Gun Pulled in Orion Township Argument, Wuestenberg’s Arrested

| July 4, 2020

Takelia Hill as she says, “Dumb ass bitch. Yeah I said it. You say something, I’ll beat your white ass too.” (DUKE DUKE/TouTube)

The video begins showing Jillian Wuestenberg during an argument with Takelia Hill and her daughter. Takelia Hill, a black, claims that Wuestenberg collided with the daughter despite the daughter “moving out of the way”. Wuestenberg argued that the daughter had “gotten in her space”. Unfortunately, the video doesn’t start until after that incident, so neither statement could be verified.

Takelia Hill knocks on the back of the vehicle window as the vehicle backs up… Perhaps moving out of the way, and into safety, as most would’ve done, could’ve been a better idea. Knocking on the vehicle of the people you were arguing with, given similar violence against vehicles during the George Floyd riots, isn’t a good idea.

From The Detroit News:

“I am deeply disturbed by an incident last night where a woman pointed a cocked gun at another woman during an argument,” Oakland County Executive David Coulter said in a statement Thursday. “This behavior is unacceptable. I wholly expect the prosecutor to bring charges that reflect the severity of the incident.”

On Thursday, state Sen. Rosemary Bayer, D-Beverly Hills, called the incident unacceptable.

“There is nothing acceptable about what happened in Orion Township last night at the Chipotle. It is abhorrent to think that some in this country have such a sense of self-righteousness and entitlement that the idea of pulling a gun out on an unarmed child and her mother is OK,” Bayer said in a statement.

“It is not, and I condemn anyone who thinks otherwise. My heart goes out to Ms. Hill and her daughters, who may now forever be traumatized by this experience.”

Bayer also called for gun reform.

“Michigan needs commonsense gun reform, and we need it now. People should feel safe going about their day and not have to worry about having a gun pulled on them during a conflict,” she said. “This incident clearly shows we have much work to do because this is not how we should be treating each other.”

The Detroit News has more information here.

The video:

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Category: "Teh Stoopid", "The Floggings Will Continue Until Morale Improves", YGBSM!!

Comments (176)

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  1. 2banana says:

    Is this the confrontation where a black female BLM thug felt disrespected in a fast food restaurant by a white couple, followed the couple out to their car, threatened them, refused to allow them to leave and caused damage to their car?

  2. Hack Stone says:

    She is white, so she is guilty. End of discussion. The mother and daughter deserve some type of reparations for whatever perceived injustice they believe they have endured.

  3. Ex-PH2 says:

    Gee, it’s interesting how so many people are so ready to pick a fight and have a videographer standing by to record it.

    Just gets more and more interesting. Where will it end? When?

    Did you guys know that drive=ins are returning to the movie “theater” venues. There were three of them left in my area, and they were hanging in there, but now, there are pop-ups showing up everywhere.

  4. Blaster says:

    She seemed to be exercising her entitlement to self protection. They had this bunch on at least two sides of their vehicle, maybe three. It looks lot me like the “white rayciss” was trying to leave the whole time. The whole time that “momma” was throwing vulgarities, insults and actual racial slurs.

    There will be a lot more of these, and worse incidents, until we again learn to come together as AMERICANS, and quit letting ourselves be played into division. I’d say that you’d have to be either blind or accepting spoon fed information. Better look at the hand(s) holding the spoon.

    • Slow Joe says:

      Too late.

      The liberals won the cultural war.

      Despite growing up in the Army seeing only uniforms and never noticing people’s skin color, ethnicity, or whatever, right now every time I see a black person I shut my mouth and I walk away.

      I am sorry but I cannot trust a black person right now. A simple mistake on my part can destroy the wellbeing of my family and my ability to put food on the table.

      So fuck them.

      You reap what you sow.

      • 11B-Mailclerk says:


        They are noisy, not victorious.

        As Mr. Reagan said, “We Win. They Lose.”

  5. Commissar says:

    “Takelia Hill, a black,…”

    “A black”?!

    That was a typo right? Oversight?

    Hard to tell at this point. Jarhead called black people “evil apes” and not only was he not moderated this site defended him. Ex put out a post that claimed it is not an insult to call someone and “ape” because we share so much DNA with apes.

    So is that the way things are here now? The racism is now a bullhorn instead of a dog whistle?

    • David says:

      How many posts here have inadvertent typos or missed words? Including yours? Get a life!

      Like the drunk clown who was killed in Atlanta, you picked a really bad example to hang your hat on.

      • Mason says:

        That’s kind of his MO.

      • SFC D says:

        It’s different for the Commissar. He has a brain condition. Plus, he’s a liberal so different rules apply. You’re not allowed to judge him.

      • Commissar says:

        If it were a typo or a oversight.

        Yet, Ex’s entire blog post claiming calling someone an “ape” is not an insult; a post written entirely in defense of Jarhead calling black people “evil apes”… that sure as shit was not a typo or oversight.

    • Blaster says:

      Couple of things:
      1. If you don’t like it here, or the things that are said, simply don’t return.
      2. It’s hard not use use racism as bullhorn when EVERYTHING is racist now! Watch the video and tell me who was throwing the racial slurs.?.?! I’d of probably done the same thing in the same situation. Regardless of the other parties RACE, gender, religion, age, sexual orientation, etc.

      • Toxic Deplorable Racist SAH B Woodman says:

        To paraquote Syndrome from “The Incredibles”, “when everything is racist, nothing is racist.”

        Kommissar Seagull, do us all a favor, and suck start a shotgun. I’ll even provide the shotgun and shell.

    • AW1Ed says:

      Fist of all, Lars, I missed the remark or I would have dealt with it then- I can’t be everywhere. Jarhead, such racial pejoratives are not welcome here at TAH. Find another way to express yourself or you will no longer be welcome here.
      Lars, I have you on Moderation for a reason. Jumping IPs isn’t impressive, and next time I’ll ban you.

      • thebesig says:

        Originally posted by AW1Ed:

        Lars, I have you on Moderation for a reason. Jumping IPs isn’t impressive, and next time I’ll ban you.

