What the Hell is Middle Class, Anyway?
Recently, the news has been full of stories about the shrinking middle class and explosion of poverty in the US. The Department of Commerce has announced new Poverty Guidelines, and you can read two separate perspectives on this decision, here and here . Commerce says they will still use the old guides for program eligibility and the new ones to evaluate program effectiveness and such.
How much poverty is there really in America. Listen, I live so far below the “poverty line”, you’d need a back hoe to dig us all out. What is making people so damn poor? And while were at it… fat.
On paper my family is the poster family for poverty in America. But based on the loose definition of Middle Class– home-ownership, college, kids in college, and vacation (we went on one last year, woo woo)– put us just inside this holy grail. But while the government tries to “save” other lower income families… they are destroying their quality of life.
Here’s an example of real POVERTY:
Ok, I don’t want to see people living in America living like that. Chances are, if they do, its because of something the parents lack, and I don’t mean money.
But social manipulation has detroyed the quality of life of those who live with less in the United States. We’ve told them that life will get better if you put Jr. in Head Start and get a job, but then act shocked when the kids, and moms, get fat . Or we fill their wallets with food cards so they can buy frozen pizza and burritos and pop and use all their extra cash at McDonalds or to pay for cable. We tell women they don’t need a man, that they can raise a kid on their “own” with Uncle Sam’s help. We tell them we’ll pay their rent if they will all move in together like so much cattle.
We’ve made available to the poor all the things they would be striving to get, if it wasn’t already given to them. And men? Well, they’re still getting their share of mindless entertainment, regardless of if they have time for it, or not.
Maybe, just maybe, we need to stop trying to give the “sorta-poor” in the US everything everyone else has, and let them learn to LIVE again. To feel the satisfaction of raising children, saving for a home, or just paying the rent steadily, and know they did it with their own two hands.
Category: Liberals suck, Media
Funny you should raise this question. The definition of just what is Middle Class has been the topic of discussion around the household recently, and like you I have no idea if I am or not. It all seems to depend on who is tossing the phrase around so I would like to see some politicians from either side of the aisle to define it for all of us in the great unwashed masses.
I know growing up my parents always referred to us as the working poor although we always had a roof over our heads and food on the table. We didn’t own houses, except when we rented one once, most of the time it was apartments and we didn’t eat out a lot but I think even then we would have been identified as Middle Class.
So anyway if anybody can nail down a definitive definition of what middle class is I am all ears.
Great post Boo. I’m not going to comment, because I think I am considered upper middle class, but when i was growing up, not so much…
I was so damn poor when I was growing up that if I didn’t have my wang I wouldn’t have had anything to play with.
Seriously, by todays standard the way I grew up would be considered neglect. Mom worked two jobs most of the time and I had to fend for myself until she got home. I never starved, but I went to bed a little hungry some nights. I am stronger today because of it. People need a little adversity in their lives, maybe then we wouldn’t be so fat or lazy.
Ah…if only people were made to be self sufficiant…I am a big fan of sink or swim. I’ve been treading water since I was 18. Some years I have been upper middle class. Some years I was scraping the electricity bill together. The one thing I have always had is the knowlage that I have done it all with my own two hands (and over the last several years with the wonderful hands of my wife).
It’s time to let people sink or swim. I am all for helping the truly needful (i.e handicapped, and disabeled vets, war widows for a time). Everyone else should get a job or starve, hunger is wonderful motivation).
P.S. Sorry for my horrible spelling.
@J.a.G. I agree, it slides with whoever is doing the talking. It’s been muddied even more, lately. Back when we were kids, you had to have the “stuff” I think. My era: MTV, atari… nice jeans. lol but now? I’m with you, all ears.
@TSO thank you, and that’s the point, isn’t it? You wanted so then you got. 🙂
@Jason, LOL The favorite toy of men and boys everywhere!
My personal, working definition of middle class is the person who is hated from below and taxed from above.
Works for me!
Not to be disrespectful, but this reminds me of one of my favorite skits from Monty Python, the 4 Yorkshiremen…LOOOXURY!!
BTW TSO, congrats to you and Caroline, hope the honeymoon was fun!
