromise, which really means do it their way.
Contemplate an opposing point of view:
It is extremism to resist their goal of a weapon- free population, just as it is extremism to resist their goal of a Faith- free population.
Opposition to worldwide progressivism is extreme. Only their way is considered rational, reasonable, or moderate.
The sad thing here is how the media will obsess over “who was he?”, “what were his motivations?”, and “could he have been stopped?” You’ll hear this cowardly shithead’s name repeated over and over again, giving him what he wanted; immortality.
You’ll hear passing references to the students, maybe by name, and a bit about the true heroics of Aaron Feis. Aaron Feis, an unarmed security guard, was so truly motivated by a sense of right and duty to die protecting his charges. This will be overshadowed by the murderous slug’s name.
The media could report on this stuff without using the person’s name. Do that and you eliminate most of the motivations of these people. They are loners, who feel ignored by the world, so they do something to make themselves remembered.
I wish this little fuckstain a long life, life without parole. I’m not as much in favor of the death penalty as I once was. I’m much happier with someone like this turd rotting in jail. Capital punishment is too quick.
Three things I wish upon him all at once, immobility, insomnia and immortality.
Ever been to Starke, Florida? It’s well named. The Florida State Prison there uses either lethal injection or “Old Sparky” to dispatch the very bad ones. I’d say he qualifies for a long, miserable, meaningless existence on death row, and a reserved spot on either the gurney or the hot seat.
Long, because I’m realistic about the way death sentences run their course through the court system. And that’s not a bad thing.
I say rope, scaffold, and inmate. Some assembly required; neither cruel nor unusual (USCT says so).
At high noon in the town center. Completely agree, but unfortunately that’s not an option in Florida.
I agree. While a solid case is made for prolonged punitive misery, the fact remains that the little shit would be fed and housed on the taxpayers’ dime, which is unacceptable.
The cost of such executions with the old hemp necktie is pretty cheap. No expensive cocktail of drugs and no high powered electric bill. Plus, you can use the same rope and scaffold over and over again. But this worthless bastard definitely rates a new rope.
The Leftists here in Washington are pushing to get rid of the Death Penalty.
When I lived in Florida, I used to shut my lights off when they would dispatch some turd with Ol’ Sparky.
Too bad JEA and FPL didn’t give me discounts.
Always trying to be helpful doncha know!
WAPE would play this on those special days.
It was said that lights dimmed in Jax when ole sparky did it’s job at Raiford pen in Starke.
Why waste drugs when you can “Strap ’em and Zap ’em”?
Just supply that goblin with a rope and a gravel road and I’ll supply the pickup truck to drag him with.