        Pay attention Lars, there have been discussions about you in the background. I’ve been the one that had been the most lenient with regards to how you should be dealt with. However, despite the numerous chances that you were given… Chances that you didn’t even have to receive… You fell short of what we were hoping.

        Result? Despite my being the most lenient with regards to how to handle you, I recommended to put your “Commissar” username on moderation. AW1 took that recommendation and put you on moderation. Should discussion turn to banning you, I won’t speak up other than to join the others who have talked about slapping the ban hammer on you.

        • Commissar says:

          Ban me, this site lost all my remaining respect, and my willingness to give it the benefit of the doubt when Jarhead called black people “evil apes”, several regulars tried to defend it, then Ex decided to post an entire blog post defending calling someone “apes” as “not an insult”…

          How much credibility can there be if that is the content being generated. Trying to claim calling someone an “ape” is not an insult in defense of calling black people “evil apes”..

          Jarhead stood by his post, and never even attempted to deny that is what he meant when he posted. Others tried to spin his words and reframe the intent and context, but he stood by the statement and the implications.

          This place has gone full MAGA at this point. Even using “MAGA” in blog post imagery.

          I once was put on moderation for even claiming this site has a political bias. Now there is not even a pretense of political objectivity.

          This blog has posted a few dozen times on racial tension issues over the last few months. When did any of the blog posts ever even once fall on the side of defending the interests of minorities over these tensions. Every single post is framed as an open or at least tepid defense of the White people involved,…

          Every. Single. Time.

          Often outright trying to discredit any movement or protest that tries to draw attention to or change racial injustices.

          So put me on moderation, ban me, i have. no interest in posting on a blog that pulls the shit Ex pulled this week, while putting me on moderation for calling her out on it.

          • Blaster says:

            You say that, then you come back. I dated a girl like you once. She kept leaving, then showing back up, until I put her in permanent moderation. You could always moderate yourself if this site offends your sensibilities. I feel like everyone on this site considers the feelings of minorities. I figure that several of them are minorities or related to minorities in some way or love a minority. But when a concocted story is used to initiate a political movement, don’t expect sympathy from those smart enough to recognize what is really happening. Floyd’s death was tragic and uncalled for, but the offenders are being prosecuted. Now, I watched the video but can’t see where race was part of it. Jackasses are jackasses regardless of race or color. It became a racial incident when it became politically convenient. I’m afraid that this is all going to have the opposite effect that you claim to desire. When you continue to blame non racism people of being racist, eventually you are going to create an “us and them” mentality which may very well become racism. I’ve wasted enough time trying to explain anything to you, I’m afraid you’re too bought in to the word of your handlers.

          • Poetrooper says:

            “…i have. no interest in posting on a blog that pulls the shit Ex pulled this week…”

            Says the moron who uses almost 300 words to demonstrate his indifference and changes his IP address trying to get back onto the site.

            Lars, my lad, you beclown yourself…

          • SFC D says:

            You found your way in, you can find your way out. You have that freedom, kindly use it, and most expeditiously.

          • HMCS(FMF) ret says:

            Then why in the Hell do you show up and post, Lars? All you do is show up, spew your bigotry and hate. You’ve tried it ID people on this site in the past, including me and Jonn handed your ass to you over that. You have no tolerance for any viewpoint that isn’t shared by you and have made it a point of lying on numerous occasions about statements you’ve made here and then denied making them days/weeks/months later.

            You bring nothing to the discussions here at TAH… you’re a verbal shit stirrer and bomb thrower.

            JUST. WALK. THE. FUCK. AWAY.

            • Slow Joe says:

              Kelly Clarkson – Walk Away

            • A Proud Infidel®™ says:

              “You’ve tried it ID people on this site in the past, including me…”

              I remember him screeching that he wanted to fistfight me as well!

          • thebesig says:

            No, he did not label all black people “evil apes”. That’s not even what he said. He was addressing the thug in the video, and meant that term to apply to the thugs.

            Dave quoted what he said, nowhere near what you said he said.

            As for your “fall on the side of the interests of minorities”. I’m sorry, but when the police gives you instructions, and you decide to fight back or resist arrest, what do you think is going to happen?

            Putting aside how the police officer handled the situation, the detained person could easily have decided to be cooperative… From the beginning. Be cooperative, don’t be threatening, and don’t give the cop the justification needed to ramp up their efforts to bring you in, and the chances are good that things would go smoothly.

            You, having been in law enforcement, should know that. That’s what we’re looking at… We’re not going to give people a pass for doing stupid crap simply cause the person doing the stupid crap is a minority.

            This attempt at making this about minority issues is nothing but a BS way to let certain people pull the victim card as a substitute for accountability and responsibility.

            No, you didn’t get moderated for “Calling Ex out” on anything. You didn’t call her out. You’ve been adequately informed, mostly by AW1, about your actions. He gave you plenty of chances, he extended the carrot. You didn’t take the hint, nor did you take his advice for you onboard.

            This is what motivated putting you on moderation.

      • thebesig says:

        Originally posted by AW1Ed:

        I missed the remark or I would have dealt with it then- I can’t be everywhere. Jarhead, such racial pejoratives are not welcome here at TAH.

        It was on one of my threads. I jumped in and addressed it. Even Dave jumped in and commented on it.

        • Commissar says:

          No you didn’t, Or at least not on the day he posted. If you did it was after the thread was buried.

          And claiming it was addressed is flat bullshit when Ex’s response was to devote an entire damn blog post defending it and claiming calling someone an “ape” is not an insult.

          • SFC D says:

            Did you read Ex’s post? Obviously not. She referred to the entire human race as apes. That includes you. Me. La-de-da-de and everyfuckinbody. Save your selective outrage, it’s based on lies you tell yourself.

          • thebesig says:

            I just pulled the thread up. He made the statement on June 24, 2020. I addressed it on June 24, 2020. So did Dave.

            The fact that I edited the post, and that others addressed Jarhead that same day, proves that this was addressed.

            You can’t bring Ex into this equation when Jarhead was the one who made the statement.