One of the things the 1st article prattled on about was how “globalisation” and “free trade” were suposed to be good for us and that it’s not true and destroying the middle class. What has that done for purchasing power of the “lower class”? When I was a kid we would have been considered Middle Class. We got our 1st color TV (and the 1st one in the neighborhood) because my Dad built it from a Heathkit! When I got out of the Army in ’91 I bought a cheap 23″ color TV for about $300. You can get a bigger flat screen for the same price today and even the “poor” have more than 1 in their house these days. Hopefully I can find the comparison I saw once of our “poor” to the middle class of another “1st world” country…..France!!! Our “poor” had more tv’s per capita, more air conditioning per capita, and more cars per capita than the “middle class” in France. Another play at class warfare for the elections, get ready for more of it to attempt to save the Dems…
“Another play at class warfare for the elections, get ready for more of it to attempt to save the Dems…” (#8 Old Tanker).
That’s exactly what they’re playing at–and it isn’t going to work. The talk I’m hearing in my circle is this:
“Throw ALL the bums (in government) out!!”
If they’re not working for us…they’re GONE!!
Love that, Pinto Nag (#6)! So true!
My wife and I scraped by an awful lot when the two oldest were young, and even later. The kids would ask a lot about getting this or getting that, and one day I sat them down and showed them the family finances. I showed them how much was coming in and how much had to go out and how little was left over.
Then, I told them to look around: We were the only intact family on our block. They were the only kids who had both parents with them. They had a roof over their heads, food on the table and clothes that, while maybe not the top fashion, were warm, clean and well-maintained. They each had their own room. There’s a lot to be said for that.
Right now, Me and the the youngest (she’s 12) are having some difficult times, but I’m not complaining about it. We may not have a lot, but everything we have we own, it’s all bought and paid for. If she wants something special, we figure out what it will cost and see if we can save for it. That teaches her the value of savings, and the idea between “want” and “need”.
I just hope to be able to save up enough to get the h3ll out of this state, and move down to Texas. If it comes down to it this spring, I’ll sell what we have to get it done, but I’m hoping not to have to completely start over. However, expenses are less in Texas, and that means more options for us, and more opportunities, and that’s all anyone can really ask for.
respects,
I’ve seen many “poor” people with much more than I have materially. It’s all I can do to keep up the mortgage and keep clothes on the kids right now. A “vacation” for me means driving 1000 miles back home to see the youngest kids and the wife for a few days. My job occasionally takes me into the houses or apartment of those who make far less money than I do. Many of them have big screen TVs, PS3s and drive nice vehicles but live in substandard housing or bad neighborhoods. I, on the other hand, have a 27″ flatscreen TV (the big one, not a LCD) I bought six years ago and a 32″ big TV my realtor gave me. The money that I haven’t spent towards luxury electronics and other items has gone towards paying off car loans and buying a house, which I hope to move back to once I retire. I came to the realization a few months ago that until I retire from the Army, I don’t need much. What I “sacrifice” for the next ten years should allow me to live comfortably once I become a civilian again. If it doesn’t I won’t know what I’m missing anyway.
When I had money, I was able to go on a trip to the Dominican Republic. Even those people that lived out in the jungles in plywood shacks had satellite TV and a TV of some sort. It was heartbreaking to see how these people lived and yet, they still had SOME luxuries.
I no longer have that lifestyle and it’s taken some getting used to living off of just a military retirement. I manage to get by. I don’t do much else that play on the computer most of the day and watch TV. I’m well into the “poverty” level, but I still manage to save up and get some luxuries.
Why in the holy hello kitty would you want to move to Texass, Tim? 🙂
We lived on the ranch where my Pop worked when I was growing up. He hated phones (still does) and wouldn’t let us have one until we were well into our teens. We had to use the phone up the hill in the barn if we needed to call someone.
We were far below middle-class, thus I was made to buy my own first car and provide my own insurance, gas money, and maintenance, as well as pay my own way through college.
It definitely teaches a person to work harder.
Boo
Great post! Sebastian Haffner who wrote “Defying Hitler” said that when the government became the “caretaker” of the German people, soon they were merely existing, not living. They had forgotten what it was like to hope, to dream or to strive for something better. When the wall came down, the east German
Oops- iPhones!
The people were resentful because they didnt know how to do anything if the gov’t wasn’t telling them. Hopefully, they have managed to be productive.
RIS,
My ancestors were from Texas, and compared to Maine, it’s a h3ll of a sight better for individual freedoms and less government intrusions.