    • thebesig says:

      Yes, “A black”. No different from saying, “A Hispanic, an Italian, a Mexican, etc.”

      From the article:

      “Takelia Hill, who is Black, said her daughter was bumped into by a woman, who is white,” – The Detroit News

      I have every intention of continuing to use the words that I’ve been using, regardless of how politically incorrect they become. Fuck political correctness.

      • Ex-PH2 says:

        Well, then, from now on, you will refer to me as Caucasion, thebesig. I will accept nothing less.

      • Commissar says:

        “Who is black” is not the same thing as saying “who is a black”.

        Calling someone “a black” erases their humanity.

        “Black person” is a person, “A black” is a form of “othering”. Erasing their personhood,

        I would have been sure it was a typo before Jarheads posts and Ex’s entire blog post defending it.

        • Poetrooper says:

          Classic Orwellian speech indoctrination…

        • SFC D says:

          The only thing you’re sure of is your own infallibility. I’ve got bad news for you sunshine…

        • thebesig says:

          Wrong. Both describe a person who is black. Adding “a” into the first statement does not change the meaning. Calling someone “a black” does not erase their humanity. It simply describes them as black.

          By your argument, “A person” is a form of othering. Therefore, we should refrain from saying, “a person” in order not to “other” the person. For that matter, “A Soldier?” Oh crap, we just “othered” this Soldier!

          So no, saying, “a black” is NOT a form of othering. It does not erase their person-hood, just as describing someone as “a Soldier” does not erase their person-hood.

          • Poetrooper says:

            Bes, it’s just another example of how the Left tries to control the language so as to control thought and repress dissent. If you are compelled to speak a certain way, after a period of time your thinking will come into compliance with your speech.

            Or so they think…it is a concept that denies human individuality and ultimately does not endure, the Soviet Union being the best example.

        • OldManchu says:

          Lars you once stated, as proof that you were not racist, that you dated Asian women.

          Stop when the fake ivory tower pussified outrage.

    • HMCS(FMF) ret says:

      If your so damn ass hurt over typos or “speech” that doesn’t fit your “narrative”, get the fuck out, Lars!

    • HMCS(FMF) ret says:

      Tell these guys about your “narrative”, Lars… they’ll have no problem telling your to stick it up your pasty white ass…

    • Hondo says:

      Perhaps you should complain to the Census Bureau, Commissar. “Black or African American” is one of the Census Bureau’s officially-designated racial categories. The others are “White”, “American Indian or Alaska Native”, “Asian”, and “Native Hawaiian or Other Pacific Islander”.

      • HMCS(FMF) ret says:

        Oh, Hell, Hondo… you’re gonna trigger him.

      • Commissar says:

        It is not the word “black” at issue Hondo, and I keep giving you the benefit of the doubt that you are capable of the critical thought necessary to know that,

        Calling someone “black” is not racist, calling someone “a black persons” is not racist. Calling someone “a black” is.

        Saying someone is black is merely discoing a characteristic without framing it as that is all they are.
        Calling someone a “black person” is the same thing. It maintains their personhood.

        Calling someone “a black” erases their personhood and frames it in such a way that they are defined entirely by being black.

        • timactual says:

          “Calling someone “a black” is.”

          Says who? Is there an official style manual I have not seen? I am sure there must be some authoritative source for your statement, other than your somewhat biased opinion.

          • Poetrooper says:

            Ahem, Tim, I refer you to the Seagull Manual of Style, 3d Edition, Dec. 2019:

            “Calling someone “black” is not racist, calling someone ‘a black persons’ is not racist. Calling someone ‘a black’ is.”

            You simply must learn that Lars is ALWAYS right because he knows EVERYTHING.

            Ask him…


        • Poetrooper says:

          Lars, here ay TAH we don’t employ that academic term, “critical thought” too much.

          From Wikipedia: “Critical thinking is the analysis of facts to form a judgment.[1]”

          Here at TAH we call that “common sense” and may I suggest you try to employ it?

        • rgr769 says:

          One has to wonder whether you pulled that out of your own ass or that of one of Antifa butt-buddies. Or, did it come from the latest version of your Newspeak Dictionary? I guess some of us should be highly offended if someone calls us “a white.”

          • A Proud Infidel®™ says:

            I’m absolutely certain that he never even remotely has a thought independent of his moonbat cult groupthink!

    • E4 Mafia '83-'87 says:

      NEVER apologize to a mob, or someone with mob mentality. They aren’t looking to forgive you, they are looking for you to submit, and be bullied. NEVER apologize…NEVER.
      I don’t see a problem. The black mother wanted the situation to escalate into a physical confrontation, and the white woman deescalated the situation when she was threatened. By blocking their ability to leave, the black woman escalated the situation. Nobody was hurt, so end of story.
      You know this whole story is bullshit because if the roles were reversed (aggressive white mother and black woman draws weapon) the Leftist press and commie fags would be praising her standing for up for herself. There will be more video coming out than the few seconds Leftist propaganda outlets show you. The white woman tried multiple times to end the situation, but the black woman had no intention of letting the situation end.

      • Toxic Deplorable Racist SAH B Woodman says:

        Never apologize to a mob.

        • Slow Joe says:

          I think Jordan Peterson was the first one to say that…

          • OldSoldier54 says:

            That guy is AMAZING!

            If you’re the praying kind, the whole Peterson family could really use some prayer. It’s been one serious health crisis after another, and those poor folks are feeling rode hard and put up wet.

            It seems Mikhaila (his daughter) and her husband have been pillars for the family, but are still feeling wore out.

          • E4 Mafia '83-'87 says:

            I don’t know who said it first, but it sounds like something Dr Peterson said. I got it from Dave Cullen. Regardless of who said it first, the words are 100% spot-on.

      • USMC Steve says:

        Add to that the nasty ass daughter threatening the guy. He obviously took her seriously, and in a good many states, that right there is felonious assault. I seriously doubt this would have escalated to this level in Free America.

    • The Other Whitey says:

      Given your history of semi-literate (at best) screeds, Lars, maybe you should shut the hell up. I know you really, really want TAH to be racist—which is disgusting on your part—so that you can pretend to feel better about yourself, but it’s just not the case.

      As usual, you’re a pathetic misanthropic narcissist. Seek help.

      • Ex-PH2 says:

        I’ve always found that the people who make the most noise about racism are the most guilty of it.

    • timactual says:

      It has always amazed me how many so-called “liberals” can hear those dog whistles so clearly.

    • 11B-Mailclerk says:

      You see everything racially, thus -you- are the racist.

      Because “race” is bullshit.

      Pigmentation determines -nothing- of significance. Race is non-science horseshit dreamed up to excuse shitty behavior.

      I don’t buy the “race” premise. One species. One humanity. Seven and a half billion individuals. All with free will.

      So, to put it more simply,

      Fuck off, racist. None of us needs your “help”.

    • Sapper3307 says:

      She is Obese ,so she arez blacks plural.

    • Sarge says:






      Lather, rinse, repeat

    • USMC Steve says:

      Hate to tell ya Lars, but the gal is a black. If you are black, that makes you a black. They ain’t African American, as there is no such thing. The correct term is negro, but no one uses it anymore.

      If it offends you, too fucking bad. You got no dog in the fight.

  6. Mason says:

    People should feel safe going about their day and not have to worry about having a gun pulled on them during a conflict

    This is from The Onion, right? Probably shouldn’t be out starting shit if you don’t want a “conflict” to escalate.

    • thebesig says:

      Most people would anticipate where a departing vehicle would back up to, then make sure that they’re not standing in the way in order to avoid getting hit. Either common sense isn’t one of her strong points, or she stood there so that she could hit the vehicle “because they almost backed into her”.

      Some are calling the woman, who pulled the gun, a “Karen”. In reality, the woman that hit the vehicle, and who spent plenty of time screaming, is the “Karen”. So was the one filming the argument. She definitely wasn’t setting an example for the one that was recording.

      • David says:

        Karen is a racial pejorative only used against white women. For my money, if you allow Karen you need to allow a host of other racial terms… or stop using it. Racist is racist, and if it’s a racial term exclusively applied to one race, it qualifies.

        • thebesig says:

          No, it’s not a racially pejorative term used against just white women. The definition of an “entitled Karen” changes depending on who uses that term. Some narrow that to middle aged women, others identify a woman 30 or above that behaves a certain way, etc. They have an entire subreddit dedicated to “Entitled Karens”.

          It’s not a racial jejorative, it’s another description category similar to “Boomer”, “Zoomer”, “Doomer”, “Incel”, “NPC”, etc.

          “Boomer” has been expanded to include not just Baby Boomers, but those who express conservative views, old school American views, etc.

          The younger Millennials and Generation Z are coming up with these terms.

          • SFC D says:

            I’d go so far as to say it’s an attitude, regardless of color, sex, gender or lack thereof, or any other defining characteristic.

            • A Proud Infidel®™ says:

              I see nearly every one of Major Moonbat’s rants as a psychological projection of his own personal insecurity and feelings of inferiority about his own past accomplishments.

    • The Other Whitey says:

      Pretty sure that your chances of having a gun pulled on you decrease logarithmically if you don’t go around starting and/or escalating shit.

      • Toxic Deplorable Racist SAH B Woodman says:

        Who was it said, “don’t bring nothin’, won’t be nothin’.”

  7. 26Limabeans says:

    The best advice I have ever been given is to
    “just turn around and walk away”

    Life is so much better when you follow good advice.

    • USMC Steve says:

      Not even applicable here. The black people would not allow it. And they acted like savages in Somalia because they knew they could get away with it in Kalifornia.

  8. Ex-PH2 says:

    Y’know, I’m getting really fed up with these “conflicts”, most of which are generated by bad manners and those infamous chips on the shoulders. Most of it is picking on someone who seems weak – but might not be – and being just downright rude. Who started what here is immaterial now. It only demonstrates the spoiled brat attitude that seems to be the norm these days.

    So went looking for something that might be antique and quaint at this point, but makes more sense and shows that we most of us can get along with each other, regardless.

    • Blaster says:

      My wife’s favorite hymn. That was a great performance. Too bad it pre- “them and us”! (And that is meant in every way- straight/gay, white/black/Hispanic/Asian, Christian/atheist/Muslim, southern/yankee, republican/democrat, rich/poor) Remember those days? When we were Americans? It was awesome. My best friend in junior high was a kid from Venezuela, I have a Mexican kid , married and Indian and always tried to treat everyone equal- good or bad, I’m an asshole back to asshole. Lately I come to find out that I’m still considered racist by some because I’m white(ish). Not due to anything that I did or said to anyone. I will admit that it’s getting harder for me to keep up with what is and is not acceptable and at times I am left scratching my head wondering “how is that racist?”. I hope this goes away soon and we get back to being proud of our country- together.

    • timactual says:

      I find Judy Collins’ voice to be grating, offensive, and painful. I demand you remove this video immediately!

  9. Mustang Major says:

    Everyone has a plan until a 9mm comes out.

  10. 5th/77th FA says:

    Self centered, entitled bitch lucky she didn’t get her ass shot dead. It’s like she was daring/egging on the white girl to escalate the situation. I smell a civil lawsuit in addition to the city/state charges upcoming.

    Saw it all the time while operating company owned vehicles. We even had to sit thru training sessions on what to look for with people WANTING to start crap, just to do a lawsuit.

    To quote/paraphrase Sgt Maj Plumley; “…Gentlemen, prepare to defend yourselves…”

    It’s just gonna get worse.

  11. Fyrfighter says:

    Other than carrying without a round in the chamber, seems totally legit to me. The only ones acting racist were the mother and daughter. Given current events, the woman with the pistol was more than justified in fearing for her life. Attempting to talk to them, prior to backing out of the parking space was foolish, and obviously a waste of time, as soon as a camera comes out, you know they’re trying to provoke a response, it’s the leftist playbook verbatim.
    These folks need a good lawyer, and to sue for wrongful prosecution.