Great post… I have so much to say, but am restraining myself. I am opting instead for brevity:
The rich get richer, the poor keep having more kids (I don’t have statistics, but that’s how it appears in this part of the world), and the middle-class just pays for everything.
If you see something you either want or need, and have to think about how you’ll have to pay for it, you’re still middle class.
Ironic, I was just talking about this yesterday with my bank rep who’s in charge of my IRA. He’s conservative like me and the last few times I’ve had to go in there to make early withdrawals from my IRA, we’ve ended up talking politics. He asked this very question “what the hell is middle class?” in reference to the talk recently about extending the Bush Tax Cuts for the “middle class”, but not for “the rich”. “Middle Class” and “the rich” mean different things to different people. For Obama and the Democrats, “the rich” is anyone making >$250,000. Which is an idiotic baseline, since that encompasses many small business owners or two-income households, etc. All the “middle class”, “the rich” and “the poor” labels do is work to divide us. The fact that people don’t even know whether they are middle class or not should tell everyone how meaningless are the labels. 2 years ago, because I got laid off from my job of 10 years, I made $60,000/year. I had a car, had a house, had a computer with cable internet, had cable TV, had A/C and heat, etc etc etc. I lived comfortably and was satisfied with my life. I didn’t need to know whether I was “middle class” or if there were people who were making more money than me and had more than me. That wasn’t my concern. My concern was “am I living a life that I want and working hard to make the life I want possible”. I was, so I didn’t care about “the rich” or the idiotic rants of liberals about class warfare and such. When I started caring about the class warfare rants is when the Democrats started demonizing “the rich” and corporations and businesses and talking about raising their taxes and punishing them. I started caring, because I knew I worked for a corporation/business (Ford Motor Company), so if the Democrats were going to “punish them”, it meant my job was in danger. And, sure enough… I have no patience for anyone who rips on “the rich” or businesses… Read more »
“2 years ago, because I got laid off from my job of 10 years…”
That should be “…BEFORE I got laid off from my job…”
By the way, I keep getting this warning today whenever I try to access This Ain’t Hell:
“Warning: Visiting this site may harm your computer!
The website at valorguardians.com contains elements from the site rpc.blogrolling.com, which appears to host malware – software that can hurt your computer or otherwise operate without your consent. Just visiting a site that contains malware can infect your computer.”
These are great comments !
Michael, I’m getting that when I log in from Google Chrome. I have emailed Jonn, the know-er of things,and I hope we get it cleared up FAST. 🙂
Thanks, Michael. Everytime I take a day off, something like this happens. I think the blogroll that I was hosting from the Morons was triggering the malware alert in some browsers. I’ve removed it from the sidebar, so if you clear your cache and load the front page, it should be OK.
Turn it backwards and upside down and you get “The Poor” vote for Democrats, so change the guidelines and make more poor. Presto, Democratic Mid-term election problem solved!
I use Google Chrome as well, so that’s where it was showing up for me. Works great now though, Jonn. Good work.
Turn it backwards and upside down and you get “The Poor” vote for Democrats, so change the guidelines and make more poor. Presto, Democratic Mid-term election problem solved!
I can’t remember if this was a bit for some show or if someone told me about this regarding a friend or something. But someone, after asking the difference between the two political parties, was told the old adage “Republicans are for the rich and Democrats are for the poor”. The woman thought about it and said “ok then, I’m supporting Republicans”. The other person, who clearly was telling her the adage in order to get her to support Democrats, said “But why? Democrats support the poor!” She replied, “Well, if Democrats are for the poor, that means that they’ll govern in a way to keep people poor, or make more poor people, so they’ll have more constituents. If Republicans are for the rich, that means they’ll govern in a way to help more people become rich, so they’ll have more constituents.”
I just can’t let this one go by:
Michael in MI
I know what you mean… I lost my job after more than 20 years, and I see that obviously I was in a much worse position than you were… but that’s a different story.
As for the “rich getting richer”. I tend to think of things more from a ground level approach. In the early to mid 80s during the last “recession”, I was young then, but I specifically remember a low-risk investment earning 13%….and, by the same token, if someone had money to invest, say as a private lender, he could earn in the neighbourhood of 18%. Hard to fathom? Times have changed, the interest rates have changed, but the fact remains the same: If you have money you can make money…. ie the “rich get richer”. Just sayin… Of course it could be totally different in the U.S., maybe the rich individuals don’t actually get richer?