  12. E4 Mafia '83-'87 says:

    In other news, 2 Seattle idiots err “protestors” playing on the highway were hit. As the video shows, they got quite a bit of air. I scored them 6.0 for high degree of difficulty but took off 1 point because they didn’t not stick the landing. Both seriously injured (no shit) one critical and one with life threatening injuries. That & and the guy run over by the FedEx truck should make these nuts respect the steel & rubber…but probably not.

    • Mason says:

      I’m impressed the driver was able to turn on the hazards so fast. I don’t even think those meat crayons had stopped moving before they had the flashers goin.

    • Toxic Deplorable Racist SAH B Woodman says:

      Play stoopid games, win stoopid prizes.

    • The Dead Man says:

      Hope the dude’s okay. People have already doxxed him and they’re already throwing out that he ran police barricades or something. I’ll wait for more details either way.

      • Mason says:

        They actually got the tanker driver in Minneapolis arrested before they realized it was a mistake.

        • Hack Stone says:

          Arresting that truck driver in Minneapolis was no mistake. They have to appease the mobs, and if some innocent people suffer, that is the price of “peace in our time”.

  13. AW1Ed says:

    Against my better judgement, and by rights I should have just shitcanned your comments for using the new IP.

    For the very last time, I could give a rat’s ass about your politics. Your inflammatory delivery is at issue. The resulting flame wars generated by both sides have cost TAH untold members, and is going to stop. I realize there is much bad blood here, but I can only change so much.
    Hence you are in moderation, so I can evaluate your comments before allowing them to the conversation. You have my contact info- email me if needed, anytime. Stick to LP and VoV’s argument techniques and you will be fine. Play musical IPs again and I will ban you.

    As for the rest of you DWs, give it a break. I’ll add “AW1” to his comment to let you know I’ve viewed and approved it, so don’t go ballistic right out of the gate. If so I will stop comments on the post and notify the author this behavior is no longer tolerated.

    Don’t like it? By all means send your grievances to Admin and your resumes to Hardin.

    • Mick says:



      Direct hit. BDA = 100/100.

      Thanks, AW1Ed.

    • A Proud Infidel®™ says:

      *POW!*, right in the kisser!

    • timactual says:

      ” send your….and your resumes to Hardin.”

      Not a chance. It took me a long time, but I finally learned not to volunteer for unpaid, thankless, jobs. It’s all yours, and a hearty “You’re a better man than I, Gunga Din” to all of you.

  14. The term african American was coined by jesse jackson back in the 1980’s although the name was mentioned over a hundred years or so ago. Conservative Blacks like to be known and called Americans like most of us, but blacks that call themselves african Americans seem to not want to be part of our system and using that name separates them from us. This I remember from an American (Black) that was on Fox awhile ago. I’m only commenting on what the man said.

    • Mason says:

      Yup. They’re the same people demanding segregation. Amazing how quickly people get the equality they sought and their children and grandchildren shit all over it and demand special treatment.

    • 11B-Mailclerk says:

      A “hyphen American” is a contradiction. One is American, or one is not.


      • UpNorth says:


      • timactual says:

        ” I absolutely and entirely renounce and abjure all allegiance and fidelity to any foreign prince, potentate, state, or sovereignty,…”

        Seems pretty clear to me. If it’s required for new citizens, it should be required for all citizens.

  15. Comm Center Rat says:

    Eric Wuestenberg, who is identified on the Oakland University (MI) website as a veterans support services coordinator, also was fired.

      • Blaster says:

        I’m not a lawyer BUT, I never saw him pull a gun and I never saw him assault anyone. I did see him trying to diffuse the situation and then trying to leave. So, what if he is excused of all charges or found innocent? Does he then get to sue for wrongful termination? It seems awfully fast for action like that to take place.

        • Comm Center Rat says:

          I agree with you Blaster however, Michigan is an At-will employment state. An employee can be dismissed by an employer for any reason without having to establish “just cause” for termination. No warning is required either as long as the reason is not illegal (e.g. firing because of the employee’s race, religion or sexuality).

          • Blaster says:

            Maybe can figure a way to bring a civil case (or counter case) against the antagonist that caused this.

          • David says:

            “At Will” does not preclude wrongful termination, especially when it is due to politics unrelated to the office. Otherwise every protester could be fired by conservative bosses, and you KNOW that would not go unprotested.

            Re Lars/Commissar’s comments I rarely agree with him, defend his right to comment reasonably (excepting his ‘you’re all a f’ing bunvch of f’ing retards who don’t appreciate my f’ing genius’)despite his apparent ignorance and self-righteous obnoxiousness, but if I look at a comment section and see primarily back-and-forth between him and a few of the folks here and they are all on the level of “fuck you!” “No, fuck YOU!” … well, I am one less reader for that section. If other folks are like me, those pissy sessions cost readers, if not, well, it’s just me. I have been coming here maybe a decade (started with BlackFive till it turned into a book review site) so I guess I am somewhat long term. My $.02.

      • USMC Steve says:

        I trust he has already consulted a good shark lawyer with an eye to making himself very rich for a wrongful termination suit.

    • 11B-Mailclerk says:

      I hope he finds somewhere to work not run by cowards and fools.

  16. Poetrooper says:

    Anyone who reads here knows that I virtually never agree with Lars on anything. However the one issue I do agree with is that without him we do run the risk of becoming rather bland–an “echo chamber” as he and a couple of other lefties refer to our comments section.

    I think many here agree with me that the most despicable aspect of the Left and political correctness is their intolerance of opposing views, rendering their entire movement one huge echo chamber. We should not adapt their ways. We should always be willing to listen to their arguments even those delivered with the vitriol and disdain Lars typically employs.

    I certainly can’t speak for Ed and Admin as I have no clue what Lars is writing that they are editing out. However, until the discourse here degenerates to nothing more than all-caps “Fuck you’s” and “Fuck you, too’s,” may I humbly suggest we let let the seagull continue his squawking?

    To his advantage, Lars does reside at ground zero for leftist thinking and does provide some insight into what is currently stewing in their fevered brains, his advantage also being our advantage. He also serves as a sad yet ongoing reminder that our military services do harbor some of this radical leftist lunacy, something we should never disregard.

    Lastly, there is Lars’ huge entertainment value: with his arrogant, supercilious manner, so typical of know-it-alls on all sides, Lars provides a very large target. I confess that when I surf in to TAH, I frequently first scan the latest comments update to see if Lars has entered a string, knowing, with full certainty, that he will soon step on his crank if he hasn’t already done so. Guess where I start reading?

    I suspect I’m not the only follower of TAH guilty of such behavior. We are, after all, a largely military lot, and as such, inspired by conflict, knowing that it is always a more interesting activity than dull routine. And Lars can be guaranteed to bring conflict. The comments numbers themselves support my contention.

    And of course, the second part of the entertainment value is puncturing this arrogant gasbag, although I frequently find that by the time I’ve arrived, someone else has already done that quite capably. Personally I take more pleasure in merely needling Lars over his errors and inconsistencies than engaging him in point by point rebuttals, a largely wasted effort anyway. Saul Alinsky was right in this regard: ridicule IS an effective weapon.

    Sheez! The longest comment I’ve written in a very long while and it’s in defense of Lars’ retention. Whatever, I submit that TAH has its own “Useful Idiot” and should retain him for that utility.


    • penguinman000 says:

      I agree. I don’t think Lars should be banned.

      • Mason says:

        The only reason he grates on me is that he was banned by Jonn and as soon as the man died, Commissar came right back. Even if you believe his story that he was merely asked to leave and acquiesced so wasn’t really “banned”, he still broke his g̶e̶n̶t̶l̶e̶m̶a̶n̶’̶s̶ gentleperson’s agreement the moment the other half could no longer defend himself.

        Lars can have his opinions, but he has the annoying habit of saying he wants a conversation though never converses. He gets everyone all riled up and refuses to engage in anything but insults. LC, to his everlasting credit, does engage in a back and forth. Even when he gets ganged up on pretty heavily.

        • Ex-PH2 says:

          He’s lying. He was banned by Jonn Lilyea. He lies like a —– when he thinks he can get away with it. He was banned.

        • penguinman000 says:

          Mason-I can’t speak about what happened with previous to this.

          While I don’t care for the guy (and was shocked as hell to find out he’s a mid grade officer w/grad school) none of that should be taken into consideration for his presence on the site IMHO.

          The guy lacks self control when posting on the internet. That hardly makes him worthy of the boot.

          Then again, I’m just a spectator in the cheap seats and don’t have to be a mod/admin here.

      • MCPO USN says:

        Lars is nothing better than light amusement. Bettering him in an argument is easier than pistol-whipping a blind kid.

        It would be nice if his posts were not so full of lies, half-truths, and his belief of what is right than actual facts. His debate technique lacks skill and he resorts to name-calling. All this from the “higher mind”.

        Back to the original subject, this African-American (by the way, Africa is not a country, but a continent. How can you be from a continent but not a country?) verbalized a threat to the white man (I’ll kick your white ass too). Legally he was threatened and could defend himself from there.

        • HMCS(FMF) ret says:

          I would just wish that he’d stop dropping the “TAH/(fill in the blank) is raycissst” bullshit that he pulls out of his ass on a regular basis.

          I’d have no problems meeting up with most anyone here for a meal and drinks and some good, old fashioned talk… except Lars. He makes Archie Bunker look normal…

    • Poetrooper says:

      How about hearing from some of the rest of you? We owe it to Ed, Dave and the others who keep this site operating.

      • 5th/77th FA says:

        Poe, I use his spapos seagull dropping to fertilize my ‘mater plants, so there is that. The acid helps the ph levels.

      • 26Limabeans says:

        I don’t see any reason to ban him.
        Annoying as a yapping dog but nobody has to read his bull
        let alone respond to it.

        Powerlineblog dot com has a similiar know-it-all that
        reminds me of ours and I just skip over everything he
        has to say including the responses.
        Bet you know who I mean..

      • Toxic Deplorable Racist SAH B Woodman says:

        No. Out. Ban.
        His lies of omission AND commission, and half truths add nothing useful to any conversation, except to help certain people to not have to take their low blood pressure medication.

      • Blaster says:

        I say that I hope Commisar is reading this and seeing the grace being offers to him by most of you.

        And, by the others, I fully understand and appreciate it.

      • 11B-Mailclerk says:

        There are plenty of folks who post here that genuinely contribute to debate, to alternative points of view.

        Others are just sabotage.

        Doesn’t support the objective? Destroy it. Drive out any moderates. Make it inhospitable. Use any civility or balance or sense of fair play as a weapon.

        Everything within the objective. Nothing outside the objective. Nothing against the objective.

        Kinda familiar?

      • SteeleyI says:

        I guess it comes down to what you want this site to be. If the point is to be a safe space for a certain viewpoint, by all means ban people with different ideas.

        If, on the other hand, the point is to have a dialogue that can help create a better understanding of an issue either by forcing people to critically think about their position in order to defend it, or, as rare as it might happen, change someone’s mind, then you need dissenting opinions.

        Now, I think Lars or Commissar or whatever his name is should be respectful, follow the rules of the site, and so on.

        Having watched some of the more controversial exchanges, the typical pattern is Lars posts a dissenting opinion, one or more regulars responds with a comment that almost always includes a personal attack, and after a while it just becomes sort of a contest to see who can come up with the most creative way to insult him.

        Typically it is not very creative, and while a good flame war can be entertaining, it gets boring fast.

        I don’t agree with much of what he has to say, but I think you should allow him to say it.

        • USMC Steve says:

          If Lars actually contributed a valid and useful viewpoint, and not his leftist propaganda, he would add value here. A commissioned officer being openly contemptuous to the President contributes nothing, has no honor, and is in open violation to the UCMJ. I can post on one hand the times he has actually said something valid, useful, or relevant, unless I missed one.

      • The Other Whitey says:

        Not my blog, not my call. I agree with your basic premise, but find that LC is a far better and more respectable dissenting voice. Lars is an annoying know-it-all douchebag.