Michael I think I have read an article about that. I cannot remember where it was, but it talked about why dems and liberals liked the poor. One time I think I had that argument with our resident Progressive Joe. Come to think of it where is he on this? He should be here…
Where are you Joe?
What is wrong with rich people getting richer?
Much to Oliver Stone’s chagrin it isn’t a zero sum game. The pie actually gets bigger rather than one person getting a bigger slice at the cost of others. Just because one guy makes a million doesn’t mean that somebody had to lose a million. Quite the opposite, if a guy makes a million then more than likely there have been a lot of people who have made money.
Hell I would rather be poor now than when I grew up…at least I wouldn’t have had to get a job at 12 (which you can’t do now).
Amen, Boo. Amen!
spockgirl
I think my point — and the point of this post — is that *everyone* has gotten richer in this nation. People called “the poor” today are hardly poor at all, when they have homes (whether a house or an apartment), TVs, computers, cell phones, cars, etc. That’s what we call “the poor” here in America. “The poor” are MUCH better off today than “the poor” years to decades ago.
And everyone’s money goes a lot farther today than it did decades ago. Just think of how much it costs to travel across the country. Decades ago, only “the rich” could afford that. Now, anyone can get deals on places like Priceline.com for say $100 to fly across the country. That was unheard of decades ago. In the past, people would have to save up weeks of paychecks to simply purchase a television set or something. Now, you can get a great TV for $100-$200.
I just think we’re so spoiled by our prosperity in this nation that we have completely lost perspective on what is “the poor” or “middle class” or “rich”.
And, I don’t begrudge “the rich” being rich… or getting richer. The poor get richer and become “middle class”. The “middle class” get richer and become “the rich”. I don’t see anything wrong with that at all.
And to say that “the middle class pays for it all” is not true either. “The rich” invest their money in business, in research and development, in the internet (from which we all benefit from today in a GREAT way), in energy R&D, in medicine R&D. “The rich” also donate to charities and pay the majority of our nation’s taxes. “The rich” also provide jobs.
I just don’t get the animosity towards “the rich” or towards anyone “getting richer”.
Were it not for the American spirit of wanting to get rich by producing a product that would help the masses (ie automobiles, the assembly line, computers, cell phones, the internet, Facebook, etc), we would not be as prosperous a nation as we are.
Michael in MI
Oops I did it again. I was supposed to NOT comment on anything wherein my brevity could be misinterpreted or misunderstood. That being said, please take note that I make no judgment and bear no animosity to anyone for their social or financial status. In both our countries, we all have the rights and freedoms necessary to both improve and advance ouselves… all of us, every single one.
For me to try to say so much in so few words leaves too many doors open, and always gets me in some sort of trouble, as evidenced here… again.
HaHa Spockgirl! I do it all the time! 🙂 Try to say something and it’s not completely clear to others.
🙂
I think one of the things that made people poorer was the proliferation of credit cards that started in the late 80’s and early 1990’s. I remember when I was a sapling back in the dinosaur days. Credit was very hard to get. Then all of a sudden it was like everyone was sending people credit cards in the mail. All they had to do was sign the form, send it in, without a credit check it was theirs.
People learned to spend and live beyond their means to an insane degree. Everything was worthy of being put on a credit card.
It’s just one example. But I really think people got used to not managing cash anymore. No one knew how much they brought in every month. They just spent.
Credit is hard to get now that the bottom has fallen out. And truthfully, I think it’s a good thing.
-Now, back to bidding on freelance jobs. I have major dental work that I’m paying for 3 of us.
To answer your second question: fat.
Once, we operated on a ten your old kid with gallstones. How’d he get them? He was morbidly obese.
But not just him, his entire family. They got upset when they came to our office because all we had were tiny little rattan chairs. Oh well. Golly gee. Can’t fit in those? Well, get a hint.
Anyway, the answer is diet, but I also think a good part of this is chasing after all the wrong things. We’ve substituted food for spending time with people, we’ve quit going to museums, parks, or hikes in favor of shopping and eating.
Or just eating. Worse, people are eating highly processed foods with no fiber, no protein, ….no nutritional value.