        • SFC D says:

          This. I can disagree with LC and still respect him and his views. I even learn something sometimes. The Commissar, not so much. Actually, not at all.

        • Poetrooper says:

          Yeah but even LC has that tendency to condescend.

          And as I’ve previously discussed with SteeleyI, folks tend to be much more receptive to the points you’re making when you don’t talk down to them. You have a much better chance of bringing people to your point of view if you don’t insist on contemptuously pointing out how ignorant they are on a given topic, which happens to be a favored form of liberal discourse.

          BTW, Steeley, I know you don’t really give a rat’s ass, but I happen to agree with you on this comment as well. It’s been happening so frequently lately I’m beginning to feel a tad embarrassed.

          My, my, I do believe ol’ Poe may be gettin’ hisself a case of the vapors…

    • Ex-PH2 says:

      If you think it is appropriate for someone like Lars to make personal remarks that indicate how much he despises someone who doesn’t knuckle under to him, which is what he has been to me and several other people since at least 2016, then I completely disagree with you.

      Having a difference of opinion does NOT require vitriolic responses, nor is it appropriate to indicate that you disagree with someone else’s point of view by using abusive language, which Taylor has done repeatedly. He has trashed every post I’ve made since 2016, lies about checking the references I’ve provided as backup, vilifies me and other people which is neither appropriate nor necessary.

      You can disagree with someone’s point of view without using foul language and despicably bad manners. There is plenty of room for discussion on all subjects. There is ZERO room for abuse, period.

      I do not know why you’d think his behavior is appropriate, when it includes twisting a blog post to focus all attention on himself and responding abusively when he’s told repeatedly that he is incorrect, and makes it clear that he refuses to accept any point of view that does not agree with his.

      He only shows up so that he can pick a fight with someone and make nasty remarks. He’s nothing but a cheap, self-centered bully.

      • Toxic Deplorable Racist SAH B Woodman says:

        Preach it, Sistah!

      • Poetrooper says:

        Ex, as I said, I have no idea what is being edited out of Lars’ posts. From what I’ve read in the comments, I’d have to say you’re no shrinking violet when it comes to responding to Lars–you give it back to him every bit as he goes after you.

        As for Lars’ vitriol, I’d say that flies both ways as well from many here. He even inspires me to anger and profanity on occasion, but that is usually in response to his smarmy condescension rather than his vitriol. It’s his arrogance that I find more irritating than any profanity he might direct my way.

        And I did not say his personal attacks are appropriate–but neither do I think they are so over the top they are banworthy. Banning Lars will have a negative impact on reader participation in the site. One only has to compare the length and content of comment strings on articles where Lars enters the fray and where he doesn’t.

        Banning is not a procedure I like because it carries the connotation of intolerance of others’ views. If Lar’s is guilty of truly vile behavior rather than the usual childish pap of the left, then how about Admin sharing that with us? We’re big boys and girls here and can handle the heat. We can also revise our opinions if that’s called for. I will gladly post my mea culpa.

        Sorry if I upset you and you do appear to be…that is certainly not my intent. I am simply offering my opinion that banning Lars is not a wise move for the reasons I have cited. I truly value your presence at and your support of TAH…you help to make it what it is.

        • Ex-PH2 says:

          Thank you for your considerate response, Poe. I ain’t leaving, not nohow. I did, after all, put up with Wickerbill (see Hack Stone for reference) and got sued by Bernath for no reason other than to get cash out of me, and Bernath is pushing up the poison ivy. 🙂

          As others have observed, Taylor seems to think he outclasses/out ranks everyone here and tries to rub our noses in it, which does not work with anyone. People who post here are entitled to have opposing views. Bullying other commenters and changing the subject of a post to yourself is not acceptable.

          Furthermore, Taylor has been told more than once that if he disagrees with what is said/posted here, he can start his own blog for nothing through an assortment of free sites. He’s just too lazy to do that and will not get the attention he craves if he’s got to do all the work himself.

          Ergo, he will only do what gets the attention he so desperately craves.

        • OWB says:

          When you and he are the only ones left, Poe, I can only hope that you enjoy yourselves. It is only a matter of time until he runs off every last one of the original “family” here who simply no longer find it worth their while to wade through and around the crap being spewed both by him and the responses to him.

          Not sure that any of us shrink from arguing with those with whom we do not agree. Been doing it a very long time myself. It seems like only a few years ago that we could have good friends from across the political spectrum and enjoy each others company. No longer. This past election turned the last couple of lefty friends I had into raving lunatics.

          PH has ignored most of his personal attacks, at least she did when I was still reading some of his nonsense. There is no justification for his behavior and we should not be required to tolerate it.

          I remain firm in that I don’t much care how one thinks politically and will listen to even the most wacked out views on just about anything. But, if you insist upon behaving badly I refuse to remain engaged even if it appears we might agree on most things.

          So, I refuse to try to read the rambling of anyone who behaves badly. I would be much happier if we had more folks around here of the left persuasion. They have for the most part, excluded themselves from civil discourse not for their political views but because they refuse to act civilly. Of course, they blame their bad behavior on us, but it is really their choice.

          • Poetrooper says:

            OWB, you’re doing the right thing–if Lars irritates you, ignore him. However, looking at the number of comments in this string, I don’t think there’s any danger of this becoming “mano a mano” between the seagull and me anytime soon. I will confess to enjoying taking potshots at Mr. Pomposity–it’s a bit like the satisfaction one gets from punching a bully in the mouth.

            As for bad behavior, if you ban because of that, we’ll never get the far-left point of view–for them bad behavior is a step up from their usual. It’s the way they were raised and educated.

            • 11B-Mailclerk says:

              He drives out the civil lefties by getting them dogpiled.

              Note the abuse heaped on LC. Wrongly.

              That is an objective. Radicalize.

              Don’t believe for a minute that the behavior is inadvertent or just a lack of control. It sure looks like deliberate Marxist agitation, and it sure looks aimed at damage. Nothing may exist that opposes the movement. All opposition is “fascist” and to be destroyed.

              He couldn’t be doing the Marxist playbook better if he was a scripted sockpuppet bot.

              • HMCS(FMF) ret says:

                “Rules for Radicals”… he probably sleeps with it under his pillow every night.

      • thebesig says:

        Believe it or not, Lars has been posting here since the summer of 2014. He came out swinging later that year.

        • Mason says:

          Six years of reading and posting on a site you think is filled with despicable people you don’t respect and openly hate.

          You can at least admire his dogged determination. Here’s a good video that describes what it must be like for Lars.

        • A Proud infidel®­™ says:

          I also wonder if Lars aka Major Moonbat doesn’t try to show off what he posts here to his fellow moonbat cultists in a search for appreciation and gratification as well as wallowing in ANY attention he can get? I also remember Jonn posting that he had been banned form here before he passed.

    • OldManchu says:

      Lars dates Asian women.

    • timactual says:


      (See how cool I am?)

  17. Toxic Deplorable Racist SAH B Woodman says:

    To get back to the original topic, conservatives need to adapt a new tactic……when someone whips out a cell phone and starts recording, need to take the phone away and “dispose” of it (if possible). No phone, no recording, no believable rant/complaint.
    What? Me? Take your phone? I don’t have it. Why are you blaming me because you lost your phone?

    • Ex-PH2 says:

      Or, how about when starts the abusive stuff, you pull out your own and ask “Shall I call the police?”
      See, that way, a dispute can be settled very quickly.

      I’ve looked at that vide oseveral times now. There are two sides to it.

      The white gal was trying to avoid a confrontation in the beginning, but there are things she could have done to stop it before it started, by not getting into a dustup in the Chipotle restaurant.

      Pulling a gun on someone doesn’t work nearly as well as pulling out the phone and saying bluntly and loudly “Shall I call the police?” especially if someone else is recording what’s going on.

      The mom w/kid appears to be spoiling for a fight, which means that confrontational behavior is not a good idea as a defense for her, either.

      It’s about which one has the bigger bone to pick, and since there’s no video of what happened in the restaurant, there is no valid way to figure out who started what. And that’s the real problem. Everybody in that video needs counseling, preferably in a group, and the mom needs to get the chip off her shoulder.

    • 26Limabeans says:

      In Viet of the Nam, pointing a camera at a some Vietnamese
      would scare them. They believed you were taking something
      spiritual from them.

  18. Skyjumper says:

    Lars does not mean squat to me, plain & simple.

    He fancies himself as an intellectual whose word on any subject matter is final & correct and no one else’s opinion matters. That is typical of an egotistical person whose mantra is “I’m always right and everyone else is always wrong”.

    He’s also an unabashed agitator. He waltzes into this blog, tosses out his vast empirical knowledge (sarc), without data or evidence and then derives great pleasure, as he leans back in his chair, at all of the ensuing commotion in response. Again, a typical egotistical, self-centered person’s actions. He thrives on the discontent he causes. Take that away, and he becomes nothing…meaningless.

    As for his military service, plain & simple, he served (or maybe I should say self-serving).
    In my experience, he was and is a “ticket puncher”. I’ve run into these individuals more than a number of times during my career. He cares more about acquiring “bling” in any manner possible and puts that above his soldiers needs.
    I have no use for anyone of his ilk.
    Lars is still pissed about never receiving a CAB.

    As for banning him here at TAH? I’ll leave that in the very wise & capable hands of Dave Hardin, AW1Ed and all of the others tasked to keep this blog going in the direction that the original creator (Jonn Lilyea) designed it for. I know that they will make the correct decision.

    And yes Lars , Jonn DID ban you!!
    You Lars are a COWARD for coming back here after Jonn’s passing saying you were just asked to leave.

    I know more about you than you think.

    I don’t normally get involved with this type of discussion, but I felt the personal need to get involved this time. I’m not known for being “wordy”, but I’m making an exception here this time because I have been a follower of this blog for quite some time and enjoy the good nature bantering, camaraderie, humor (and recipes) and for other reasons.

    In closing, why don’t you Lars continue to play “dress up”…it seems to suit you better.

    All hat……no cattle.

    • Sapper3307 says:

      That’s not dress up,its Monday.

    • A Proud Infidel®™ says:

      I see Lars as the empty horse-drawn wagon rambling down a dirt road and legend has it that the empty wagons make the most noise!

      I myself look as his rambles and rants as a window into how the left operates and IMHO it’s much like a religious cult where those who even remotely dissent with the groupthink, dogma and mantras are singled out and rampaged on! Yes, IMHO Lars or Major Moonbat as I call him, is a brainwashed cultist!

  19. Sapper3307 says:

    That’s not a women , that’s BT-800 and its BT-1100 fatherless offspring.

  20. SgtM says:

    Lars is quick to throw out what he has supposedly done in the past. When you do it he denigrates it and says ‘what does that have to do with anything”. I have written a couple of long nice posts to him. He ignored them.

    • Ex-PH2 says:

      I’m guessing, SgtM, but it may be legitimate to say that almost everyone who posts comments here has done more in the past, distant and recent both, than he’s done in his entire life.

      Having a lengthy military career is fine if that’s what you want. But not staying in it forever and doing other things with your life are just as valid as 20 years on AD/Reservces/etc.

      Bluntly, you don’t have to spend a full career in any branch of the service to have a worthwhile career in something else.

    • A Proud Infidel®™ says:

      That and he likes to insult others’ past service with his ASS-umptions like his saying I was some substandard type. Yeah, I have plenty of former CO’s, 1SG’s and CSMs that would tell him otherwise!

  21. Bill R. says:

    Although I cannot know what happened before the young woman began recording on her cell phone, it looks to me that the White woman was trying to retreat the entire time. The Black lady just wouldn’t let it go. The last straw was the Black lady beating on the car. I don’t know if people expected a fistfight or what but the White woman is pregnant and rightfully in fear for her life. FYI, Michigan has a Stand Your Ground Law and the White woman had no duty to retreat, but she did anyway.