I get sick when I see a whole family who are morbidly obese. Usually it’s 2 or even 3 generations. And frankly …this is costing us in productivity and also medical bills.
*rant over*
Thank you.
“For me to try to say so much in so few words leaves too many doors open, and always gets me in some sort of trouble, as evidenced here… again.”
Heh, no worries. I do it too. In fact, whether I say too few or too many words, either way I more often than not leave people wondering what in the world I’m trying to say.
Some good comments, just add one extra, no one has mentioned the poverty we’ve been importing over the last thirty years, from third world illegals.
Cedo; that’s racist!!!
j/k
Not to get into the whole tax structure thing, because no one believes anything anyone else says about it. We all have our own opinions on it.
As Cedo was saying; follow the money i. e. who’s puicking up the tab? When you have illegals that send a lot of money home (roughly $22 bil a year) and get an education in our public school system, food stamps (I know it’s a card now, but humor me; okay?), medical care (who picks up that tab? We do through higher medical costs), because our own federal law states that no one can be refused treatment at an emergency room, so we get that one, too. Then add on all the other infrastructure to this epidemic and you have a whole lot of money being spent on people who shouldn’t be here to begin with. We, the taxpayers, get to take care of all of that and are asked to pay more all the time. As with any structure, there is a breaking point when you over stress the structure and we are getting close to that point.
Big difference between income levels and class levels. Change middle class to middle income and it is clear that this merely a description of ones current income level.
There is no distinction in The United States between a middle class voter, a lower class voter and an upper class voter. They each get one vote. They are all entitled to own property. And, they are all (for the most part) subject to the same laws. I would suggest this foundation that makes the US exceptional.
In most other countries, including Western Europe, there are distinct classes that correspond closely to income levels. Those classes also have different rights and privileges. And, one cannot freely move between those classes by his/her own merit.
Seems like a minor difference. Not in my opinion. Calling any American middle or lower class is to me the greatest insult one can present. Think about it.
Spook86:
That is an interesting point. Thanks for the thought-provoking input!
I agree, Spook, that that is something that makes America great.
I worry about that changing with the development of the poverty class.
“For me to try to say so much in so few words leaves too many doors open, and always gets me in some sort of trouble, as evidenced here… again.”
I’ve got a part of my anatomy that is flat from having stepped on it(gramatically speaking) so many times 🙂
Seems like a minor difference
You’re right, not minor at all!
Spockgirl: It’s a pile of snarling dogs around here at the best of times. Get ready to “Cowgirl Up!” when you log on here! : )
Aside from the whole issue of what constitutes middle class, I have to say that I’m offended by your casual dismissal of single mothers who often do NOT need a man to provide for their family. I haven’t received a dime of child support from my ex husband for the last five years, and we’re doing okay. Maybe I juggle a little bit and maybe I’ve done some part time work from time to time, but I am providing without anybody’s help. Maybe the reason why some of us tell women they’ll be fine is because they WILL.
As a mother of 4 raising them alone, AS, I will say that financial support is not all that having a 2nd parent provides.
AS,
I was not even thinking of child support, per se. But exactly like you and ROS I have been divorced and struggled to make ends meet. My parents were divorced when I was small, as well. It happens.
I’m more referring to the culture of male obsolescence. Not a disappointing divorce, but “why bother with birth control? we won’t starve.”
(Though Boo Radley is a male, I am not–I’m Amy. )
🙂
I’m of the belief that marriage is permanent. For me, divorce is the ultimate failure and breaking of commitment.
That said, there are circumstances under which a continuation of partnership is just not doable.
While I would venture to say that one (a single mother) could definitely be middle class and even higher, financially, that does not make one on par with those who have two-parent households in the eyes of society.
It does not matter that I’m the mother who brings crudite and finger sandwiches to school parties wearing cashmere and Tahitian pearls while other mothers are wearing flip flops and serving high fructose corn syrup with food coloring, they’re considered middle class because of social standing.
Thus the definition of “middle class” becomes even more muddled, and Spook’s thoughts become even more apropos.
I did assume divorce, it was late… but there ARE many reasons a woman or a man is single with kids.
Very much so, yet none are valid in our superficial, judgmental society.
A single father is lauded and revered as one who’s stepping up to the plate and behaving responsibly, while a single mother is held in disdain or pitied.